chub406

nice. thanks! now something i saw on there it looked like the panhard bar was connected to the fram on the passanger side and connected to the rear end on the driver side. isnt it connected to the rear end on the passenger side?

leadfoot4

iTrader: (1)

If you look at the pictures that "ScrapSilicon" posted of the torque arm, you can see that the part of the torque arm that mounts to the tranny is round. This will allow for some rotational movement by the engine as it is revved. The factory torque arm is a rather funky "u-shaped", stamped steel deal which can't allow any rotation, but they compensate by mounting it in a rather soft rubber bushing.

The undercar picture that "BMR" posted of the rear end assembly is taken somewhat "straight up", however the viewpoint is biased "front to rear". In other words, you're looking toward the rear, from under the tranny. The left side, or driver's side of the car, is on the right side of the picture. Therefore, the rather rusty looking bracket that the panhard bar is attached to, is the mounting extension that is welded to the LH side of the rear axle.

mad_steve

iTrader: (2)

When mini-tubbing a f-body, you will notch the frame to some extent. It's actually a sub-frame in terms. Here are a couple of pics of what i'm talking about.


This is a picture of the sub-frame notch on the passenger side.
(the panhard rod mount is removed in this picture for some reason)

This is one of the driver side. A couple plates come with the kit to weld in where you've had to notch the subframe.

chub406

this is the pic i was referring to. this pic.
http://www.umiperformance.com/images/2203e.jpg

i doesnt look attatched to the rear end on the passenger side. unless i am an idiot and dont see it. lol Im wanting to fit a 325/50/15 under the car i build. i know what it takes on a gbody. I wll do some searching and see what else can learn about that. the mini tub doesnt look to bad. D o you have to shorten the rear or just an adjustable panhard bar and just get the rim offset correct? thank you for being so helpful guys! if it wasnt for this website, i wouldn't have learned enough to becomfertable to go to the ls stuff instead of wasting my time with the old carbed stuff. lol thanks!

leadfoot4

iTrader: (1)

The panhard bar attaches to the chassis on one side, the passenger side, and to the rear axle, on the driver's side. It does NOT attach to BOTH sides of the chassis. If it did, the rear couldn't move up and down through suspension travel. Think lower trailing arm, but going from side to side....

jmilz28

iTrader: (13)

This pic has (roughly closest to camera to farthest out):
1. Panhard bar (closest, running horizontally) in red, black stamped piece above it is stock.
2. Adjustable torque arm (red), mounted to tunnel, with DS loop
3. left and right (closer) - red, lower control arms attached to
4. boxed SFCs (red)

I have a similar setup except tith the tranny mounted torque arm and LCA relocation brackets, even have the same shocks. You can do A LOT with this setup, assuming good tires, and it's pretty comfortable and solid. DON'T cheap out on shocks. If this is a drag only car, you can get something like QA1s. Otherwise, you're silly not to get Bilsteins or Konis if it's ever driven on the street.

What is your REAL budget for this project?

mad_steve

iTrader: (2)

We just mini-tubbed this car to tuck the 325's in the wheel wells a good deal. We did narrow the rear end 3" per side also. It's not a necessity, but to get these tires tucked this well, you do need to mini-tub and narrow the rear, otherwise, it looks like a monster truck.

chub406

nice point leadfoot! didnt think about that. i dont have a budget or a car. lol my drag car got stollen 2 months after i got it running by my best friend who all of a sudden had a meth addiction. it took 6 years and 15,000. never got to get on it when i was builing it, is when the ls1 started getting aftermakret support and making cray power and made me wsh i would have built one. now im going to be building another car and is has to be an ls motor. specifickly a 6.0l with a single turbo. i didnt know anything about the f body and was going to retro it into another car. a driver but kinda a sleeper. lol well there is one turbo fbody in town. other than that, there aren't any other fast fbodies that i know of. so i figured learn what i could cause there is tons of turbo support and anyone that seen the car would assume its a 11-12 sec car. i want to be able to run 9's with the boost up and know its easily ubtainable. so im just asking lots of general questions. mainly not understanding the rear ends. but i have a very good understanding from everyone that has helped so far. couldnt you get enough offset to tuck them in with out shortening the rear? or does the mounting brackets get in the way? can you use the back seat with a mini tub? i know its not recommended just asking with the fbody's if the back seat will go in. thanks!

chub406

sry guys. spilled something on my keyboard so sometimes there is letters missing. lol

mad_steve

iTrader: (2)

You're right about the mounting brackets getting in the way, specifically the panhard mount. It's best to just have a narrowed rear with relocated brackets. You will also need a set of offset lower control arms. Here is a link to our offset lowers in our online catalog. You will also be able to find our other parts you may need.

http://www.madmanandcoracing.com/sho....aspx?itemid=7

The back seat can be saved after mini-tubbing. You may need to find an upholster to trim a bit of the sides of the seat, but then again, you may not. On the other hand, if you will be primarily drag racing this car, who needs back seats anyway? Just dead weight. Here's a picture from the same car that I showed you before (the one with the 325's). We mini-tubbed and cut the driveshaft tunnel for torque arm clearance. This car also has an anti-roll inside the trunk, mounted directly to the cage.

BMR Sales2

iTrader: (40)

I like that sway bar setup Steve

chub406

That is bad ***. my last drag car had a cage and a back seat. its going to be a street car that i will occassionaly take to the track. it will have to certify for above 135mph. dont need air conditioning. a weekend cruizer but a driver. my last one had the 660 solid roller, 3500 stall, was going to have 4:10s. i could drive it on the street but it was hard. you ls guys can drive like a stocker, get 20mph, and run 9s. lol im not worried about the mpg and that, its going to run on e85 since im from iowa. want to be completely comfertable if i want to hop on power tour. i can drive it for 100s of miles and not worry. i would like the back seat cause having a 2 seater doesnt sound like fun. going to be a sleeper in a way and would clean house on the street. where do you mount the cage to? I know its to the floor but what are the mounting points? not being a full framed car? off subject. anyone see the heritage t/a. i spent hours looking for that shaker hook for the 4th gen but couldnt find it. also spent hours on here looking for pics of 4th gens with the fire chicken. anyone have any? thanks guys! im starting to get this fbody thing down. lol

leadfoot4

iTrader: (1)

To mount the cage in a unibody car, you generally fabricate 6 "torque boxes", and weld 4 of them to the rocker panels, inside the passenger compartment. 2 will be just ahead of the door opening, under the dashboard; 2 will be just behind the front seats; the remaining 2 will be behind the back seats, above the rear axle, assuming a 6 point cage.

chub406

i see. i would need a 10 point. how do you know exactly where to weld the box's to?

leadfoot4

iTrader: (1)

Well, the main hoop will go right behind the driver's head, so that establishes the location right behind the seats. The front "down bars" will more or less follow the "A" pillar of the car, so where those bar drop to the floor, that establishes where the front boxes go. If you're going forward into the engine compartment from a "dash bar", you'll probably go forward, just inside the shock towers, and possibly tie into them along the way, and then drop to the front frame horns. In the back, I believe there is a "crossmember" of sorts above the rear axle, so you'll probably wels the rear boxes there. That's 8 points... The other two points.....Are they diagonals from the main hoop down toward the tranny tunnel??

chub406

https://ls1tech.com/forums/drag-raci...rness-etc.html
i understand the terms and such. i had a cage on my last car but it was full framed. everything welded to the frame. on these cars, are there specific points besides the subframe connecters? or just where it touches the body? the way i understand it is you dont have to have the 2 bars going to the tranny tunnel. 2 Back frame, 2 main hoop, 2 door bars, 2 down bars off of top halo. that is the 10 i believe but most people attach door bars to the down bars from the top halo.

mad_steve

iTrader: (2)

thank ya!

mad_steve

iTrader: (2)

The easiest way to install a 10-point is to use the Wolfe kit. There are a few options you can choose to make it easier on you, such as jig notching. It comes with the plates you weld to the floor, and then weld the cage to the plates. This is the set-up we usually use, unless someone is asking for a customized cage.

chub406

i looked at their website. Their stuff is bad ***! didnt see what the prices were but the quality looked top notch! i really liked their mini tub kit. it gives you 16 inches of room. that is crazy for a mini tub. at least what im used to. the wolfe kit would be nice. i still am wondering if even with the kit. does it tell you specifically where to weld the plates to that the bars are welded to? does it matter? or as long as the plates are welded to the floor, its fine? its prob a dumb question but like i said. on the full frames, it has to go through the floor and be welded directly to the frame.

mad_steve

iTrader: (2)

The plates usually end up close to the same place, within an inch or so, especially if you get a pre-notched cage.