New nozzle bracket opinions. 56k ummmmm.
New nozzle bracket opinions. 56k ummmmm. Hey guys, I'm finally gettin the ball rollin on my install. Here's a bracket I made to hold my dual nozzles (HSW dual nozzle dry). I wanted to install the nozzles closer to the maf seeing as how most of you guys recommend it be only a few inches in front of the maf. Since my nozzles are 180* installing them anywhere else would either result in them being too far away from the maf or hitting the walls of my lid and possibly causing bad maf readings (or so i think). What are your guys opinions on it so far? Dont mind the nitrous lines that are running around in there, I plan on drilling a hole through the rubber seal on the filter or through the filter element itself to route them. I just want to know if you guys think the placement of the nozzles is optimal. The bracket will allow for minor adjustments of the nozzles (closer/farther and aiming up/down) but I need to get it in the approximate optimal area first. Any recommendations?
Also, the only downside that I see with this is the possibility that the nuts will come off due to vibration. Do you think red loctite/threadlock is going to hold them on permanently or should i look into getting the nuts spotwelded or something?
*edit* the nozzles will actually sit just a tad higher than in the pics. The way the filter/lid are sitting on the ground the middle of the filter is sagging a little.
Also, the only downside that I see with this is the possibility that the nuts will come off due to vibration. Do you think red loctite/threadlock is going to hold them on permanently or should i look into getting the nuts spotwelded or something?
*edit* the nozzles will actually sit just a tad higher than in the pics. The way the filter/lid are sitting on the ground the middle of the filter is sagging a little.
Last edited by dementia; Feb 7, 2007 at 02:52 PM.
On The Tree
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 164
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From: houston, TX
Looks pretty trick. Are you going to run the lines through the filter? If so, maybe btinh in one line into a y so you only have to go through the filter once. Oh yeah, lock-tite, if on of those nuts works free your hating life.
Nice work you have done. It's the first I have seen like this with 180* dry foggers (usually used in the bottom of cone filters). The thing that may be a problem is running to rich. Then again it may be to close for this style fogger and just blow past the MAF wire. You are in un charted area and will be letting us know how it works. I will be doing a nozzle location/tuning thread and would like to invite you to post your findings. The real issue i see, is no real nozzle tuning ability, meaning, when using dual 90*'s in the side of the neck you can just rotate the nozzle for changing a/f. On my set-up I found two 90*'s to be to rich, so I changed one to a straight shooter to center of box and one 90* for a 11.5 a/f. You can also just turn a single (on dual nozzles) 90* all the way back to spraying directly at in coming air. Now, you really don't have any options for easy tuning of nozzles? But, it still may be fine, and logging will tell the story on starting a/f. Keep us updated as everyone will be interested in how this works out. 
Robert
Robert
I was thinking that about the "tuning" A/F aspect of this too. What you cant really see are the brackets holding the nozzles are actually L brackets. The base of the L is resting in between the folds of the filter. I suppose for greater tunability I could set some straight brackets inside the folds of the filter which would allow me to slide the nozzle holder back/forth to adjust for A/F. Do you think that would give me enough room to work with as far as adjusting A/F goes? What does the spray pattern on these things look like? Do they shoot out a narrow beam that spreads out slowly or do they fog out fairly quickly? I was hoping that since I've got two nozzles they'd spread out to cover where the other one might be missing.
I'm a nitrous noob and really I'm kinda going into this blindly but I've been doing some reading and have tried to make the best out of what I have. My kit came with dual 180* nozzles and although it might be easier to just buy some dual 90* nozzles I'm kinda digging the stealth in having my nozzles and lines inside the lid. That and I dont want to turn my lid into swiss cheese trying to get the 180* nozzles at the perfect A/F. I'll paint my lid if I ever want to be 100% stealth.
Robert, I'd be more than willing to submit my results to you once I get to that point.
I'm a nitrous noob and really I'm kinda going into this blindly but I've been doing some reading and have tried to make the best out of what I have. My kit came with dual 180* nozzles and although it might be easier to just buy some dual 90* nozzles I'm kinda digging the stealth in having my nozzles and lines inside the lid. That and I dont want to turn my lid into swiss cheese trying to get the 180* nozzles at the perfect A/F. I'll paint my lid if I ever want to be 100% stealth.
Robert, I'd be more than willing to submit my results to you once I get to that point.
Originally Posted by dementia
I was thinking that about the "tuning" A/F aspect of this too. What you cant really see are the brackets holding the nozzles are actually L brackets. The base of the L is resting in between the folds of the filter. I suppose for greater tunability I could set some straight brackets inside the folds of the filter which would allow me to slide the nozzle holder back/forth to adjust for A/F. Do you think that would give me enough room to work with as far as adjusting A/F goes? What does the spray pattern on these things look like? Do they shoot out a narrow beam that spreads out slowly or do they fog out fairly quickly? I was hoping that since I've got two nozzles they'd spread out to cover where the other one might be missing.
I'm a nitrous noob and really I'm kinda going into this blindly but I've been doing some reading and have tried to make the best out of what I have. My kit came with dual 180* nozzles and although it might be easier to just buy some dual 90* nozzles I'm kinda digging the stealth in having my nozzles and lines inside the lid. That and I dont want to turn my lid into swiss cheese trying to get the 180* nozzles at the perfect A/F. I'll paint my lid if I ever want to be 100% stealth.
Robert, I'd be more than willing to submit my results to you once I get to that point.
I'm a nitrous noob and really I'm kinda going into this blindly but I've been doing some reading and have tried to make the best out of what I have. My kit came with dual 180* nozzles and although it might be easier to just buy some dual 90* nozzles I'm kinda digging the stealth in having my nozzles and lines inside the lid. That and I dont want to turn my lid into swiss cheese trying to get the 180* nozzles at the perfect A/F. I'll paint my lid if I ever want to be 100% stealth.
Robert, I'd be more than willing to submit my results to you once I get to that point.
I do know using straight shooters that they also have a fairly good plume, and when to far away you'll get the slow progressive hit and a tendancy to start and sometimes stay lean. 
Robert
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alright, thats cool i guess in that case the location i have might be good. I'd rather have them close and rich than close and shooting past the maf altogether. I'm going to be testing it outside of the car to make sure. I'll setup the lid/filter/maf/nozzles outside and make sure i'm not going to be shooting past the maf wires.
When I run it on the dyno for the first run, what A/F should I be shooting for? Whats the range of acceptable A/F ratios? Also how do they test for A/F at dynos? Are they wideband and whatnot?
When I run it on the dyno for the first run, what A/F should I be shooting for? Whats the range of acceptable A/F ratios? Also how do they test for A/F at dynos? Are they wideband and whatnot?
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Originally Posted by 1BadTA13
where did you get the clear lid?
This looks like a really interesting setup. I just got a HSW dry kit single nozzle and am looking at doing something like this through the filter area. I think mine came with a 70* nozzle, but I haven't checked yet. It will probably be a good idea to bring a clean Fram filter to the dyno for dyno tuning and once the placement is decided to drill my K&N. I'm not crazy about drilling more than one hole in the K&N, so hopefully I can get it set on the $11 Fram I have laying around. Keep us up to date on your project.
Originally Posted by dementia
When I run it on the dyno for the first run, what A/F should I be shooting for? Whats the range of acceptable A/F ratios? Also how do they test for A/F at dynos? Are they wideband and whatnot?
The Dyno should have a Wideband sniffer he puts in the tailpipe, this will monitor the O2 during the Spray. Under 12 is what most recommend. 11.5-11.8 is what most people say to shoot for. I'll guess your gonna be rich (Mid 10's) and can massage that with Roberts changing the direction trick.
Keep us posted (no pun intended)
Is there any danger to the plugs or anything else in running rich for a pull on the dyno? Like if i were to do my test run on the dyno and ran rich, could i adjust the bracket and re-run or would i be having to change the plugs cuz they got fouled? Also, I want to start off on a small (75) shot on the dyno just to be safe then move it up to 100. If I run a 75 shot, obtain an 11.5-11.8 A/F, swap the jets out for 100, will I still run the same A/F? If not I'll just run the 100 shot and adjust for A/F with that.
I remade my bracket so it doesnt have those bolts on the inside but in doing so I lost a lot of adjustability. I'm going to keep an eye out for something I can make additional brackets out of in a similar design to what i have now, just at differing nozzle positions so if I run to rich I can just swap in a longer bracket.
I remade my bracket so it doesnt have those bolts on the inside but in doing so I lost a lot of adjustability. I'm going to keep an eye out for something I can make additional brackets out of in a similar design to what i have now, just at differing nozzle positions so if I run to rich I can just swap in a longer bracket.
Originally Posted by dementia
Is there any danger to the plugs or anything else in running rich for a pull on the dyno? Like if i were to do my test run on the dyno and ran rich, could i adjust the bracket and re-run or would i be having to change the plugs cuz they got fouled? Also, I want to start off on a small (75) shot on the dyno just to be safe then move it up to 100. If I run a 75 shot, obtain an 11.5-11.8 A/F, swap the jets out for 100, will I still run the same A/F? If not I'll just run the 100 shot and adjust for A/F with that.
I remade my bracket so it doesnt have those bolts on the inside but in doing so I lost a lot of adjustability. I'm going to keep an eye out for something I can make additional brackets out of in a similar design to what i have now, just at differing nozzle positions so if I run to rich I can just swap in a longer bracket.
I remade my bracket so it doesnt have those bolts on the inside but in doing so I lost a lot of adjustability. I'm going to keep an eye out for something I can make additional brackets out of in a similar design to what i have now, just at differing nozzle positions so if I run to rich I can just swap in a longer bracket.
Robert
Still workin on the install. I'm trying to get the main feed line run up to the engine bay on the drivers side, hit a small wall since theres no drivers side gromet and the line isnt long enough to run through the passenger side gromet with my bottle/noid placement.
Originally Posted by 86MC_SS
The nozzles look to close to the MAF for a dry shot. I see it not registering all the nitrous passing through it. But who knows.
Good luck and let us know how it works.
Good luck and let us know how it works.
Robert
Yea I redid the nozzle bracket with safety in mind this time around. Its a simple bracket held in place by 2 bolts. The bolts go through the rubber gasket on the filter and the nuts on the other side are held in place by the outer edge of the rubber gasket so thats another security measure to insure the nuts wont walk themselves out. The bolts would have to unscrew themselves from vibration, however they're fairly long and the hole through the rubber gasket is tight so theres a lot of friction holding those things in place. As I stated earlier the only down side to this is that I lost most of my adjustability with this design. I'm not too worried though. I'm going to find some more brackets with differing lengths so I can keep the safety, and still be able to adjust by putting in a longer bracket. It'll just take more time. Here are a few pics for u guys to look at. The line running under the car still needs to be covered in loom and then I need to zip tie it some more but as it sits its pretty safe/secure.
O yea, can you spot my noid?
O yea, can you spot my noid?