Siemens 60's idle issues, any advice?
 

I've got Siemens Deka 60's in my turbo Camaro. We are having some difficulty getting the idle for these injectors right. It's idling at about an 11.0AFR when completely warm right now. Decell also seems rich but cruising and in boost are pretty spot on.

Would anyone be willing to let me see what their 60's settings are for idle? Or at least lead me in the right direction possibly?

Ditto on this. I have this same issue. I'm a little unsure as well. Idk why injector data is all hush hush

Post up your tune and people will tell you where to look.

Curious on this too, I've been looking at ways of increasing gas mileage.

Chances are your minimum pulse width isn't low enough (obviously). On a turbo 5.3 with 80# injectors I had to monkey around with the voltage adjustment to bring the pulse width down to a reasonable level.

This was with using the correct "Banish" injector data. Hopefully you are starting with good injector data. It goes a long way toward getting things right. You still may have to fiddle with it though.

You'll need to go back and re-touch the VE after you've played around with the injector tables.

Hope this helps :cheers:

This is the first car i've ever had where the injector data was so secretive... it boggles my mind why it's such a closely held secret.

With that being said though I am using the data from Greg Banish. But I know my injector PW is too high as it is at a 1.8-1.9ms right now but I just am not sure how to get it to go lower. I really don't feel comfortable enough to just go into the offset table, pulse adder, and min inj pw tables and mess around with all of those numbers without truly knowing what they all do or the result.

I'm def not looking for anyone to give me a free tune or anything just looking for some injector data that will help me get the car to idle at least somewhere near stoich.

Don't be afraid of it. If your min inj pulsewidth is set to something lower than the 1.8ms that you are seeing then something is keeping you from getting there. If you pull the VE table way down and still can't get there then it's time to "massage" an injector table or two within your idle region.

Unfortunately, it seems that the "correct" injector data doesn't get you all the way there. It's a good start though.

If someone knows a better way to do this I'm all ears.

You just have to mess with the tables listed abover. I've never read or seen the Banish book and get them to idle just fine.

Drop the minimum injector table alot and see what happens.

At this point I have no control via my VE tables down low, changes literally do nothing so I figured I needed to get my pulsewidth down lower but just wasn't sure how to achieve that easily.

If I get the PW to come down will that require me to rework my entire VE table or just the idle sections?

Speaking in EFILive terms, I would log battery voltage and manifold vacuum to see where the car is idling. Then go into the Injector Pulse Width Voltage Adjustment table and modify those cells. Once you're seeing a PW and AFR that you like I would blend it out a little into the surrounding cells.

Then go back and re-touch the VE in that area.

There's the normal minimum pulsewidth tables we're all used to seeing and then recently (in the last year or two), a few of the guys over on the EFI forums discovered another min. transient pw table that wasn't originally unlocked in the LS1 PCMs. We've been able to add it to the software through some .cax files, which allows for adjustment now. Basically, there's some situations (including idle) that activate this "transient" mode. Once I was able to reduce this value, my rich idle was gone. Definitely a lot better than fudging the other tables like I had to do in the past only to find inconsistent results. Check this thread out...

http://forum.efilive.com/showthread....ight=rich+idle

I'm using HPTuners here but it sounds like both programs are pretty close. I have changed my min transient table down to a .001 or something like that and it really hasn't had any effect on my idle or PW.

Are you 100% sure the injectors are the cause of the idle issues?

I have to agree with everyone else here, I have seen our tuners send out email tunes for these injectors on GMs, HEMIs and Ferds and the car idles like a champ 99% of the time. Even if the scaling is off a bit, there were never any idle 'issues'...

To reiterate if you do not post a log or your tune, its hard to help in the way in which you want all of us to do.....

There are a few ways to clean up idle issues, First off are you SD or MAF?

I'm pretty positive the idle issues are the result of the injectors. From what I have seen and heard the Siemens 60's are difficult to get just right without playing around with all of the pulsewidth tables to get it down to something they like. The issue I am having is I simply don't know enough about the tables to know how much to change where other than to just start hacking away and I would really rather not go that route.

I would post the tune but I paid for the tune and honestly do not feel right just posting it up publically. I understand that might hinder how much some can help but I just don't think it's right to post up someone else's work.

The car is running a 2Bar SD tune in open loop.

Then VE is your friend...But as said, with out seeing your file no one can really tell you what to do only that the problem lies within your VE tables,and possibly your IFR. You don't want to post some else tune, that's up to you. But its not like this is a top secret tune that many of us have not done ourselves. Don't know what to tell you...

Where are you seeing this information?

You have a thread full of people here, who have actually tuned vehicles with these injectors, telling you that there are no such issues...sounds like maybe your tuner needs some help. I bet he's the one telling you they are difficult to get right???

dude saw your message a little while ago, pm me your email I got something for you to try.

Above is the answer...

The table is B9021 Minimum pulsewidth - EFILive defines it as: "Minimum injector pulsewidth during transient conditions. This table has been shown to limit the minimum pulsewidth in some operating systems."

Don't know if HPTuners has this table available or not - check with some of the experts - maybe over on their forum...

I have personally seen this table limit the minimum pulsewidth at idle with 60# injectors numerous times... it will not go below 1.8 ms no matter how much you cut the VE table down...

If you can get someone in your area to pull your tune out with EFILive an post it up here or email it to me, I will fix it for you and repost/resend it.