Bolt on z28 and 16g talon
10-11-2007, 10:01 AM
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Bolt on z28 and 16g talon I finally got a chance to set up a run with a friend of mine with his talon. His car is front wheel drive with a 16g at 22lbs, FMIC, full exhaust, and very mild cams. He runs pretty consistent mid-low 13's at about 109-110 with no traction. My mods are in my sig. The first time was from about 45-120 and i put about 1 to 1.5 cars on him. Next he said from 30, but i don't think he knew that was first gear for me. I honked and pulled out almost a car by the time i was into second. I shut it down at 100 with around 1.5 cars on him. I was impressed with that talon, should be an easy 12 second car with some traction. He told me that i was the first person he lost too and he said "if my only loss is to a bolt on ls1 i must not be doing that bad". He is also a former f-body owner and unlike a lot of import drivers has a lot of respect for the cars. I was happy with this kill since the last 16g car i raced was a WRX and he got me by a nose, but that was on stock exhaust. That WRX is coming back in town with meth and a FMIC that he did not have last time and we are going to try and get some video. The talon should be getting meth soon and hopefully we can all partake in the video when the WRX is back in town. I don't have any video of these runs but the best i can do is a few pics of the cars.
10-11-2007, 01:25 PM
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Nice kill, I raced two talons and a GSX last weekend one was a 14b@21psi and I put bus lengths on him the other was a big 16g @ spiking 24psi and settling around 17 running E85 big injectors race manifold and a diet he put 1.5 on me from 40-120, also raced a 98 GSX 50trim not sure much esle about it who put 3/4 car on me from 40-120, they can be quick cars if built right. but most who own them crank up the boost on there stock turbos and blow there engine to ****, kind of like the first talon I raced (**** talker who can't back it up).
10-11-2007, 03:03 PM
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Yeah nice Talon. I dont get dsm owners running so much boost, it usually makes the car slower cause kr kicks in. DSMs dont require anything but exhaust, bc, and dsmlink to be badass 12 sec cars, but everyone wants to but all this useless **** and boost them to the moon thinking they will be fast and most of the time they arent. Sorry for the rant but I am a former dsm owner and I seen this played out countless times and think it is stupid. Hell my car did what your friends car does on 16psi with no fmic and no cams.
10-11-2007, 03:32 PM
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Yeah nice Talon. I dont get dsm owners running so much boost, it usually makes the car slower cause kr kicks in. DSMs dont require anything but exhaust, bc, and dsmlink to be badass 12 sec cars, but everyone wants to but all this useless **** and boost them to the moon thinking they will be fast and most of the time they arent. Sorry for the rant but I am a former dsm owner and I seen this played out countless times and think it is stupid. Hell my car did what your friends car does on 16psi with no fmic and no cams.
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10-11-2007, 03:57 PM
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I read up on the turbo; most sites said on pump gas with no meth it would max out at in the low 20's as far as psi is concerned and around 320whp. So I think it all adds up. Anyone more fluent with turbos or dsm's feel free to spread the knowledge.
10-11-2007, 05:16 PM
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Yeah nice Talon. I dont get dsm owners running so much boost, it usually makes the car slower cause kr kicks in. DSMs dont require anything but exhaust, bc, and dsmlink to be badass 12 sec cars, but everyone wants to but all this useless **** and boost them to the moon thinking they will be fast and most of the time they arent. Sorry for the rant but I am a former dsm owner and I seen this played out countless times and think it is stupid. Hell my car did what your friends car does on 16psi with no fmic and no cams.
10-21-2007, 11:14 AM
#13
Well had and have a few dsms. My favorite toys after my f bodies.
There are a few 16g models..small 16, big 16 ,etc. 22 is pretty low for them they can do closer to 30 on race gas or alc injection or e85. One was doing 11.99 at our local track.It was awd car think close to stock weight. Stock weight on awd is around 3100 ish, fwd are quite a bit lighter maybe 2700 or so.Fwd have no traction and usually get good wheel hop also. They require drag tires to get good times although they can be pretty good from rolls. Awd get killer 60fts on street tires even. 1.7 or better is not that hard to do.
I have three dsms currently. 91 laser fwd 5 spd. Selling that one. 91 talon auto awd turbo dedicated race car project should have no trouble hitting my goal of 10s next season.This car is lightened big time. Not street legal.
97 talon awd turbo 5 speed street toy. This car also has true 10 second potential.
The dsms came around the 200 hp stock. You can add a k and n filter,catback and up the boost with cheap 100 buck or less boost controller and approach 275 to 300 engine hp at bit over 15psi and they are pretty light. You can swap turbos in an afternoon easily and get 400 engine,500 engine,600 or more engine. Of course as you go bigger on power you have to add in support mods.Fuel pumps are pretty cheap like 100 bucks, bigger injectors..300 bucks. tuning of course too. Can go 300 to about 1000 for tuning. More if you want to go say AEM EMS but most guys today run something called dsmlink its about 500 bucks plus new ecu if you need a eprom one. Cams are easy to install as well 300 bucks or so for good cams and you can get nice sheet metal intake manifolds for around 500 bucks.
Turbos cost around 700 to 1500 or so. Big intercoolers youi can do off ebay for cheap or get brand name stuff for 500 to 1000.
Of course at real high power levels you also need to buy better axles..500 to 1000 or so for them front and back. Upgrade the clutch for much past 300 engine hp.They run 400 to 1500 roughly if you want to go twin disc maybe. And tranny upgrades also with things like welded or 4 spider diffs are necessary at the really high power levels. Of course also good idea to forge up engines..factory cranks are pretty strong. And factory engines can take like 400 to 500 engine hp if you are a good tuner.
Anyway this guy above sounds like he could have another 50 to 100 hp possibly from tuning and running race gas or alc injection,e85.Now you can see how even 400 engine hp with a evo big 16 turbo in a car that weighs 2700 to 3100 depending on fwd or awd could haul some good ***. Similar power to weight of a c5 z06.Course off boost the cars are poochy no big torque like our v8s. Thats why much as I love my dsm turboed up 4 bangers I will love my twin turboed up 408 ta that much more.
But it is fun revving the little 4 bangers to 9000 or so rpm.
There are a few 16g models..small 16, big 16 ,etc. 22 is pretty low for them they can do closer to 30 on race gas or alc injection or e85. One was doing 11.99 at our local track.It was awd car think close to stock weight. Stock weight on awd is around 3100 ish, fwd are quite a bit lighter maybe 2700 or so.Fwd have no traction and usually get good wheel hop also. They require drag tires to get good times although they can be pretty good from rolls. Awd get killer 60fts on street tires even. 1.7 or better is not that hard to do.
I have three dsms currently. 91 laser fwd 5 spd. Selling that one. 91 talon auto awd turbo dedicated race car project should have no trouble hitting my goal of 10s next season.This car is lightened big time. Not street legal.
97 talon awd turbo 5 speed street toy. This car also has true 10 second potential.
The dsms came around the 200 hp stock. You can add a k and n filter,catback and up the boost with cheap 100 buck or less boost controller and approach 275 to 300 engine hp at bit over 15psi and they are pretty light. You can swap turbos in an afternoon easily and get 400 engine,500 engine,600 or more engine. Of course as you go bigger on power you have to add in support mods.Fuel pumps are pretty cheap like 100 bucks, bigger injectors..300 bucks. tuning of course too. Can go 300 to about 1000 for tuning. More if you want to go say AEM EMS but most guys today run something called dsmlink its about 500 bucks plus new ecu if you need a eprom one. Cams are easy to install as well 300 bucks or so for good cams and you can get nice sheet metal intake manifolds for around 500 bucks.
Turbos cost around 700 to 1500 or so. Big intercoolers youi can do off ebay for cheap or get brand name stuff for 500 to 1000.
Of course at real high power levels you also need to buy better axles..500 to 1000 or so for them front and back. Upgrade the clutch for much past 300 engine hp.They run 400 to 1500 roughly if you want to go twin disc maybe. And tranny upgrades also with things like welded or 4 spider diffs are necessary at the really high power levels. Of course also good idea to forge up engines..factory cranks are pretty strong. And factory engines can take like 400 to 500 engine hp if you are a good tuner.
Anyway this guy above sounds like he could have another 50 to 100 hp possibly from tuning and running race gas or alc injection,e85.Now you can see how even 400 engine hp with a evo big 16 turbo in a car that weighs 2700 to 3100 depending on fwd or awd could haul some good ***. Similar power to weight of a c5 z06.Course off boost the cars are poochy no big torque like our v8s. Thats why much as I love my dsm turboed up 4 bangers I will love my twin turboed up 408 ta that much more.
But it is fun revving the little 4 bangers to 9000 or so rpm.
10-21-2007, 05:18 PM
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^well put, I have seen some very fast dsms with very few mods but I have seen alot of slow pos's with alot of mods. They are cool when they run but are probably the most unreliable and hard to work on car in the world. I swore to myself that I would never own another dsm until I have mass amounts of money to fix everything that breaks. And pay other people to change head gasket and timing belts, dsms are a major PITA and require very educated mod decisions to have a fast reliable one.
10-21-2007, 05:51 PM
#15
Well I have had 5 over last three years or so. 90 talon awd turbo 5 spd,91 laser turbo 5 spd fwd,92 talon awd turbo 5 spd, 97 awd turbo 5 spd highly modded and 90 talon auto awd turbo race car project.
I find them pretty easy to work on. Spark plug changes take 5 minutes, plug wire changes 5 minutes. Fuel filter is a bit annoying maybe half hour.
02 sensor easy,knock sensor pretty easy. I can do cam swaps in a couple hours. I can swap out turbos in an afternoon easy. Timing belt job can take a day or so if you take your time. Afternoon if you have done a couple.
Head gaskets well never blown one. Timing belt breakage never had one break.I found mine to be pretty reliable if you do maintenance on them. Lots of problems on these cars seem to be from young kids owning them first,most are high mileage and have been ridden hard and put away wet.
People dont' change the timing belt or cheap on parts when doing it. People dont' seem to do the basic maintenance even though its pretty cheap and easy.Many I buy run bad from simple plugs not changed out or old old wires, fuel filter never changed,etc.
Its pretty easy to get that first 75 or 100 hp increase for cheap but after that it does take turbo swap and support mods like fuel upgrades and tuning and better clutch. Engines especially the old 6 bolt from 90 to 92 and half can take a 400 to 500 hp pretty much left alone.
So while I see lots of guys fixing this or that on their dsms I can't say mine have been that unreliable. But I do know the cars well now and do keep some spare parts around. Parts of the 1st gen dsms are really cheap and easily available. 2nd gen parts are a bit harder to find.
Also the newer 7 bolt engines are known for something called crankwalk. My 97 has older 6 bolt 2.4 engine from hyundai sonata. Its a mits motor.
I am keeping my 97 talon and my 91 race talon. Sold 92 talon and 90 talon off and am selling 91 laser. I flip them for some extra cash occasionally.
Also its possible to get one to run 11s for maybe 2500 bucks or so.
Evo big 16 turbo,fuel pump and injectors, maf tranlator and cheap scantool,better clutch, k and n filter and maybe catback.
I find them pretty easy to work on. Spark plug changes take 5 minutes, plug wire changes 5 minutes. Fuel filter is a bit annoying maybe half hour.
02 sensor easy,knock sensor pretty easy. I can do cam swaps in a couple hours. I can swap out turbos in an afternoon easy. Timing belt job can take a day or so if you take your time. Afternoon if you have done a couple.
Head gaskets well never blown one. Timing belt breakage never had one break.I found mine to be pretty reliable if you do maintenance on them. Lots of problems on these cars seem to be from young kids owning them first,most are high mileage and have been ridden hard and put away wet.
People dont' change the timing belt or cheap on parts when doing it. People dont' seem to do the basic maintenance even though its pretty cheap and easy.Many I buy run bad from simple plugs not changed out or old old wires, fuel filter never changed,etc.
Its pretty easy to get that first 75 or 100 hp increase for cheap but after that it does take turbo swap and support mods like fuel upgrades and tuning and better clutch. Engines especially the old 6 bolt from 90 to 92 and half can take a 400 to 500 hp pretty much left alone.
So while I see lots of guys fixing this or that on their dsms I can't say mine have been that unreliable. But I do know the cars well now and do keep some spare parts around. Parts of the 1st gen dsms are really cheap and easily available. 2nd gen parts are a bit harder to find.
Also the newer 7 bolt engines are known for something called crankwalk. My 97 has older 6 bolt 2.4 engine from hyundai sonata. Its a mits motor.
I am keeping my 97 talon and my 91 race talon. Sold 92 talon and 90 talon off and am selling 91 laser. I flip them for some extra cash occasionally.
Also its possible to get one to run 11s for maybe 2500 bucks or so.
Evo big 16 turbo,fuel pump and injectors, maf tranlator and cheap scantool,better clutch, k and n filter and maybe catback.
10-22-2007, 01:55 AM
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I agree that 6-bolt cars and early 7-bolt cars seem pretty tough but 2gs are notorious for being a PITA. I have friends who beat the **** out of their 1gs and have no problems but I also have friends who were victims of crankwalk. I know someone who went through 6 motors in 50,000miles, DSM knew the problem existed and did nothing to correct it. Like I said I will own another dsm but only when I am in a good financial position. American muscle is the way to go for reliability and power.
