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Audio question, swapping Camaro head unit into Trans Am.
My stock delco head unit is wearing out, the LCD screen intermittently goes blank and I have lost a good amount of illumination at night time so the head unit is pretty dark. Since I am using this as an excuse to change up the very tired and dull monochrome red dash lighting of my Trans Am to the Camaro light blue hue which I prefer, I am going to swap the stock Camaro delco head unit onto my bird. I would like to know if there is any difference between the delco/monsoon head unit with the delco/bose head unit that are available for this swap.
My car has the monsoon speaker system with factory amplifier but I was forced to swap all my speakers and tweeters to Kee Audio's CDT brand after the supply ran out of NOS delco speakers. I will admit, the kit he sold me is pretty damn amazing with my stock head unit, albeit with limitations on how high I can crank up the volume, limited by my head unit as per the installing audio store. However, I want a Camaro head unit and I am willing to give up my equalizers for two simple buttons, treble and bass. I am looking to purchase a refurbished Camaro delco head unit with a new built-in 3.5mm aux input for an MP3/Iphone/Ipod but my choices are the regular delco or Bose/delco head unit. Is there any difference or compatibility problems I should be aware of?
Doing some deep research on other threads and other forums, it seems to be that the difference between the "Delco Electronics"/"Monsoon" head unit with the "Bose"/Delco head unit is the speakers. The Bose speakers have their own built-in amps whereas the conventional and monsoon system has the head unit powering the tweeters front and rear despite both head units having the same identical plug connections. This is what is throwing me off about the difference. The last thing I want is to buy the Bose and not have sound from my CDT speakers and/or tweeters because of the slight incompatibility.
The safe bet is probably just to get the Delco Electronics head unit which is no different from a "Monsoon" labeled head unit.
I look so forward to this swap, it will feel and look like a "new" car but all I will end up doing is to "Camarofy" the interior of a Firebird. I am just trying to fix the design details of my bird's interior that have bothered me all these years after seeing how the Camaro interior lighting compared. I am also happy as sin that for the most part I can interchange parts with the exception of the dimmer/headlight switch which will need some minor modification work to get the overlay to work for my Firebird, cut and stick I suppose. The gauge overlay and resetting the red needles will be fun to do...
Really, Chevy should adopt the Firebird as an additional cosmetic option to their Camaro. For a few more hundreds of dollars you get "Firebird" badges for the type of model, front and rear bumper covers, hood, and trunk with spoiler. In addition, even for the Camaro, they should offer 21st century streamlined hideaway lights as an additional cosmetic option. You will now have the Firebird back but under the Chevy brand and GM doesn't stand to take much risk if they offer the Firebird up as an increased dollar cosmetic alternative to the Camaro. The two cars are siblings, after all! It's just, you have those who prefer one style over the other style and case in point, what I am doing with my car! It is GM customization by customer preference! I digress, ha ha!
Last edited by Phoenix'97; 08-19-2018 at 10:12 AM.
DO NOT use a Bose head unit with a Monsoon system - you will be extremely disappointed with the results. The two systems may have the same physical connector but they are worlds apart in electronics. Bose system head units output low level (pre-amp) signal designed for extremely low impedance (1-ohm) individual amplifiers at each speaker. Monsoon system head units are ordinary Delco units (the base, unamplified audio system HU and the Monsoon HU are the same electrically) which output speaker level signal into a single 8-channel amp with 4-ohm input impedance. The higher impedance of the Monsoon amp wouldn't hurt the Bose HU but the output level of the HU will not be nearly enough to drive the amp.
The Monsoon amps are also different between Camaro and Firebird (it powered all speakers in Camaros but not the front and rear tweeters in Firebirds) but you're not changing the amp so that shouldn't affect your project.
There are some small differences between the Camaro and Firebird versions of the Monsoon head unit other than display illumination color. The face plate is also a different color (black vs grey), the Firebird has an equalizer while the Camaro has automatic speed compensated volume (which won't work in a Firebird because the VSS wire isn't in the Firebird harness). Conversely, Camaros didn't come with power antennas so I don't know if the Camaro HU has the necessary output to control the Firebird power antenna... I suspect it will work but I've never tried it.
DO NOT use a Bose head unit with a Monsoon system - you will be extremely disappointed with the results. The two systems may have the same physical connector but they are worlds apart in electronics. Bose system head units output low level (pre-amp) signal designed for extremely low impedance (1-ohm) individual amplifiers at each speaker. Monsoon system head units are ordinary Delco units (the base, unamplified audio system HU and the Monsoon HU are the same electrically) which output speaker level signal into a single 8-channel amp with 4-ohm input impedance. The higher impedance of the Monsoon amp wouldn't hurt the Bose HU but the output level of the HU will not be nearly enough to drive the amp.
It is a damn good thing I ordered the refurbished and improved regular Delco head unit then! Thank you for clarifying the problems I would have been dealing with and the disappointment from it.
Originally Posted by WhiteBird00
The Monsoon amps are also different between Camaro and Firebird (it powered all speakers in Camaros but not the front and rear tweeters in Firebirds) but you're not changing the amp so that shouldn't affect your project.
There are some small differences between the Camaro and Firebird versions of the Monsoon head unit other than display illumination color. The face plate is also a different color (black vs grey), the Firebird has an equalizer while the Camaro has automatic speed compensated volume (which won't work in a Firebird because the VSS wire isn't in the Firebird harness). Conversely, Camaros didn't come with power antennas so I don't know if the Camaro HU has the necessary output to control the Firebird power antenna... I suspect it will work but I've never tried it.
I did find a forum discussion about using a Camaro head unit in a Firebird which clearly has been done before! As long as my Camaro head unit needs to be powered on and I have the option for the power antenna, my power antenna will still function as always. With the speed compensated volume control, a Firebird owner who had the Camaro head unit was complaining about volume changes during different driving conditions unaware his head unit was from a Camaro and NOT the factory head unit that comes equipped with the Firebird! The first picture I posted was from that forum thread. Does this prove that I may be able to use speed compensated volume even without the VSS wire? No, but I will find out. Depending upon how these cars were set up to cut costs, maybe I already have a VSS wire in my harness but it was never used since I have a Firebird and the wire harnesses were shared with the Camaros? Even so, I read that a lot of guys hated this function and they just set it to the lowest setting to adjust the volume manually, as you normally would. So, if I don't have this feature then I won't cry about it. I am just doing this purely for cosmetic reasons, the light blue/cyan backlighting that the Camaro has is what I want on my Trans Am. Even though we associate fire with red and orange, fire also emits blue and white color!
Yes, I trade up the equalizers for bass and treble adjustment but really, with my Kee Audio CDT speakers and tweeters, the effects are not as profound as it was with the Delco speakers. I can make my tweeters a bit louder and significantly boost clarity (treble) while adjusting the level of thumping of my speakers (bass), so I think the Camaro head unit won't be that much of a disappointment, just a simpler head unit to use since playing with the equalizers takes time and each day I am never happy with the settings, especially when driving around!
Last edited by Phoenix'97; 08-20-2018 at 09:33 PM.
I suspect that the poster complaining about varying volume was experiencing the not uncommon problem of the volume potentiometer getting gummed up and causing random volume changes. There have been a number of reports on here of that problem in both Camaros and Firebirds. It usually can be repaired by simply using a generous amount of electronics cleaner spray on the volume control. It is simply not possible for a Camaro head unit installed in a Firebird to change volume based on vehicle speed because the necessary speed signal is not in the Firebird factory stereo harness. As you mention, for many this is a blessing because the speed sensitive volume was not a popular feature but it became a sticking point when installing double DIN navigation head units in Firebirds because they had no access to vehicle speed for estimating location when the GPS signal dropped out (going through a tunnel, etc.).
The monsoon faq sticky shows the difference in wiring between models. Look for the pinout images to see things easier. The Firebird doesn't have a vss signal like the Camaro. The convertible cars also have a different wire than the non-convertibles. You can always add wires or switch things around if you know what you're doing though.
The monsoon faq sticky shows the difference in wiring between models. Look for the pinout images to see things easier. The Firebird doesn't have a vss signal like the Camaro. The convertible cars also have a different wire than the non-convertibles. You can always add wires or switch things around if you know what you're doing though.
The most I can do is replace wires, splicing in new ones and melting butt connectors for a solid connection. Aside from that I have to pay a shop to do major wiring work which, although an audio shop did a rather butcher job on my door panels to fit the Kee Audio CDT speakers, they did a satisfactory job of wiring up the car. Yeah, I suppose down the road when I take out a loan to have my car restomodded and media blasted, having some underbody metal replacement done then painted for the best possible protection against salt and moisture exposure, I can see if that shop will hook my car up with the Camaro audio wiring harness to give my Firebird that VSS capability.
Off topic, I have some neat ideas for cosmetic alterations so it will be cool to see it come to life.
If you really wanted to enable speed sensitive volume after installing a Camaro HU in a Firebird, you can splice into the VSS signal at the instrument cluster connector - it's the only dark green/white wire in the connector. Run your new wire from there to the white half of the factory stereo connector and position it in pin 16 which is the position right next to the split on the 6-pin side of the split (pinout is in the Monsoon FAQ sticky). You can get a spare pin to insert in the connector from the 9-pin remote CD changer connector if you don't have the optional changer. Or you can buy a Metra harness adapter for a few dollars just to get the pins.
But I really don't think you'll miss that feature of the Camaro HU - the implementation back then was rather clunky and the volume changes were noticeable. I have speed compensated volume in my Mustang and it works really well - I never notice a volume change but I also never have to manually adjust the volume because of changes in road noise due to speed (except when I have the top down).
Whitebird nailed it. Tap a wire and plug it into the stereo connector and you're good to go. I had the speed volume thing in one of my cars and really liked it, but I wouldn't go out of my way to add it. I find it's better to quiet the rattles and tighten up the seals so the volume doesn't need to drown out the sound of poorly built lol.
If you really wanted to enable speed sensitive volume after installing a Camaro HU in a Firebird, you can splice into the VSS signal at the instrument cluster connector - it's the only dark green/white wire in the connector. Run your new wire from there to the white half of the factory stereo connector and position it in pin 16 which is the position right next to the split on the 6-pin side of the split (pinout is in the Monsoon FAQ sticky). You can get a spare pin to insert in the connector from the 9-pin remote CD changer connector if you don't have the optional changer. Or you can buy a Metra harness adapter for a few dollars just to get the pins.
Originally Posted by bammax
Whitebird nailed it. Tap a wire and plug it into the stereo connector and you're good to go. I had the speed volume thing in one of my cars and really liked it, but I wouldn't go out of my way to add it. I find it's better to quiet the rattles and tighten up the seals so the volume doesn't need to drown out the sound of poorly built lol.
I have used a wire tap to allow dimming of my pillar arm gauges, I couldn't stand them remaining bright while the rest of my interior lighting would dim out and it took some time to locate the correct dimming wire. With regards to this suggestion, I need to tap my gauge cluster harness and then attach a connecting pin to that wire and hook it up to my radio? It is bad enough that I am going to have to play games swapping the gauge cluster overlay and needles from a Camaro onto my Trans AM and calibrate the needles as best I can, but to mess around with tapping the gauge cluster harness, I don't know. I feel like I can live without speed sensitive volume until the day comes when I can have my harness made to accommodate this feature as if it came stock from the factory.
The Monsoon amps are also different between Camaro and Firebird (it powered all speakers in Camaros but not the front and rear tweeters in Firebirds) but you're not changing the amp so that shouldn't affect your project.
Originally Posted by WhiteBird00
Nowhere in this thread does it say that the tweeters are powered off the head unit in a Camaro Monsoon system. Only Firebirds have the tweeters run off the head unit. Both models have 8-channel Monsoon amps. Camaros have eight speakers (door mids and tweeters, sail panel subs, and hatch) so the amp powers all of them. Firebirds have ten speakers (door mids and tweeters, sail panel subs, hatch mids and tweeters) and the subs are both dual voice coil making a total of twelve channels so the four tweeters run off the head unit and the other eight channels run off the amp.
Now this is something I overlooked. If my current Pontiac Delco head unit powers the tweeters in my car and I am now switching to the Camaro Delco head unit, do I essentially lose those tweeters? Will my car need to have the aftermarket wiring tweaked to get those tweeters to work with the Camaro head unit?
No need to worry... the factory head unit (both Camaro and Firebird) simply outputs four channels of audio signal just as they do in a basic non-amplified system. In the Firebird, in addition to providing input for the Monsoon amp, those four channels also split off in the factory harness to provide unamplified signal to the front and rear tweeters. The wiring that splits off to the tweeters also has inline high pass filters to protect the tweeters from receiving low signal they can't handle. So swapping in a Camaro HU will have no impact on the Firebird tweeters because it's all handled in the wiring rather than in the HU.
No need to worry... the factory head unit (both Camaro and Firebird) simply outputs four channels of audio signal just as they do in a basic non-amplified system. In the Firebird, in addition to providing input for the Monsoon amp, those four channels also split off in the factory harness to provide unamplified signal to the front and rear tweeters. The wiring that splits off to the tweeters also has inline high pass filters to protect the tweeters from receiving low signal they can't handle. So swapping in a Camaro HU will have no impact on the Firebird tweeters because it's all handled in the wiring rather than in the HU.
Okay. It still reads to me like I will lose those tweeters since the Camaro head unit won't provide the unamplified signal to the tweeters unlike my Firebird head unit. I was hoping that you would say that since I have those tweeters and they run off of the radio signal that due to the Firebird harness they would still work without a problem. The only way I will know for certain is to plug in the new head unit and test out the sound quality which will happen today. I couldn't pass up a restored head unit with a built in auxiliary input for ipod/iphone plug in, new CD player mechanism, a full cleaning, and new backlights.
Last edited by Phoenix'97; 08-25-2018 at 10:18 AM.
I don't know how to explain it more clearly... the Camaro and Firebird head units are identical in terms of their audio output and only the wiring in the cars makes the difference in the number of supported speakers. In other words, it doesn't matter if you plug in a Firebird head unit, a Camaro one, or even a Buick or Oldsmobile one from the same time period - all of the speakers will work, including the extra Firebird tweeters.
I don't know how to explain it more clearly... the Camaro and Firebird head units are identical in terms of their audio output and only the wiring in the cars makes the difference in the number of supported speakers. In other words, it doesn't matter if you plug in a Firebird head unit, a Camaro one, or even a Buick or Oldsmobile one from the same time period - all of the speakers will work, including the extra Firebird tweeters.
This second time around is much more better, thank you! I understood what you wrote initially but the wording is a tad technical to a moron like me. Anyways the new radio is in and all I have to say is, either the refurbishing work made the difference or the Camaro radio has more power to send to my tweeters. The audio in my car is now significantly louder on any station, it is right up there with brand new aftermarket head units. My only complaint is the bass, while I can adjust treble to maximum to give me sharp crystal sound, the bass kicks in too early and doesn't use my speakers to their full ability. I guess this was the sacrifice I made when trading off my equalizer. Even so, I care more about treble, hearing the music crystal clear and loud, versus turning my car into a thumping machine begging for a ticket in the suburbs. Only two of the three bolts will hold the radio in place and you have to use the plastic tab on the left side to align the radio! It is not quite a nice fitment once you put the bezel back on, you need to back off the metal tabs turning them left and then force the upper tabs on first and then force the bottom tabs in. You will need to keep adjusting until the bottom corner, particularly on the left side locks in place. It passes for factory fitment from a distance but a driver of 10 years will see the slight bow but it looks nice and the audio improvement was worth all this trouble.
I also successfully swapped the Camaro gauge cluster and clear shield into my Trans Am. I am confident the needle calibrations I made are as good as I can get them given the needle moves the shaft when pressing down to secure it. I just need to drive around town to test my speedometer but when you power up the car it lifts up along with the tach so you need to zero them which they are pretty dead on give or take a fine offset. I did run the car, idle is spot on at 1000, temperature does start to climb from where the needle rests initially, oil pressure fluxuates, the battery power is right where it should be after a few minutes of charging, and the fuel gauge was near 1/2 before I messed with the gauge cluster.
I swapped on the Camaro HVAC cover and headlight/dimmer overlay which, even though they are smaller in size to the Firebird, they will adhere to the switch and once you put the gauge visor back on, you won't see the gap that exists!
Last edited by Phoenix'97; 08-25-2018 at 03:37 PM.
How rude of me, I never thanked you WhiteBird00. Thank you for your help!
I just test drove my "White Steed". The radio backlighting with the exception of the LCD display, gauge cluster, HVAC controls, Headlight/Dimmer switch, and my pillar arm gauges all light up white since I am still using incandescent bulbs. I think this new look is sweet and I am going to stick with it for awhile, it matches the color of the car and I am just blown away that I am not seeing monochrome red! Most important, my speedometer is functioning along with all other gauges and I got the temp up to 210 so now I know my calibration work was as good as I could do it by hand with the shaft moving during needle install.
08-18-2018, 05:23 PM
Audio question, swapping Camaro head unit into Trans Am. 
