2000 Trans Am exhaust upgrade
12-06-2018, 03:52 PM
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2000 Trans Am exhaust upgrade First off: moderators, I apologize if this is in the wrong forum and feel free to move it if it is. I felt like it belonged here since the car in question is supposed to have an LS1 in it and there is probably more F-body expertise here than in the Gen IV forum.
Long story short: I had a well-cared-for 2006 GTO M6 and the recent hurricane dropped a tree on it in such a way that it's not really fixable. For a variety of reasons getting another GTO is not something I want to do, so I bought an inexpensive very high-mileage 2000 Trans Am M6 and plan to move the LS2 from the GTO to the Trans Am as that represents the least expensive path to having a well-maintained, reliable vehicle I'm happy to drive for the rest of my driving days.
I like the Trans Am (this is my 4th F-body from 1982 to 2001 models), and once the engine swap is completed it'll probably be faster than the GTO was since it's lighter. This is a good thing. My only complaint is that the Trans Am doesn't sound as good. The GTO exhaust was mostly stock. A previous owner put two cheap resonators on just before the exhaust tips, when those fell apart internally I had them replaced with a couple small glasspacks. It was a bit louder than stock with a pleasant raspy sound when you romped on the throttle. The Trans Am's stock exhaust is much more mellow and hollow sounding. I would like to replace it with something a little more aggressive sounding, but not overly obnoxious. This is where I need some help from those with more knowledge and experience than me. I realize everyone in the forum probably has a different opinion, but I value diverse input.
I have two concerns:
(1) Noisiness: I don't track my car and use it as a daily driver and plan to keep it forever, replacing whatever wears out as needed. While I can pull up youtube videos of people revving their engines, the cars sound however loud you have your computer speakers turned up and the sound quality is only as good as the recorder's microphone. The Borla 140028 seems to be popular, looks nice, is stainless steel (which appeals to my long-term plans), and is within my price range (don't want to spend more than $1000 on parts if I can help it) but every video I've listened to of Borla exhausts sounds different. While I would like something considerably more aggressive than stock I also don't want to infuriate my neighbors too badly when I start up the car to go to work in the mornings before they wake up.
(2) Performance: The LS2 in the GTO used a true dual exhaust configuration. This will change when installed in the Trans Am, unless I upgrade to true duals there. Is the single exhaust setup going to create a performance reduction, assuming I go with an upgrade similar to the Borla catback? Are there true dual options that aren't obnoxiously loud and don't create ground clearance problems? The Trans Am already scrapes over speed bumps much more than the GTO so I don't want to make that problem worse.
Thanks in advance for the feedback, everyone!
Long story short: I had a well-cared-for 2006 GTO M6 and the recent hurricane dropped a tree on it in such a way that it's not really fixable. For a variety of reasons getting another GTO is not something I want to do, so I bought an inexpensive very high-mileage 2000 Trans Am M6 and plan to move the LS2 from the GTO to the Trans Am as that represents the least expensive path to having a well-maintained, reliable vehicle I'm happy to drive for the rest of my driving days.
I like the Trans Am (this is my 4th F-body from 1982 to 2001 models), and once the engine swap is completed it'll probably be faster than the GTO was since it's lighter. This is a good thing. My only complaint is that the Trans Am doesn't sound as good. The GTO exhaust was mostly stock. A previous owner put two cheap resonators on just before the exhaust tips, when those fell apart internally I had them replaced with a couple small glasspacks. It was a bit louder than stock with a pleasant raspy sound when you romped on the throttle. The Trans Am's stock exhaust is much more mellow and hollow sounding. I would like to replace it with something a little more aggressive sounding, but not overly obnoxious. This is where I need some help from those with more knowledge and experience than me. I realize everyone in the forum probably has a different opinion, but I value diverse input.
I have two concerns:
(1) Noisiness: I don't track my car and use it as a daily driver and plan to keep it forever, replacing whatever wears out as needed. While I can pull up youtube videos of people revving their engines, the cars sound however loud you have your computer speakers turned up and the sound quality is only as good as the recorder's microphone. The Borla 140028 seems to be popular, looks nice, is stainless steel (which appeals to my long-term plans), and is within my price range (don't want to spend more than $1000 on parts if I can help it) but every video I've listened to of Borla exhausts sounds different. While I would like something considerably more aggressive than stock I also don't want to infuriate my neighbors too badly when I start up the car to go to work in the mornings before they wake up.
(2) Performance: The LS2 in the GTO used a true dual exhaust configuration. This will change when installed in the Trans Am, unless I upgrade to true duals there. Is the single exhaust setup going to create a performance reduction, assuming I go with an upgrade similar to the Borla catback? Are there true dual options that aren't obnoxiously loud and don't create ground clearance problems? The Trans Am already scrapes over speed bumps much more than the GTO so I don't want to make that problem worse.
Thanks in advance for the feedback, everyone!
12-06-2018, 04:32 PM
#2
TECH Senior Member
A 3-1/2" single exhaust will still make power. Run that pipe over the axle, then split it into a pair of 2-1/2" pipes (combined, are only SLIGHTLY smaller than the 3-1/2" pipe) into a pair of mufflers to your liking.
12-06-2018, 04:39 PM
#3
TECH Enthusiast
Is it going to have headers, Y-pipe and is the LS2 going in to the car going to be cammed?
12-07-2018, 08:01 AM
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I'm not opposed to headers, et cetera, but the goal is to try to keep the total parts cost around $1000 if I can (since I'm sure before long I'll have to put in a new rear end and other fixes).
12-07-2018, 08:21 AM
#6
I only use borla on my cars, wife's ws6 and my dad's ws6. My Z28 has the adjustable catback with the electric cutout where the plates go. Very simple and after 10 years it still looks new.
224 cam at 112 lsa, long tubes and a catted 3 inch y pipe and I still love it
224 cam at 112 lsa, long tubes and a catted 3 inch y pipe and I still love it
12-07-2018, 08:27 AM
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12-07-2018, 11:03 PM
#8
GMMG catback is also good if you don’t plan on removing cats when doing headers. Plenty of single pipe systems around that won’t choke the ls2. You could also get 2.5” dual exhaust all way back from hooker , blackheart system. It’s mild even though true dual. If you do go true dual other brands make loud ones but I’m sure you could replace the mufflers for it.
12-09-2018, 08:48 PM
#9
TECH Enthusiast
With the stock cam, manifolds, and cats, the GMMG sounds really good and isn't terribly loud. I had one in my car for 2 years but I had to switch because I added headers, ORY and a cam, it was just too loud for the neighborhood in the morning.
12-11-2018, 12:17 AM
#11
GMMG catback is also good if you don’t plan on removing cats when doing headers. Plenty of single pipe systems around that won’t choke the ls2. You could also get 2.5” dual exhaust all way back from hooker , blackheart system. It’s mild even though true dual. If you do go true dual other brands make loud ones but I’m sure you could replace the mufflers for it.
If I were in your shoes, I'd do the Hooker Blackheart dual catback system as mentioned above. The GMMG is a very heavy piece, and the duals won't weigh that much more, but will certainly outflow it.
12-11-2018, 09:58 AM
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I had initially dismissed the Hooker Blackheart system as probably being too loud, having poor ground clearance, and as having too much stuff crammed under a car that wasn't designed for it. Then I actually looked into it and read through an extremely lengthy thread on here about it and came away pretty much sold. If anything its only complaint seems to be that it's too quiet for some, though the clips I've heard make it sound slightly louder than stock and in terms of quality it sounds remarkably like my GTO did. Fitment and ground clearance don't appear to be issues *at all*, and the cat back version looks easy to modify if I do want to put on headers in the future. Your comment cements it for me. Hooker Blackheart for the win.
It appears to be on sale at the moment from Hooker and a variety of vendors for the same price ($752) which seems reasonable for a ready-to-go system, although I saw one vendor that listed a regular price of $799 but a special holiday sale price of $888. Ummm... please don't do my any more favors
. Anyone have a vendor recommendation? (or is that allowed?) The few things I bought for the GTO came from Tick but they don't seem to carry the Blackheart.
It appears to be on sale at the moment from Hooker and a variety of vendors for the same price ($752) which seems reasonable for a ready-to-go system, although I saw one vendor that listed a regular price of $799 but a special holiday sale price of $888. Ummm... please don't do my any more favors
. Anyone have a vendor recommendation? (or is that allowed?) The few things I bought for the GTO came from Tick but they don't seem to carry the Blackheart. 
01-18-2019, 02:59 PM
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WS6 Store ended up with the best price and shipped it quickly. It looks really good in the box. Haven't got it put on the car yet because I managed to have a minor fender bender (first one in over 20 years...) and crumpled the nose a little two weeks after buying the car. Figures. Working on getting *that* fixed before I can do anything else to the car. I don't *think* the frame is affected but I'm going to have to let a professional assess it for me. I don't want to sink more money into a car that can't be economically repaired... but I'd hate to have to go shop for another M6 Trans Am with high miles in good cosmetic condition.
01-19-2019, 06:33 AM
#15
WS6 Store ended up with the best price and shipped it quickly. It looks really good in the box. Haven't got it put on the car yet because I managed to have a minor fender bender (first one in over 20 years...) and crumpled the nose a little two weeks after buying the car. Figures. Working on getting *that* fixed before I can do anything else to the car. I don't *think* the frame is affected but I'm going to have to let a professional assess it for me. I don't want to sink more money into a car that can't be economically repaired... but I'd hate to have to go shop for another M6 Trans Am with high miles in good cosmetic condition.
01-22-2019, 01:25 PM
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Well, the good news is that it looks like it's only going to be $1,600 to get it fixed (it does need some slight frame straightening, but is mercifully minor), which I can live with. Equally important, I got enough of a warm-fuzzy from the show owner that there isn't likely to be any sudden cost explosion once they get into it. This means I can proceed with the engine swap and exhaust upgrade, which I *really* wanted to do before painting anyway. The GTO's stock exhaust was pretty decent, so the LS2 probably won't see a lot of performance improvement in its new home, but at least I won't have to worry about an exhaust that is less effective than what I had on the GTO. The Goat sounded pretty darn good but I think the Trans Am will sound just a tiny bit better. I'm looking forward to finding out...
01-22-2019, 03:26 PM
#17
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Well, the good news is that it looks like it's only going to be $1,600 to get it fixed (it does need some slight frame straightening, but is mercifully minor), which I can live with. Equally important, I got enough of a warm-fuzzy from the show owner that there isn't likely to be any sudden cost explosion once they get into it. This means I can proceed with the engine swap and exhaust upgrade, which I *really* wanted to do before painting anyway. The GTO's stock exhaust was pretty decent, so the LS2 probably won't see a lot of performance improvement in its new home, but at least I won't have to worry about an exhaust that is less effective than what I had on the GTO. The Goat sounded pretty darn good but I think the Trans Am will sound just a tiny bit better. I'm looking forward to finding out...
01-23-2019, 02:55 PM
#18
Hope all goes well with the repairs and no surprises.
I like the BlackHeart, The BH tucked up nice and tight on my 99TA that's lowered 3/4 to 1 inch. No scraps etc. It also cleared the Hawk's 8.8 rear without issues. Hooker also has 1 3/4 & 1 7/8 intermediate length headers for it.
For a 2.5 inch dual, it does well. I saw a dyno graph of the BH vs 3 inch true dual. The 3 inch true dual made 630 whp. The BlackHeart made 616whp (lost 14whp peak) and gained 8 wtq. The owner switch to Blackheart for better ground clearance and because it was quieter.
My set up.
I like the BlackHeart, The BH tucked up nice and tight on my 99TA that's lowered 3/4 to 1 inch. No scraps etc. It also cleared the Hawk's 8.8 rear without issues. Hooker also has 1 3/4 & 1 7/8 intermediate length headers for it.
For a 2.5 inch dual, it does well. I saw a dyno graph of the BH vs 3 inch true dual. The 3 inch true dual made 630 whp. The BlackHeart made 616whp (lost 14whp peak) and gained 8 wtq. The owner switch to Blackheart for better ground clearance and because it was quieter.
My set up.
01-23-2019, 08:11 PM
#19
1 do not worry about y pupe vs true duals. You'll only notice in higher rpms with big cam. Best muffler for ear comfort.... Find a stock ss/ws6 catback. They already have a smaller more free flowing muffler vs z28 and formulas and weighs about 10lbs less easy. Or still want louder, any muffler (non catback) sounds good. I personally do not care much for slowmasters on anything fuel injected.
First off: moderators, I apologize if this is in the wrong forum and feel free to move it if it is. I felt like it belonged here since the car in question is supposed to have an LS1 in it and there is probably more F-body expertise here than in the Gen IV forum.
Long story short: I had a well-cared-for 2006 GTO M6 and the recent hurricane dropped a tree on it in such a way that it's not really fixable. For a variety of reasons getting another GTO is not something I want to do, so I bought an inexpensive very high-mileage 2000 Trans Am M6 and plan to move the LS2 from the GTO to the Trans Am as that represents the least expensive path to having a well-maintained, reliable vehicle I'm happy to drive for the rest of my driving days.
I like the Trans Am (this is my 4th F-body from 1982 to 2001 models), and once the engine swap is completed it'll probably be faster than the GTO was since it's lighter. This is a good thing. My only complaint is that the Trans Am doesn't sound as good. The GTO exhaust was mostly stock. A previous owner put two cheap resonators on just before the exhaust tips, when those fell apart internally I had them replaced with a couple small glasspacks. It was a bit louder than stock with a pleasant raspy sound when you romped on the throttle. The Trans Am's stock exhaust is much more mellow and hollow sounding. I would like to replace it with something a little more aggressive sounding, but not overly obnoxious. This is where I need some help from those with more knowledge and experience than me. I realize everyone in the forum probably has a different opinion, but I value diverse input.
I have two concerns:
(1) Noisiness: I don't track my car and use it as a daily driver and plan to keep it forever, replacing whatever wears out as needed. While I can pull up youtube videos of people revving their engines, the cars sound however loud you have your computer speakers turned up and the sound quality is only as good as the recorder's microphone. The Borla 140028 seems to be popular, looks nice, is stainless steel (which appeals to my long-term plans), and is within my price range (don't want to spend more than $1000 on parts if I can help it) but every video I've listened to of Borla exhausts sounds different. While I would like something considerably more aggressive than stock I also don't want to infuriate my neighbors too badly when I start up the car to go to work in the mornings before they wake up.
(2) Performance: The LS2 in the GTO used a true dual exhaust configuration. This will change when installed in the Trans Am, unless I upgrade to true duals there. Is the single exhaust setup going to create a performance reduction, assuming I go with an upgrade similar to the Borla catback? Are there true dual options that aren't obnoxiously loud and don't create ground clearance problems? The Trans Am already scrapes over speed bumps much more than the GTO so I don't want to make that problem worse.
Thanks in advance for the feedback, everyone!
Long story short: I had a well-cared-for 2006 GTO M6 and the recent hurricane dropped a tree on it in such a way that it's not really fixable. For a variety of reasons getting another GTO is not something I want to do, so I bought an inexpensive very high-mileage 2000 Trans Am M6 and plan to move the LS2 from the GTO to the Trans Am as that represents the least expensive path to having a well-maintained, reliable vehicle I'm happy to drive for the rest of my driving days.
I like the Trans Am (this is my 4th F-body from 1982 to 2001 models), and once the engine swap is completed it'll probably be faster than the GTO was since it's lighter. This is a good thing. My only complaint is that the Trans Am doesn't sound as good. The GTO exhaust was mostly stock. A previous owner put two cheap resonators on just before the exhaust tips, when those fell apart internally I had them replaced with a couple small glasspacks. It was a bit louder than stock with a pleasant raspy sound when you romped on the throttle. The Trans Am's stock exhaust is much more mellow and hollow sounding. I would like to replace it with something a little more aggressive sounding, but not overly obnoxious. This is where I need some help from those with more knowledge and experience than me. I realize everyone in the forum probably has a different opinion, but I value diverse input.
I have two concerns:
(1) Noisiness: I don't track my car and use it as a daily driver and plan to keep it forever, replacing whatever wears out as needed. While I can pull up youtube videos of people revving their engines, the cars sound however loud you have your computer speakers turned up and the sound quality is only as good as the recorder's microphone. The Borla 140028 seems to be popular, looks nice, is stainless steel (which appeals to my long-term plans), and is within my price range (don't want to spend more than $1000 on parts if I can help it) but every video I've listened to of Borla exhausts sounds different. While I would like something considerably more aggressive than stock I also don't want to infuriate my neighbors too badly when I start up the car to go to work in the mornings before they wake up.
(2) Performance: The LS2 in the GTO used a true dual exhaust configuration. This will change when installed in the Trans Am, unless I upgrade to true duals there. Is the single exhaust setup going to create a performance reduction, assuming I go with an upgrade similar to the Borla catback? Are there true dual options that aren't obnoxiously loud and don't create ground clearance problems? The Trans Am already scrapes over speed bumps much more than the GTO so I don't want to make that problem worse.
Thanks in advance for the feedback, everyone!
01-23-2019, 08:31 PM
#20
1 do not worry about y pupe vs true duals. You'll only notice in higher rpms with big cam. Best muffler for ear comfort.... Find a stock ss/ws6 catback. They already have a smaller more free flowing muffler vs z28 and formulas and weighs about 10lbs less easy. Or still want louder, any muffler (non catback) sounds good. I personally do not care much for slowmasters on anything fuel injected.