StolenFox

Is it possible to take a truck PCM and flash a completely different program (like 2004 GTO, C5 Vette) so it is now a "car" pcm? Apparently I cannot use this setup for my BMW swap here in Colorado because you can't put a truck engine in a car. My stand alone harness is built and works great but now I have to change it to a car setup along with adding back in the rear O2's, fuel tank pressure sensor and the charcoal canister vent.

Would I be better off selling my harness and flashed PCM and start over?

Thanks!
S.F.

2xLS1

iTrader: (25)

What are they looking at to determine car or truck? Just the VIN in the PCM? And what you are asking doesn't make a lot of sense because both cars and trucks have rear O2's, fuel tank pressure sensor and the charcoal canister vent

StolenFox

When scanned the PCM has to display the VIN and original OS for a car. I'm sorry if I didn't make it clear but yes, I understand that both cars and trucks are so equipped. What I meant was in addition to changing the VIN and OS that I've got to add that equipment to my harness.

S.F.

kevin87turbot

iTrader: (2)

The 2003 PCM is peculiar. It was a one year only... if you have the 12576106. If you get a 2004 model PCM...a 12586243 will work nicely. Are you going to use the DBW truck TB? If so, you could use the base tune from a CTS-V or Vette. If you are going to use a cable drive TB, then use the base tune from a GTO. You should be able to use your harness with no issues.

StolenFox

I'm currently running the PCM, TAC module and DBW throttle body from the 03 Yukon. It's on the run stand and working beautifully. How do I determine what number PCM I have? Is it on a label on the PCM itself?

Thanks!
S.F.

2xLS1

iTrader: (25)

There should be a label with a Service Number and a Hardware Number.

Tuner Cat and I think EFI Live can put any VIN# in the PCM you are using without changing anything else. HP Tuners won't let you create the mismatch but the newer versions will supposedly let you license a mismatch after it's been created. So you are saying the VIN in the PCM doesn't have to match the VIN on the car? Strange. That is not what emission testing usually requires. And with proper tuning you can make all those other emission systems show readiness completed without them being on the vehicle. Unless they need to be there to pass a visual inspection.

StolenFox

Out here in Colorado, the processs is much more strict. Normal emissions testing is done using a established drive cycle on a Dyno while a wideband O2 the size of a refrigerator is analyzing the exhaust. Before you can even try that, engine swap vehicles have to go to the emissions tech center (division of the CO. EPA) and get a compliance inspection. They check that all emissions components are in place and functioning both visual and electronically. For the purposes of that inspection, the PCM has to be running a unaltered tune in that no power enhancements or emissions defeats can be in place. The inspector I spoke with (nice guy but very serious about his work) said they can tell if the PCM has been flashed by checking the BIN number (I think he said bin). What's a BIN number? I told him the PCM would have to be programmed for the Anti theft removal and the 4L80e swap and he said that would be ok.

S.F.

2xLS1

iTrader: (25)

What a pain in the ***. How did you ever legalize pot in your state. He probably said CVN not BIN. (Calibration Verification Number)

StolenFox

Beats me. As a business manager, that's a whole other nightmare....

My PCM number is



What are my options for this PCM and how does someone check the CVN?

Thank you,
S.F.

2xLS1

iTrader: (25)

That is an 03 PCM. And I can't think of any 03 cars that use that PCM. 03 Vettes still used the 0411 pcm. You could flash that PCM with some 04 car calibrations like a 04 GTO or a 04 Vette, but will your smog ***** allow that kind of mismatch. The wrong PCM # for the vehicle calibration that is in it. The harness would work the same, but I'm guessing you are using a truck DBW throttle body so that leaves the Vette or a 04 Caddy CTS as options but I don't know if the car calibrations are compatible with the truck DBW TB. The 04 GTO is DBC.

And some scan tools will display CVNs. there are several individual segments in the PCM calibration that have their own CVN numbers. Those CVN numbers typically get changed if the data in the segment gets changed.

StolenFox

I'm not opposed to buying another PCM and going DBC on the throttle body. If I bought this:

[non-sponsor link removed]

Would it have the correct CVN number vs PCM number vs VIN in order to satisfy the emissions tech? It would be programmed with a 2004 GTO VIN that I provide so I should be good, no?

Thanks!
S.F.

joecar

I'm curious how they cross check the CVN (do they have a database of OS id's and CVN's... if so, which one (CARB's...?), who maintains it, and since when...?).

2xLS1

iTrader: (25)

Well the 4L80 swap with a GTO OS is going to be a problem since I don't think that OS was never offered with one. And if it can be done that is going to screw with what they show for correct CVNs for a 04 GTO big time. Hard to believe they are going to be OK with that and so strict with everything else. Who is going to be programming it?

StolenFox

Im not sure who I would have do the programming. Brendan @ lt1swap took care of the current PCM.

I wonder about using a 4L80e conversion harness like this: [non-sponsor link removed]

Wouldn't that eliminate the need for any transmission related programming?

S.F.

joecar

That will eliminate having to do the trans segment swap, but because the 4L80E has different gear ratios than the 4L60E some editing of the shift points is needed.

StolenFox

Back to the top after a long break!

So now that the engine is in the car, transmission is built and I'm getting closer to having to deal with the emissions tech center I need to find a solution to which PCM to use. Here's the requirements:

Must be a car pcm.
Must have the correct service number pcm for OS
Must have a car VIN that matches the OS and Service number.
All LS emissions hardware must be installed and functional.
Cannot have been originally equipped with smog pump or EGR.
Transmission is irrelevant as I'm going to run a standalone controller.
Basically cannot be "messed with" other than security disabled.

Can be DBW or DBC. Engine is currently setup as DBW with truck throttle body, TAC module and pedal (pedal is not mounted in car). I do have the wiring needed to switch over the DBC. Car is originally a DBC car so it would probably be easier than mounting the electric pedal.

Engine is a gen 4 6.0L but setup for 24x with the knock sensors relocated to the sides (drilled and tapped to fit Gen 3 knock sensors) but I could convert back to 58x if I had to.

04 GTO would probably be easiest since the harness is the same as the modified truck harness I'm using but I don't know how to deal with the fact that the GTO uses the BCM for low speed cooling fan and A/C control. I suppose the 04 GTO processor could be used "as-is" until I get through the tech inspection and then segment swapped for e-fans and A/C control. Is that type of segment change possible?

I welcome your opinions on how to handle this correctly.

S.F.

LSX Power Tuning

iTrader: (4)

You can look the CVN's up off the VIN through TIS from GM.

joecar

I was speaking of his state-administered smog test, I would think they don't lookup TIS...

I know that from 2006 onward CARB has a database of OS/CVN/VIN... I don't know that CA uses it (yet).

StolenFox

The normal emissions test center won't but I can't get near that place until I've got the blessings (and CO EPA form) from the emissions tech center. Swap vehicles here have to get inspected at the tech center, pass that and they put you in the computer and give you the form. That allows you to get a normal inspection thereafter.

S.F.

joecar

Ok, I see, your vehicle has to be inspected by the referee...