How far can a 4th gen go?
09-08-2010, 08:02 PM
#1
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How far can a 4th gen go? If you take a 4th gen fbody, and have to be able to still drive it daily...what suspension modifications can you do and how far will that take you...for example if you are comparing capability with other production cars...how would you fit in? This car is a 3450lb Camaro SS with 450+rwhp (we hope anyway, should dyno tomorrow, so base your suggestions on that fact), I have koni single adj, and will be swapping out to strano springs soon, along with strano sways....has UMI road race k member, 3 pt SFC, adj panhard, LCA with rotojoints...
I realize that for the track, I would have to run a dedicated set of wheels/tires, that are setup for road race (so plan on that)...brakes are stock ls1 with crossdrilled rotors (i plan to set up to stainless lines) but suggestions here would be helpful.
Put all this together and even with the solid rear axle, how far can you take a 4th gen when comparing to Gt500, corvette, porsche, etc?
Thanks guys, long time drag race type guy, but haven't done any road race, and only limited auto x...thoughts/idea's greatly appreciated!
I realize that for the track, I would have to run a dedicated set of wheels/tires, that are setup for road race (so plan on that)...brakes are stock ls1 with crossdrilled rotors (i plan to set up to stainless lines) but suggestions here would be helpful.
Put all this together and even with the solid rear axle, how far can you take a 4th gen when comparing to Gt500, corvette, porsche, etc?
Thanks guys, long time drag race type guy, but haven't done any road race, and only limited auto x...thoughts/idea's greatly appreciated!
09-09-2010, 12:44 AM
#2
You'll do a lot better with solid blank rotors.
Just regular old replacement hold up better for me.
You description is pretty much my car.
Except all rod ended suspension & a watts link w/ a 12 bolt 4.10's.
If your planning on doing some HPDE's just run some decent performance tires * learn the car= lots of seat time.
Then start putting some race tires on if thats what you meant.
Definitely have a disadvantage to IRS cars, but nothing easy!
I like running the F-car.
Just regular old replacement hold up better for me.
You description is pretty much my car.
Except all rod ended suspension & a watts link w/ a 12 bolt 4.10's.
If your planning on doing some HPDE's just run some decent performance tires * learn the car= lots of seat time.
Then start putting some race tires on if thats what you meant.
Definitely have a disadvantage to IRS cars, but nothing easy!
I like running the F-car.
Last edited by wrencher; 09-09-2010 at 12:49 AM.
09-09-2010, 06:46 AM
#3
You are entering a different world. A world where speed on track is developed while sitting in the seat and not throwing the Visa card at the car.
A common mistake made is that folks think you must generate a certain mod list in order to reduce lap times.
In drag racing, that is mostly a true statement.
On a road course, a Spec Miata with a seasoned, talented driver, can hand a rookie C5 driver his ***. Many get disocouraged when something like this happens.
For a new guy, learning the track AND learning the car AND learning yourself can be sensory overload.
A stock 4th Gen is a very capable car in the hands of said seasoned driver.
A common mistake made is that folks think you must generate a certain mod list in order to reduce lap times.
In drag racing, that is mostly a true statement.
On a road course, a Spec Miata with a seasoned, talented driver, can hand a rookie C5 driver his ***. Many get disocouraged when something like this happens.
For a new guy, learning the track AND learning the car AND learning yourself can be sensory overload.
A stock 4th Gen is a very capable car in the hands of said seasoned driver.
09-09-2010, 09:17 AM
#4
You are entering a different world. A world where speed on track is developed while sitting in the seat and not throwing the Visa card at the car.
A common mistake made is that folks think you must generate a certain mod list in order to reduce lap times.
In drag racing, that is mostly a true statement.
On a road course, a Spec Miata with a seasoned, talented driver, can hand a rookie C5 driver his ***. Many get disocouraged when something like this happens.
For a new guy, learning the track AND learning the car AND learning yourself can be sensory overload.
A stock 4th Gen is a very capable car in the hands of said seasoned driver.
A common mistake made is that folks think you must generate a certain mod list in order to reduce lap times.
In drag racing, that is mostly a true statement.
On a road course, a Spec Miata with a seasoned, talented driver, can hand a rookie C5 driver his ***. Many get disocouraged when something like this happens.
For a new guy, learning the track AND learning the car AND learning yourself can be sensory overload.
A stock 4th Gen is a very capable car in the hands of said seasoned driver.
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09-09-2010, 12:15 PM
#8
Or show up at a BMW event and classified because its a "drag car".
Then all the other driver are complaining to the race marshall that thoose drag cars are harrassing me in the turns.
Glenn and I made a pair of Mini-Cooper S owners pack up and go home.
They were on a Sunday drive and we were trying to get our competition license. On a 3.1 mile track and in a 30 minute session we would lap them at least twice.
And when I first started out, I was lapped by a Mini CooperS ...
Then all the other driver are complaining to the race marshall that thoose drag cars are harrassing me in the turns.
Glenn and I made a pair of Mini-Cooper S owners pack up and go home.
They were on a Sunday drive and we were trying to get our competition license. On a 3.1 mile track and in a 30 minute session we would lap them at least twice.
And when I first started out, I was lapped by a Mini CooperS ...
09-09-2010, 02:43 PM
#9
If your're targeting HPDE track day events, then it really doesn't matter what you're running outside of a few basic things. As posted, get to know the car and the track. You can't do much if you are chasing the car and the track all at the same time. Don't measure yourself against other drivers and cars, as skill level at these events varies greatly; just race the track. Beating out other drivers/cars will come with experience.
Andy1
Andy1
09-09-2010, 04:14 PM
#10
Or show up at a BMW event and classified because its a "drag car".
Then all the other driver are complaining to the race marshall that thoose drag cars are harrassing me in the turns.
Glenn and I made a pair of Mini-Cooper S owners pack up and go home.
They were on a Sunday drive and we were trying to get our competition license. On a 3.1 mile track and in a 30 minute session we would lap them at least twice.
And when I first started out, I was lapped by a Mini CooperS ...
Then all the other driver are complaining to the race marshall that thoose drag cars are harrassing me in the turns.
Glenn and I made a pair of Mini-Cooper S owners pack up and go home.
They were on a Sunday drive and we were trying to get our competition license. On a 3.1 mile track and in a 30 minute session we would lap them at least twice.
And when I first started out, I was lapped by a Mini CooperS ...
nice! I actually pissed off a P-car driver at that same event this year I saw him coming very fast (in a beginner point by group..i signed up late) and watched him over take a couple cars behind me in bad areas; no biggy, beginners tend to point by in bad areas not knowing better..but smart drivers don't take those point bys... I saw him coming onto me at turn 3/3a and 4 at Sears Point, and then out of no where he tries dive bombing me at turn 4. I may have saw him doing that, and may have turned in a little early, causing him to run up/over the curb at 4 and off track (not a good place to go over a curb, good little drop off that 95% of cars would bottom out on the curbing). :o he passed me a couple corners later putting a couple wheels off track, off line, etc etc..he thought he was hot ****. My slow time in the Corvette is a :51 there, he was doing :54's. I told him and the guys in charge if he wants to race i'll bring my corvette next time and he can dive bomb me in corners all he wants 
That's okay, to this day, my out laps in practice and qual sessions are slow that miata's get backed up behind me. I go just fast enough to make it hard for them to pass, and just slow enough i get good gaps in front of me and i **** them off behind me since my car is very "wide" on those laps
nothing pisses me off more though than a miata going 12/10's on a warmup lap and they pass me, and then they screw up a lap in my qualifying or practice
Last edited by SIK02SS; 09-09-2010 at 04:21 PM.
09-09-2010, 05:48 PM
#12
Where do you live?
NASA is a good place to start: http://www.nasaproracing.com/
Also, google the name of your local track(s), go to their web site, and look for their events calendar. The calendar will tell you who (what group/organization) has the track rented. 90% of these organizations have a web site you can visit (and register through) and has a calendar for the events they will hold in the year. Then you have more to read because they all have similar rules, but not the same. Good groups will have instructors available to ride with you (and should require it for at least your 1st time out) for either free or a small mandatory 1 time fee ($20-30).
NASA is a good place to start: http://www.nasaproracing.com/
Also, google the name of your local track(s), go to their web site, and look for their events calendar. The calendar will tell you who (what group/organization) has the track rented. 90% of these organizations have a web site you can visit (and register through) and has a calendar for the events they will hold in the year. Then you have more to read because they all have similar rules, but not the same. Good groups will have instructors available to ride with you (and should require it for at least your 1st time out) for either free or a small mandatory 1 time fee ($20-30).
09-10-2010, 06:59 AM
#14
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Where do you live?
NASA is a good place to start: http://www.nasaproracing.com/
Also, google the name of your local track(s), go to their web site, and look for their events calendar. The calendar will tell you who (what group/organization) has the track rented. 90% of these organizations have a web site you can visit (and register through) and has a calendar for the events they will hold in the year. Then you have more to read because they all have similar rules, but not the same. Good groups will have instructors available to ride with you (and should require it for at least your 1st time out) for either free or a small mandatory 1 time fee ($20-30).
NASA is a good place to start: http://www.nasaproracing.com/
Also, google the name of your local track(s), go to their web site, and look for their events calendar. The calendar will tell you who (what group/organization) has the track rented. 90% of these organizations have a web site you can visit (and register through) and has a calendar for the events they will hold in the year. Then you have more to read because they all have similar rules, but not the same. Good groups will have instructors available to ride with you (and should require it for at least your 1st time out) for either free or a small mandatory 1 time fee ($20-30).
09-17-2010, 06:20 PM
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09-18-2010, 02:03 PM
#20
Brakes and all the fluids flushed and you are are good to go for your first HPDEs. Do not start modifying the car until you've got some track time under your belt. If you do, you'll wind up chasing your tail instead of learning how to drive the car. Been there, done that. I know it's difficult not to tinker, but believe me (and the previous posters), get some track time first, then decide what you want to do. Brake pads and flushing all the fluids with the best you can afford is the first thing to do. The drilled rotors have to go, btw. Blanks, or perhaps slotted, never drilled. If you go with slotted rotors, never run a rotor where the slot reaches the edge of the rotor. It will create a stress riser, and crack at the slot.