At the end of my rope?
 

alright, I will start by saying I have an 02 Trans am, M6, full bolt ons, and torquer 2. I wrote about this a little over a year ago when I did my cam swap. I had no problems before the swap, once the swap was complete I kept ( and KEEP ) throwing a map code. It wouldn't stay running if I was coming to a stop from driving, like to a stop light or stop sign. I wouldn't have any problems while driving, just coming back down from speed to a stop, and at idle. Now all I changed was the valve springs and seals, and obv the cam ( pushrods ). I never removed the intake, or touched any of the lines. Now when I wrote back then, everyone and myself came to the conclusion that I ethier had a vaccum leak or it was just in need of a tune. I checked then and just the other day ( not to metion the hundreds of times in between ) and i do not have any vac leaks from any of the lines. The only vac leak I can figure is maybe one of the seals didnt seat all the way. Well I went to get it tuned, and the tuner said becuase he couldnt tune it cause the map code, it wasn't giving him a steady idle so he couldn't get the proper readings. well he put in what he thought was a tune to just make it drivable. Well I just recently return from Iraq and I have a set of AFR 205 heads, FAST 92/92, to add to this, then retun from another tuner. Now my question is well 1, does anyone have any clue what it could be. 2, could it be not that I have a vac leak, that i need a vaccum canister because of the cam. I just do not want to get to the tuner again and have spent all this money and still have an undrivable car.

Oh and I will ad if i let it sit and idle for a min for the car to find itself, it will idle just fine which confuses me because if I had a vac leak, it would continously have the idel lope. but when you come to a stop you have to keep tapping the gas until it " finds itself "

Any help is def def appricated!!!

You don't have a ported TB do you? If so there might be a possibility that the TB blade isn't closing all of the way and the car is having trouble with idle.

I'm subscribing to this thread as I have the same problem but am swapping out my ported TB this week and going back to stock. I don't have any vacuum leaks either. Good Luck!

no, didnt touch it or the maf, or at that the map. It recently starting running unbelivably rich. and i did nothing to it, so i threw on the fast 92 intake with a big mouth 92 mm throttle body hoping to lean it out. it did lean it a little bit, but didnt fix the origanl problem. I am at my witts end.

First off, you need to find another tuner.

The first thing he should have done, was tweak the P0106 code tables. Every cammed car needs these tables adjusted.

Second, it's not going to give a "steady idle" that's what the tuning is for. Once you adjust the tables to get rid if the code, then get your idle timing straight, then the A/F (MAF/VE tables) then the idle will straighten out.

You need values changed in the engine diagnostic part of the calibration to keep from setting the MAP code with the cam. It has to be done with all large cam tuning. There is not a vacuum leak or problem with the MAP sensor. The diagnostics are just set up for MAP readings with a stock cam. You also need proper idle tuning done to keep it from dying when coming to a stop.

Ed, you obviously type faster than I do.

LOL beat ya to it.........:D

WOW.
I`m "cammed", along with a few other things and have never had this
MIL trip and, it has always been enabled.

Maybe you need a new MAP sensor?

I didn't say disable it, there are tables to adjust the sensitivity. Some years they were set more sensitive than others.

When I first started tuning on mine, I got the same code a few times. Don't know why but once I was able to get the tune in the ballpark the code went away and hasn't returned.

The idle issues sound typical for a cammed car in need of more tuning. Idle hunt is a very common issue. I have been able to get rid of 90% of mine by playing with the fueling, spark, and learning tables. But it took me a long time since this is the first one I've done. This isn't something that will be fixed on a dyno. It takes driving time and data logging, and from my experience, alot of trial and error. Mine actually behaves much better without the MAF also.

well the tuner thought that it was the map too, so i got another one and put it in. now keep in mind i never touched it during the cam install or any related lines. when I say the idle isnt consistent. i mean it can vary anywhere from normal, to irractic, stall, or all three at once. This is normal from needing a tune. Another thing that confuses me, is miy buddy put the same exact cam in his ss, now it was a 98 thats the only place we differ, and i have a 112 lsa he had 113. but his car never did this, and ran great even without a tune ( not saying tune wasnt needed ) but to some it would seem like it was.

It's possible you have a mechanical issue contributing to the problem, but from my experience what you describe is not unusual. It is odd that your friend's car ran better untuned with a very similar cam. He has slightly less overlap which could explain a little but there shouldn't be that much difference with 1 degree. I know the pcm's in 98s are slightly different but not sure exactly how. Ultimately each car reacts to mods slightly different though.

For a while I had a problem where mine would surge/hunt for idle when coming to a stop. Mine is an A4 so this was a real problem. At it's worse, it would never recover and keep swinging higher to the point where I would have to put it in nuetral and rev it up. Everyone probably thought I was the biggest redneck ever at the stop light. Some very minor tweaks to the learning and correction tables was all it needed. It's still a little tempermental when cold, but once warmed up, coming to stop the idle settles right down and doesn't hunt or surge at all.

i dont think its a mech prob, it ran perfectly fine until right after the install. There no way something else broke at the same time, and i checked everything i messed with a million times over and its not that. I guess it sounds like I have to throw myself at the mercy of another tuner and hope I dont strike out!

My bad, :emb:
P0106 is A MIL did you mean C3003,C3004,C5501,C5502,C6301,C6302 ect.:confused:
if those have an effect on idle, it is certainly something to look into.

instead of just believing one tuner...do it like u would on yourself if you were sick...get a second opinion from another doctor lol...it should be able to be tuned out if you dont have something mechanically wrong.

So everyone seems to be together on its just in need of a tune. But a little side question, would a vacuum cansiter beniefit me at all in the situation, or just a waste of money?

3003, 3004. It doesn't have an effect on the WAY it idles, but in alot of cammed cars the tables need adjusting because of the effect the cams have on the manifold vacuum @ idle. You tweak the tables so it doesn't set the P0106.

Waste of money.

This is the grand kunumdrum that plauges this whole forum / thread. Is it physical or the tune? Without literally being in front of your car with all diagnositic capabilities at my disposal-most importantly, the most expensive, sight, ears and touch-let alone scan tools etc. you are left with internet guessing.

One thing you should be wary of as a consumer is if a shop/tuner does not differentiate the work between "tuning" and trouble-shooting your car. It really is two different maintenance actions and in this day and age of the internet where oceans of information-good and bad are at your fingertips, consumers are given confidence to tackle jobs that in the past they would never think of doing themselves.

That is not to say the net is full of crap and folks can't do their own work-it's just experience. Take the work you have done to a shop and expect them to just "tune" it and be done is not realistic. If the shop was not a part of the selection and installation of the parts- you can't hold them liable for that.

Amazing things can be done with tuning but if there is something wrong with the setup then a remedy has to be made in a timely matter-that effort has to be compensated.

A professional shop that has "been there, done that" in this modern age of having sophisticated customers that are capable of installing parts, looking for tuning has to have pricing solutions ready that will benefit both the customer and rightly compensate the shop for their services.

From what I read P0106 codes are very common in cammed cars, I'm just curious - say in HPTuners for example - which tables specifically need to be adjusted to work out the issues causing the P0106 to be thrown?

Ed?