7camaro7

iTrader: (15)

The z06 and zr1 have different brakes.

I talked to strano since he's the handling guy and I asked him about brakes. I was about to spend $1200+ for a baer front caliper and rotor, and rear rotor kit. That's a big brake front kit.

sam said no need for a big brake kit which will have the same # of pistons in the calipers as we have now for stock. He said if it had mor pistons then maybe it'd be worth it.

I asked about the cross drilled/ slotted/ plain issue too and he said blanks or slotted. I asked why some cars come with drilled stock like the zr1, he said look at the material they're made of. Every little thing matters.

drilled-looks good, but will eventually crack if used too hard


slotted-looks good, they say they'll eat your pads because they slice and yada yada, but I don't see how if you don't MAKE them slice by using them hard. Under hard use maybe then they'll eat pads, but normal use I don't see them being any different than difference in life of softer compound tires. There may be a trade off on life span but just like softer compound tires it depends on how you use them. I haven't had mine long enough to tell you.

Plain-low risk of cracking, holds the most heat(more material), easy to find. I'd say under extreme use they don't keep the pads cool as the others which will cause fade.

Sam Strano

iTrader: (41)

Drilled is about looks, pure and simple. You lose a good bit of swept area, and you structurally weaken the rotor much more than by slotting. And make no mistake, very few rotors are meant to be drilled, and those that are have it taken into account.... The OEM replacements for our cars are NOT meant to be drilled. But some want that bling!

Slotted rotors come in various degrees too, from sucky to excellent. Slotting can be done cheaply and in a half-assed way, and it can be done on cheap rotors too. The combination is even worse than either thing alone.

The only slotteds I like are the ATE's. No they aren't cheap. To begin with they are made by a company you know (or should if you are into cars), Continential-Teves. They are coated, they do not have points at the ends of the slots (because the pattern leaves no ends) that act as stress risers. And they are coated too, all for a very fair price. I can get and sell cheaper rotors... I don't like to because it becomes a hassle. I'll be accused of being a parts snob for it I'm sure, but there are reasons things are cheap---because they are cheap. If you want the brakes to work as they should and last then cheap isn't the best answer. If you are about looks and performance and quality can take a back seat, there are lots of cheap E-bay like options around.

kain01

Was confusing the pads and the rotors, yeah the Z06 has ceramic pads, but I forgot it was the rotors themselves that were carbon ceramic on the ZR1. Plus the ZR1's rotors are an inch larger.

Front/Rear
Z06 = 14/13.4 in diameter rotor
ZR1 = 15/15.5 in diamter rotor

M-ManLA

Wow lots of info. Seems like drilled now a days is used mostly for looks, blanks gives the most life, but slotted has the best performance.

z28bryan

iTrader: (7)

I always say this and I'll say it again. Instead of making a public poll here and going with the best result, I would try to figure out who the experts out there are on this stuff and base your decision on that. I think you'll come out with better overall results in the long run.

For one thing this poll doesn't really give an option for blanks. When you say I prefer stock, it makes it sound like we'd take the stock OEM rotors which are prone to warping. Some people say there's no such thing as rotors warping, but then that would still make the stock rotors more prone to "glazing" or "transferring more pad material, making the stock rotors uneven". Regardless if it's actually warping or not, stock rotors carry these unwanted characteristics.

Sam Strano

iTrader: (41)

And they use different calipers (Brembo for the ZR1, PBR for the Z06) and the Z06 has 6 little pads per front caliper, the ZR1 does not). In fact the brakes are quite different all around but for both having 6-pot front and 4-pot rears.

M-ManLA

What type of rotors does the corvette use?

Sam Strano

iTrader: (41)

What do you mean, what type? They Z06 are drilled, but unlike replacements for our cars, they were meant to be drilled. Further, they have fewer holes tham most aftermarket drilled ones do, and the rotor is a lot bigger @ 14", and designed that way too.

kain01

Yeah I'm talking rotors, and admitted I was wrong. I'll let ya know when I start talking brake systems. Thanks though.

Foxxtron

iTrader: (1)

yup...and despite that, I've observed quite a bit of cracking and higher than expected rotor temperatures on the Z06 brake systems (stock and modfied Z06's and some other vehicles with Z06 retrofits).

Nevertheless, I will never trust a cross-drilled brake rotor over a solid rotor for the same given material composition, mass and dimensions no matter what the duty will require (exception being using pads that outgas continuously throughout the duty, e.g. some "Pagid" branded competition pads).

For those who want to read that SAE GM report, I as an engineer have read it and whilst it has some truth to it, it's mostly tainted by it's miniscule testing procedure, not to mention it has only somewhere around 24 pages with only 4 references. I've read senior year mechanical and materials engineering students provide much better data with much more consistent results over very similar applications, and their report results are very consistent with all of the problems that are associated with drilled rotors. If GM shall approach their study with much more consistency and with much more drawn out details, than I think they too will observe what has been stated about drilled-rotor failures.

Again, it's more relevant to the engineering and less relevant to a major vehicle manufacturer posting a report to a very significant organisation. In short, just because it's a peer-reviewed GM report posted with the Society of Automotive engineering doesn't mean it's ultimately accurate.

BobDoLe

iTrader: (11)

i use drilled/slotted rotors and DO HAVE PROBLEMS.


this is after a few thousand miles.
this style of drilling is advertised as resistant to cracks...

i'd really recommend GOOD blanks with good pads, but if you gotta have drilled holes or slots, i would go with brembo slotted rotors.
i've had oem rotors, cheap drilled/slotted rotors, ebc sport rotors (great) and brembo slotted (best) and to be honest, the brembo slotted rotors were the best out of all. the ebc slotted/drilled had less fade and would take it like a champ going a few miles going up/down a curvy mountain road, but took considerably more pedal effort... then again that could have been the ebc pads too.

M-ManLA

Oh yea forgot to check out Brembo. I will check them also.

z28bryan

iTrader: (7)

If you want a solid proven combo that will last you through the life of the rotor with no worry, get HPS brake pads and Brembo blanks. If you still question that, do a search on them and no question will you get the confidence of many users and experienced track drivers.

Sam Strano

iTrader: (41)

Brembo's are great, but I'm using and recommending more and more ATE's these days. The cost is not a lot different, and many like the fact the ATE's are coated to prevent hat and edge rusting.

None the less not everyone likes the ATE look and I can understand that. I have packages that included HPS's with either Brembo or ATE rotors (and yet other that then add stainless brake lines and ATE fluid too).

wht01ws6ta

iTrader: (45)

Brembo rotors I've had do like to rust. Are the ATEs blanks or slotted with the elliptical type slotting? Do you have ATEs for C5s?

Brakemotive

iTrader: (73)

The rotor is not likely to actually warp, The conditions to physically warp the shape of the rotor are much more than your car can likely generate.

Brake judder is primarily caused by the formation of hard nodules in the iron. Engineers call these nodules heat spots. When I measure warped rotors, I find that the radial runout as referenced to the wheel mounting surface is in spec. So the term "warped" rotor may not be an accurate description of the problem. However, my dial indicator shows elevated bumps from heat spots on the rotor surface. As the rotor passes under the pad, these spots cause brake judder, i.e. pulsating brakes. It only takes a spot .001 inches above the rotor surface to feel brake judder.

Pulsating brakes start with a localized zone of high temperature in the rotor. The most common cause is uneven friction deposition on the rotor. At colder operating temperatures (less than 400 degrees), brake pads work with abrasive friction, just like sandpaper on wood. At higher temperatures, brake pads transfer a thin layer of material to the iron rotor surface. As the rotor heats up, the primary friction force changes from abrasive friction to adherent friction, i.e. pad material is applied to the rotor and simultaneously sheared and the broken chemical bonds cause a resistant friction force. Most racing pads work using adherent friction, which explains why racing pads don't really stop well under cold conditions or normal street driving.

An example of an uneven friction deposit is pad resin glazing. If you get your rotors hot, the resin from the pad will liquify and glaze on the rotor surface. As the pads rub on the elevated glazed surface, it gets a lot hotter, and the heat is localized in just one area of the rotor. When the temperature exceeds 1150F, the cell structure of the iron changes into hard brittle spots called cementite. These heat spots don't wear down like the normal iron material surrounding it. So the spots become elevated above the rotor surface, and you start to feel brake pulsation. You can try to turn down the rotor, but the cementite nodule is often deeper than the cut, so the brake pulsation just comes back after a few weeks

I'm sure it is just a typo but how would a crossdrilled rotor weaken the caliper?

Dimples are basically just small usually diamond shapes cut into the rotor in the same fashion as slotting, They do the same thing as a slotted rotor.

I am not going to argue the point that many of the cheaper Ebay options are not the best options most are Centric Black Hat rotors that have been drilled out or something similar these rotors make great OEM replacement rotors but are not always the best to drill. We do carry a cheaper line that we sell on Ebay our Kinetic line, and have not had any issues with them and we have sold thousands of sets. And for someone looking for a budget option I don't see the problem with using them. We also stock several big name companies too, PowerStop is our biggest line and yes I agree you get what you pay for, but I also think sometimes people get swept up with the Name on a product. Many of the larger brake manufactures use the same foundries and products are often similar in the end. Cheap is not always the best answer you are right, when it comes to modding a car you have three options Performance, Reliability and Cost Effectiveness, and you can pick 2.

GM is known to use cheap factory rotors full of scrap metals, they don't last on any of their cars it's not just an F-body thing. I think by OEM we are talking about Blanks.

Sam Strano

iTrader: (41)

ATE's have the elliptical slotting. But unlike traditional slots, they have no sharp points or edges, and are not cut deep. When the rotor is down to minimum wear thickness the slots actually wear away to tell you and also that thinner slot means less material is lost and the rotor remains stronger.

ATE does have rotors for the C5 (they are even directionally vaned).

One more thing to note. I now carry Racing Brake brand rotors. These are a step beyond the normal street rotors. Meant to take a track pounding and live. The fronts for the LS1 in stock replacement size are directionally vented/vaned... The only ones like this in stock size for the F-body.

wht01ws6ta

iTrader: (45)

That's nice to know. I had looked for directional vanes on F-body rotors and couldn't find any.

Sam Strano

iTrader: (41)

They exist (too late for you now that you have C5 brakes....), but for the others, here they are:

http://www.stranoparts.com/partdetai...D=17&ModelID=7

SScott

iTrader: (21)

Today's pads do not need the slots for gas evacuation and drilled rotors are prone to cracking.