JimMueller

iTrader: (9)

Not sure if this is concidence or not, but after I picked up the car from an exciter wire terminal repair, I noticed that my turn signals no longer work.

The lever itself clicks into both the up & down positions, but none of the signal lights turn on, nor does it illuminate the arrows on the instrument cluster. I've had burned out turn signal bulbs before, but those symptoms were always that the cluster arrow would stay on solid with one of the outside lamps.

Turn/BU fuse #2 isn't blown & the reverse light works fine. The parking lamps, fog lamps, and normal lighting function normally. The bright switch has been dead for at least a year.

Is there anything else I can test before assuming it's the stalk?

9WhiteCamaro9

I'm having the same problem with mine also. Like with yours, the lever will click into place and will even pop out when I make a turn and start turning the steering wheel back straight like it would when the signals work like there suppose to. Everything else on the car works fine all the way down to my high beams, day lights work fine and everything except my turn signals, even my hazard lights work but I think for safety reasons, they by pass anything that works with the turn signals.

In for an answer or test to do to figure this out.

omgitsmikeyc

Back when my father worked at an auto electrical shop I had a similar issue. But it was also in conjunction with a dead dash, as it was a digital speedometer. The fix for that car, not gm, was the ignition switch. No fuses went off and the car drove fine. It could also be a bad wire connection to the relay or relay itself for the blinker.

wssix99

iTrader: (5)

Do the hazards work? If so, the first thing to try/check is the flasher. (The hazards and turns use the same bulb filaments but different flashers.)

JimMueller

iTrader: (9)

Hmm, the hazards do not work either. Searching around it would seem to indicate that if both the hazards and the turn signals are all out simultaneously, that either both flashers went out simultaneously or to check the relay in the DRL module, am I on the right path? I'm still suspicious because the shop also cleaned/tightened grounds and tightened something loose on the PCM when it was in for the electrical concern.

WhiteBird00

iTrader: (4)

The DRL module is not involved in the turn signals or hazard flashers at the rear of the car - only the front lamps are in that circuit. I suspect that your T/S switch is faulty. You can check with a test light or multimeter at the turn signal switch connector near the base of the steering column. Turn on the hazard switch and check for flashing power on the brown wire in the connector (that's the input from the flasher). If you have power there, you know that the fuse, flasher, etc. are fine. Check for flashing power output on the dark green and yellow wires (they are the rear lamp output). If no power there then the switch is faulty.

JimMueller

iTrader: (9)

That would certainly be more cost effective than the DRL module. By switch you're referring to this, not this, correct? Maybe I can get lucky and fix the brights at the same time.

Edit: Is it these wires you're referring to? There is a male and female connector which looks like one of the parts I referenced above. With key on but motor not running, hazard switch on and turn signal lever on, if I ground the DMM against the screw near the trunk release and touch each of the flat pins on the left connector I get no voltage. Or do I need to somehow test them with the two pieces connected?

WhiteBird00

iTrader: (4)

Yes, the first "this" is the turn signal switch. The second "this" is the multifunction lever that mechanically moves the T/S switch but is not involved in its operation electrically.

You should get power on the brown (hazard) and purple (turn signal) wires even with the connector disconnected. The brown will be powered at all times while the purple will only be powered with the ignition switch on. You will need to test with the connector assembled to check the switch output. This is where a test light is better than a multimeter because the sharp probe can get into the connector more easily.

If you aren't getting power at the connector, go back further in the circuit and test for power at the flashers. Each flasher has only two pins. The hazard flasher has battery (constant) power on the orange wire (output on the brown wire). The T/S flasher has ignition controlled power input on the brown wire with output on the purple wire. If you don't get power there then there is probably a wiring, fuse or fusible link problem.

JimMueller

iTrader: (9)

There isn't a brown wire on either of those two connectors, unless it has horribly faded. Any chance the brown wire is a different color on '98s?

I'm going out to check the flashers right now...

Edit: No significant voltage on any of the flasher pins. It'll jump around in fractions of a volt. I wonder if the grounds I'm choosing to use aren't ideal. Can you recommend a good ground location under the dash? If the grounds are ok (the bolt head to the right of the hatch release, or the painted metal the flashers clip onto), then I guess I continue upstream. Even though I have a '98, I found a good deal on '99 Helms manual previously. I found the schematic on page 8-55, but I'm not great at interpreting such things.

For the hazards, it says it uses power distribution cell 10 & fuse 1 (20A), which goes to the hazard flasher, which connects to the turn/hazzard switch assy. For the Turn B/U, it uses fuse 2 (20A), seems to get power from Fuse Block Details Cell 11, connects to the turn flasher, which connects to the turn hazzard switch assy. I'm going to upload a photo of the schematic...

JimMueller

iTrader: (9)

Even though fuse 1 & fuse 2 looked fine, I swapped them with other working 20A fuses from the same panel and no change. The only new fuses I have are the style which go in the engine bay blocks.

The 'Hazard lamps inop' steps refer to repairing an open in ckt 27 and/or 140. Any other ideas?

wssix99

iTrader: (5)

Pic?


I'd use the outer casing of the cigar lighter. If you don't get voltage at the flashers, I'd check to see if you have voltage at the fuses also.

NoSloZ_1

I have this same issue too. When I flip the turn signal switch the arrow lights up on the dash but doesn't flash. It's the same for both sides. Where is the flasher relay at? All the fuses in the fuse box are good. Any ideas?

WhiteBird00

iTrader: (4)

One of two things - you have one or more bulbs burned out on each side or the turn signal flasher needs to be replaced. (There are other possibilities but those are the most common).

Turn on your hazard flashers and walk around the car checking to see which bulbs are not flashing then replace those bulbs. Chances are it will be the front because they are prone to getting water in them and blowing bulbs.

If all bulbs flash properly using the hazards then the turn signal flasher is clipped under the dash just to the right of the opening when you remove the knee panel under the steering column (it's right above the OBD II port).

JimMueller

iTrader: (9)

WSSIX99: Uploading hopefully better pics than post 7 now; photobucket is being sluggish. I used the cig lighter outer metal ring as ground and still no voltage at either pin, with the flash completely removed or with the flash slightly pulled off so I can reach the pins. The DMM either registers 0 or 0F. Works fine when I tested battery voltage.I forgot about checking at fuse 1&2, I'll check 'em tonight.

NoSloZ 1: That's not the same issue; I do not get any turn signal lights on the dash or at any lamp when using turn signals or hazards. Start with WhiteBird's suggestions.

WhiteBird00

iTrader: (4)

Wow, that's interesting. That would certainly explain the symptoms but it leaves the question of why no power to the flasher? Since the fuse itself is good, I suspect you'll find that there is no power in the fuse socket either. That would mean a fusible link is blown or a wire is broken somewhere. Probably not much fun to trace.

JimMueller

iTrader: (9)

Maybe these will show better detail:

NoSloZ_1

When I put my flashers on only the rear taillights flash. I pulled the front turn signal bulbs and they were both fine. I'm gonna replace the flasher and see if that helps.

wssix99

iTrader: (5)

I see brown here in one connector but not in the other. I think the grey wires in the other connector were intended to be grey at one point.

With the way cars are made, its not surprising that different parts/connectors could have different wires with different insulations. Its also common to see the colors off a little between parts.

On the drawing in your book, you'll see connector C216. On the wires, letters are listed, which indicates their position on the connector. That connector may also have small letters stamped in to it, which correspond to the book. (Sometimes they don't.)

WhiteBird00

iTrader: (4)

The old "let's throw some parts at it and see if that helps" method of diagnosis.

How do you know the bulbs are fine? Did you replace working bulbs (perhaps in the taillights) with them and see them work? "I see them go on with the headlights" doesn't help because they are dual filament bulbs and the filament that lights with the headlights is not the same one that lights with the turn signals and DRLs. And even if the bulbs really are fine, that doesn't mean that the sockets aren't corroded and preventing power from getting to the bulbs - a common occurrence with these cars because water gets in through cracked lenses and settles in the sockets that are badly positioned at the bottom of the housing.

Use a test light (or multimeter) to check if power is getting to the contacts in the socket. The blue wire on each side carries power for DRLs and turn signals. The brown wire on each side carries power for the parking/running lights. The black wire on each side goes to ground. If you get power and ground as designed then your bulbs definitely are the problem. If not, you need to work your way back through the DRL module, the turn signal switch, the flasher, the fuse, and the fusible link until you find where the power stops.

It is possible that a new flasher may solve the problem although that is somewhat unlikely based on the described symptoms. It is always better to figure out the source of a problem before going out and buying parts.

JimMueller

iTrader: (9)

Took it to a shop, this was a damaged power wire on the engine side of the firewall. Repaired and I got my blinkers, hazards, and horn working again. Not sure if fixed anything which I didn't notice.