lt16spd1

I've had the back end step out a bit while powering through a mountain turn in 4th gear, at about 40 - 45mph. Wasn't trying to do it on purpose, just trying to smoothly power through it. This is the fastest I've been going when it's happened to me, and it's happened numerous other times at lower speeds. Every time so far, the best and quickest way to correct and bring it back in line has been to reduce throttle by about 10% (but do not fully close the throttle!) and input a very tiny amount of counter steer. Every time it comes right back in place very quickly and without fuss.

I was taking an on/off ramp at a pretty high rate of speed today. Posted speed was 25mph and on the second half of it I managed to hit 60mph or just a tad over. Barrier walls on both sides and no cars around, but it got me thinking. Does my method of correction translate at higher speeds also? Or is there a safer method to control or correct oversteer at high speeds?

DietCoke

iTrader: (18)

snap oversteer like that is generally the driver, and no, correction at 130mph plays out a lot differently then 40mph.

Monopoly19

These cars fundamentally lack rear grip. If you are near the limit, it would not surprise me to hear that the back wanted to snap around.

1981TA

iTrader: (7)

+1 on that.

I trail braked going into turn 1 at Road America a few years ago. It was a learning experience for sure. Lucky me, I just mowed some grass after the car did a little ballet on the track at 90 MPH. Didn't even touch the kitty litter.

Two years later, watched a guy destroy a 2000ish Mustang in Corner 5, doing the same thing (picture in my footer is turn 5).

DietCoke

iTrader: (18)

Its amazing how far cars will go when they go sideways into grass. Slide forever. Can't ever underestimate dangerous corners

JD_AMG

Sounds like you should be worried about getting the car setup to not do it in the first place. Is your mod list up to date? Are you running poly/poly rear LCAs? What about relocation brackets? What tires are you running and are they still in good shape?
Better shocks would not only help with stability but also feel/reaction.

70 Bug Mid Engine

I did a 360 in my S2000 back in the day doing about 100 mph. I was on a nice long curved and banked freeway interchange that I drove everyday. I used to be able to do it at 120 mph in my GTO so I said why not try it at 100 mph in the S2000 (only had it for a week at that point). Well the dry rotted rear tires didnt help at all. Rear end started wagging and ended up doing a complete 180. I remember seeing my buddies headlights (he was right behind me). Somehow I managed to keep it on the road and flip it back around. Damage - 4 flat spotted tires and a fond memory of being young and stupid.

BMR Tech2

iTrader: (5)

You probably need to go to a Professional Driving School to get these answers (I've been a Instructor for 28 Years). Anything written could be misinterpreted.

smitty2919

His mod list is non existent when it comes to suspension. Better shocks/tires, no mention of springs or CO's, no mention of rear LCA/PHB setup etc.

As far as we know aside from those iffy shocks and UMI swaybars he is on stock springs/ride height with at most a 275 wide street tires.

Side note, stop ripping around on the street and sign up for autocross. Takes one blind mountain turn with some leaves/gravel on it to kill yourself or kill oncoming traffic...

Mojave

iTrader: (4)

I agree with you 100% on the not hooning in public, it is dangerous and irresponsible, and autocross events are great for teaching car control.

However, I disagree that you need all that stuff for the car to not swap ends unexpectedly. I ran a stock LS1 car in F Stock for years on stock suspension (stock control arms, springs, panhard, just some Koni yellows ), with 16x8's, and the car definitely wasn't loose. I also did plenty of track days and the car was plenty stable at high speeds. If anything it pushed when you entered a corner too fast. I think this is a driver issue, not a car setup issue.

smitty2919

^Agreed, I suppose any list of parts bolted on and not properly setup can make the car loose. That said maybe I should have mentioned that adding parts I suggested would tend to make the car more stable and predictable BUT still able to get you to poop your pants if you push it too far.

I'll never forget trying slaloms my first year racing on 100% stock suspension LOL Then going to Strano/Koni and swaybars it was AMAZING. Then came the watts link....and a differential....and 315's LOL

Mojave

iTrader: (4)

315's are definitely a life changer

smitty2919

You ain't shittin'!

Can't wait to pony up for some new 315 Rival S. I'm on used Rivals and they are comparable to even older Hoosiers I have. I've never owned new race tires so I'm looking forward to being pleasantly surprised LOL.

Mojave

iTrader: (4)

What wheels are you running? I've got several sets of C5 Z06 rears, and I wasn't sure how squished a 315 Rival would be on them.

smitty2919

OEM speedline 18x10.5 C5Z in the front and OE Wheels chrome 18x10.5 c5Z rears. I got them as a package deal so I couldn't pass it up. Eventually I need to track down 2 more OEM wheels for the back.

315's on C5Z 10.5 wheels is prob the most common wheel/tire combo to run. Light and functional....with some spacers needed LOL.

JD_AMG

40-45mph in 4th just doesn't seem all that fast, 4th isn't snappy like being in 2nd gear would be, I could understand the rear coming around with power in 2nd gear but not 4th unless the tires are shot. And coming in too hot in a sharp turn Id expect the car to understeer if its on stock-stockish suspension.

This is what Ive been saying for years, stock suspension + koni yellows = unbelievably stable and easy to drive.

Mojave

iTrader: (4)

I spent lots of time scouring Craigslist, but I have 16 C5Z rears (15 Speedlines, 1 Alcoa). One set is on the car, so I've already got the studs and spacers sorted out.

Glad it's not just me

lt16spd1

Its been a process trying to get it right. I had front camber around -1* but backed it to ~ -.5* to help induce a slight bit of understeer. LCA brackets in the lowest holes have helped to increase rear end grip while on the throttle a pretty large amount, but now I'm worried about inducing throttle closed oversteer; one the gas powering through the corner then for whatever reason I have to quickly reduce throttle.

Any tips to further increase rear grip in a predictable manner? Trying to avoid snap oversteer and the likes of possible.

lt16spd1

I live in an area where people apparently love cars and there isnt jack **** in the sense of events. Auto cross doesn't exist around here and I can drive in the mountains without seeing another car for 30 mins. I live in the middle of nowhere and try to make the most of what I can without endangering others. Also why I mentioned in my original post that I was ripping it around an empty off ramp with barrier walls on both sides. I'm not dumb enough to rip it around blind turns in the mountains. Maybe when I was younger but I'm over 30 now and would like to think I've matured at least slightly.

Suspension mods are KYB shocks (the adjustable ones everyone hates), BMR lowering springs, BMR adjustable panhard bar, LCA brackets, UMI front and rear sway bars, Continental DWS 06 tires @ 275/40/17, subframe connectors.

I tried to update my mod signature a while ago but couldn't find a spot to do it when I clicked my profile.

JD_AMG

Yes, removing the relocation brackets all together, they do NOT help handling and can induce unwanted oversteer. Ive seen guys say that they "help out of corner grip" but I haven't found that to be true myself, they seem to just want to make the car rotate more.
Do you have aftermarket rear LCAs? You do not want poly bushings on both ends, ideally you would want either rubber or rod ended bushings. Poly can stick and bind which can cause snap oversteer.
Better shocks will go a LONG way in feel, control/handling and predictability. I would highly suggest Koni sports(adjustables) if you want an off the shelf shock with warranty.
Something else you can do that is very very easy but costly is buy a watts link with an adjustable roll center - you can literally dial in rear grip by adjusting the roll center up or down. I guess you could also buy an adjustable roll center mount for the PHB setup as well, but you still have the negative effects of the PHB to deal with.