C16 or Meth Injection?
08-15-2017, 10:26 AM
#1
C16 or Meth Injection? Hey fellas, I'm currently planning an upgrade and would like some input on the topic for guidance.
I'm installing a Gen IV 5.3 over the winter with the anticipation of running 14-16 lbs. on pump gas but what I'd like to do is run a boost controller with a scramble feature to add in an additional 3-4 lbs. at the hit of a button in the event of a close race.
I'm very hesitant to use a meth kit simply because I know three guys locally who have had them fail and lost an engine.
I'm seriously debating having a pump gas tune for 14 lbs. and less and having a C16 tune for 16 lbs. and 20 lbs. with the scramble button depressed.
I've got no issues draining and filling the tank plus I wouldn't have the additional expense of a quality meth system.
E85 isn't an option as well since there are no local fuel stations that support it.
Any input or advice would be greatly appreciated!
I'm installing a Gen IV 5.3 over the winter with the anticipation of running 14-16 lbs. on pump gas but what I'd like to do is run a boost controller with a scramble feature to add in an additional 3-4 lbs. at the hit of a button in the event of a close race.
I'm very hesitant to use a meth kit simply because I know three guys locally who have had them fail and lost an engine.
I'm seriously debating having a pump gas tune for 14 lbs. and less and having a C16 tune for 16 lbs. and 20 lbs. with the scramble button depressed.
I've got no issues draining and filling the tank plus I wouldn't have the additional expense of a quality meth system.
E85 isn't an option as well since there are no local fuel stations that support it.
Any input or advice would be greatly appreciated!
08-15-2017, 11:34 AM
#3
Restricted User
If you're going to run C16, just keep the boost turned up.
If they had failed engines from failed meth injection, then they did something wrong. There are more than enough ways even with the stock ECU to prevent that from happening.
If they had failed engines from failed meth injection, then they did something wrong. There are more than enough ways even with the stock ECU to prevent that from happening.
08-15-2017, 12:43 PM
#4
TECH Enthusiast
If C16 is an option, go with it. Throw the meth kit in the trash.
Can and will make more power on C (and especially Q) over pump/meth. Much more predictable than trying to guess with the mix of the fuel during the changing times of the year.
Can and will make more power on C (and especially Q) over pump/meth. Much more predictable than trying to guess with the mix of the fuel during the changing times of the year.
08-15-2017, 03:21 PM
#5
This car is street car first and for most, I like being able to fill up anywhere and not be limited by specific fuel needs.
The C16 option will be for pre-planned trips to Mexico when the kill setting is needed lol.
I'm interested in hearing about some of these fail safes, its the only way I'd consider running a meth kit is if there was a safety net for failure.
The C16 option will be for pre-planned trips to Mexico when the kill setting is needed lol.
I'm interested in hearing about some of these fail safes, its the only way I'd consider running a meth kit is if there was a safety net for failure.
08-15-2017, 03:26 PM
#6
I'm almost certain I won't be able to run 20 lbs. on pump alone w/ 9.5:1 compression so I need to determine which will work better as well as be the most reliable and cost effective solution.
It stands to reason that if C16 is required at say 16 lbs. then I might as well have the ability to punch it up to 20 lbs. if I'm behind by a car length or so.
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08-15-2017, 05:03 PM
#11
I'm currently at 12 lbs. with 9.75:1 so I'm hoping I can get to maybe 14 lbs. with pump only but if not its okay.
Hence why I was thinking C16 for the race tune with 16 lbs. and 20 lbs. on the button or pump gas and 100% meth.
Does this sound outlandish or unnecessary?
The Alky Control kit looks very nice, I see it comes with a float level switch, can that be piggy backed into the boost controller as a safe guard?
Also is there a boost controller that can cut boost in the event of a lean condition should the meth not be spraying and/or low fluid level condition?
08-15-2017, 08:05 PM
#13
This car is street car first and for most, I like being able to fill up anywhere and not be limited by specific fuel needs.
The C16 option will be for pre-planned trips to Mexico when the kill setting is needed lol.
I'm interested in hearing about some of these fail safes, its the only way I'd consider running a meth kit is if there was a safety net for failure.
The C16 option will be for pre-planned trips to Mexico when the kill setting is needed lol.
I'm interested in hearing about some of these fail safes, its the only way I'd consider running a meth kit is if there was a safety net for failure.
08-15-2017, 08:26 PM
#14
Restricted User
Meth artificially lowers IAT by a significant amount. With a fast acting sensor, you can have timing immediately pulled if the meth quits spraying. This isn't 100% foolproof, but is usually effective enough to save a motor. There are many more complicated ways of reducing risk, but they tend to require more effort.
08-15-2017, 09:09 PM
#15
**** a boost scramble run that **** on 116 and 20psi if you need a little extra spray a little bit of that giggle juice and off you go. You'd be on 116 so you don't even need to worry about a stand alone if your fuel system is up for it. The idea behind boost scramble is you set it to a higher than safe setting where it runs the risk of being a little too hot of a set up and you risk damage. Unless you are legit down tuning your car just for that feature which would be silly.
08-15-2017, 09:25 PM
#16
Launching!
c16 gets expensive real quick if you're throwing $100+ into the tank to go out for the night... a few of those and you would have paid for a real nice meth set up. meth is cheap $37/5gal. most meth injection controllers will have a fail safe, if you're running an electric boost controller get one that has an input for it, had pretty good luck with turbosmart
i use an aquamist system on my daily 4 banger, single 500cc jet (about 25% of my total injector) you'd need 2 or 3 larger injectors, or set up direct port. the controller i use is probably a little overkill for what you're trying to do but i wanted it to ramp up with idc (its direct injected), you can set bias towards idc or map, failsafe is set up to open waste gate (electronically)
i use an aquamist system on my daily 4 banger, single 500cc jet (about 25% of my total injector) you'd need 2 or 3 larger injectors, or set up direct port. the controller i use is probably a little overkill for what you're trying to do but i wanted it to ramp up with idc (its direct injected), you can set bias towards idc or map, failsafe is set up to open waste gate (electronically)
08-16-2017, 09:57 AM
#17
So I'm currently running a typhoon style thread in IAT sensor and from what I researched its a fast acting sensor, if not please correct me.
So if I was to do meth I could install the nozzle(s) upstream of the IAT and combine the float level switch and have at least two safe guards.
I realize **** happens but I feel a lot better about having at least two backups.
So selecting the right meth kit and boost controller would be next.
Perhaps a boost controller with a ramp setting since putting down 700+ rwhp on a drag radial won't be easy especially with a suspension setup for handling.
So if I was to do meth I could install the nozzle(s) upstream of the IAT and combine the float level switch and have at least two safe guards.
I realize **** happens but I feel a lot better about having at least two backups.
So selecting the right meth kit and boost controller would be next.
Perhaps a boost controller with a ramp setting since putting down 700+ rwhp on a drag radial won't be easy especially with a suspension setup for handling.
08-16-2017, 12:09 PM
#18
Aem sells the failsafe wideband that can trigger an output based on afr. Your choice on what you wire it too, but could turn the boost controller off, kill power to the coils or something
