Shenlon

iTrader: (4)

So recently I have been considering a LOT of different options on how I would like to build my 2001 WS6. First I thought about going the FI route and making some sick HP numbers. Then I realized that I really don't spend much time in the upper RPM range and I have never gone to the track, so maybe something that I can get in and just enjoy around town driving. Then I thought about building an entirely separate engine to swap in. Through all of these plans, I had also figured on upgrading the suspension, however I never stopped to think about what kind of power that suspension could support.

So, what's a real number for ballpark figures that I can shoot for engine wise that a well set-up suspension could support? This will be a DD-able car, although it's more of a weekend warrior. I don't go to the dragstrip and don't autocross, however I do enjoy taking the twisty back road routes. I will not be doing a lot of weight removal, however I am open to things like relocating the battery, maybe K-member swap, things of that nature. Just no A/C delete or power steering delete. Here are the suspension/chassis upgrades I have planned:

SLP 3pt SFC (already installed)
Adjustable panhard
Adjustable LCAs
Koni's front/rear from Strano
MWC 9" with LCA brackets & torque arm
18" Fikse FM10 rims - undetermined width

Am I missing anything to make putting power to the road better? Any estimates on what this kind of setup can get to the road without just slinging molten rubber everywhere? I mean don't get me wrong, lighting the tires up is fun, but I enjoy doing burnouts when I do burnouts and when I put the pedal to the floor to GO I don't want to have to back off to regain traction.

Just to clarify a little better, I'm looking for a HP/TQ rating that can be effectively deployed on the street with the aforementioned suspension setup so that I can evaluate what the proper course of action is to build my engine. This way I have an engine and chassis/suspension combo that complement each other well for fun on the streets.

I hope my thoughts are clear enough, it's been a long day. Thanks in advance to everyone that responds.

Cliff notes:
With proper suspension setup, how much power can a 2001 WS6 put to the road? Don't want to be melting rubber all over the place and don't want to build a bigger motor than the chassis/suspension can put down.

ninetres

iTrader: (35)

Cliff notes?

z28bryan

iTrader: (7)

What kid of driving are you doing?

Good tires will give you traction. 18's might make it tough to put power down.

Emulsifide

iTrader: (22)

It's a shame you're stuck on the MWC 9", as I would of suggested Sam Strano's Watts link setup for the ultimate street car. You don't need such a stout rear end for street driving. A standard Moser 9" will suffice for what you want to do. Then you could do the Watts link.

Shenlon

iTrader: (4)

Just standard stoplight/highway driving with some spirited curvy backroads when I get the chance. Nothing too extreme, but I still want a responsive and reliable setup.

I'm not really stuck on the MWC 9", it just seemed like the best deal. If there's a reason to go with something different, then I'm fine with changing that. My problem with the Watts Link is that I haven't been able to feel the difference, and I like how my car handles (for the most part) now, so it's hard for me to throw down a significant chunk of change to swap to a setup that may or may not be more enjoyable for me.

Thanks for the replies thus far, please keep them coming.

Arc00TA

iTrader: (17)

For what its worth, here is my experience. This is from my last car, 99 T/A M6 with an LS6 motor and 3.73 gears in a 10 bolt. The car had upgraded everything in the suspension that could be. Only put down 425rwhp.
- 3 point sfcs
- Torque arm and poly bushing
- LCA's (poly/rod)
- Panhard (poly/rod)
- Torque arm relocation bracket
- Solid MM/Poly trans mount
- Revalved bilstiens on 1LE springs
- Larger solid sways w/ poly links

And the result was? I didn't feel the spinning. Not that it WASN'T spinning, I just couldn't feel it any more. In my opinion some SOFT springs and drag shocks in the back, combined with a sticky tire, might have worked better on the street. I ended up making the back end so stiff that it couldn't squat at all to take up the shock from flooring it, and all I got was uncontrolled spinning through the first 3 gears with street tires (nitto NT555's). I was running 17x11 steamrollers with 315s.

Shenlon

iTrader: (4)

Thanks Arc, thats exactly the kind of feedback I was looking for.

z28bryan

iTrader: (7)

How much money do you want to spend? Spririted daily driving is a real gray area in my opinion and is based upon ones own opinion. I personally would stick with almost all stock stuff for a spirited daily driver, but others would put heads/cam in theirs.

I'll take a stab at what you'd probably want to improve on... simple things you can do that will save you money.

1. Street launching traction
2. Good shocks to dampen car well for good handling
3. You probably want the car to look good?

Shenlon

iTrader: (4)

Budget is pretty open at the moment. You're pretty much spot on z28bryan, I'm not nearly as offended as some people seem to be at the stock ride height. If I was going to lower the car, I would probably either go with Strano's springs or coil-overs to adjust it to my preference. I'm also trying to decide on whether or not I want to go with the Watts link, I've kinda gone back and forth about it in my mind probably a dozen times. Really wish I could ride in one to see the difference.

ThumperNC24

iTrader: (1)

MWC does make their own watts link that will do the same thing......

You have to get it backbraced and then it costs a bit more - but overall it will end up only costing about the same as the Fays2 unit.

I wouldn't shy away from getting the MWC rear.

Shenlon

iTrader: (4)

Yes, I e-mailed Eric to see if it was true that their rear wouldn't work with a Watts link, and he informed me that they sold their own. So, win/win. I can still get their fab 9" and a Watts setup.

SuperSport01

Torque arm relocated off the trans to the trans crossmember isnt a bad idea either.

ThumperNC24

iTrader: (1)

Side note - I have the numbers in Sig and I definitely want more power.

99% street driven.

You can always just not mash it if you have too much power for a situation, but if you want it, then it is there.

z28bryan

iTrader: (7)

In that case.. this is what I would personally do if I were you. I'm just throwing this out there.. maybe use this as a reference and do some homework on each piece:

1. Koni SA's if you want a good set of shocks and think you might possibly go with lowering springs in the future.. you'll be all set. You'll get good handling, damping, roll control, etc. If you want a cheaper route and you definitely wont be going to aftermarket springs ever, get some good Bilstiens.

2. Get some wide wheels in the back.. 17x11 maybe. With a decent tire there, you'll launch well. 17's will launch better than 18's. Tire choice is kinda subjective to what one thinks is acceptable for the street. If going with wide wheels, you will want an adjustable PHB to keep rear centered.

3. Something to put power down better and avoid wheel hop.. if LCA's I'd try the UMI with a roto joint at one end.. could do relo brackets and put LCA in lower holes.. I heard a torque arm can fix wheel hop.. your better shocks will also help prevent wheel hop

4. If you want to limit body roll, get some strano swaybars, or some sort of 35mm front/ 22mm rear setup.. that is generally a good balance. Either that or save money and keep stock rear and get a 32mm front

I'm still on my 10 bolt fwiw.. not saying it's never going to break. But you will save a lot of unsprung weight if you keep the 10.

Arc00TA

iTrader: (17)

What this guy said. Like I stated above, my only problems was too stiff of a spring/shock combo so the suspension would not load at all in the back. Good tires is a must, I would consider something like the 555R for the street.

ThumperNC24

iTrader: (1)

I agree with almost everything here - I wanted lowering springs for the better looks and handling improvements and I was willing to sacrifice a little bit of ride quality (I think it's better than stock still even with lowering springs).

Additionally, definitely just get the brackets if you are going to get sticky tires and launch the car. I have 245/40/18 dunlap direzza star specs and I just sheared two teeth off the ring gear in my 10 bolt (granted I did have 4.10s). Best 60' was 2.14 so its not like i was blasting out of the hole. I didn't have the brackets - wish I did now. I never got wheel hop before because I never really tried to launch the car. Before the tires just spun...new sticky direzzas and actually trying to launch did the 10 bolt in.

Finally, Eric @ MWC will be able to confirm - but he said something about a 9" with aluminum center being a little bit lighter than a 10 bolt....I also believe the torque arm he includes is chrome moly too

z28bryan

iTrader: (7)

9 inch lighter than a 10 bolt? I know there are some 9 inch rears out there that you can get aluminum centers on that are still heavier than a 10 bolt. I don't know anything about this MWC one though

ThumperNC24

iTrader: (1)

I was slightly mistaken - this is what he said to me over a PM

Shenlon

iTrader: (4)

Yea, the structural integrity for possible weight savings or at worst negligible weight gain was the reason that first got me looking into the MWC. I had pretty much decided to go with the Koni's already, but it's good to hear even more positive feedback about them.

Can anyone give feedback on an adjustable coilover setup? I think it's one of those things that I like the concept of, but will get little to no practical use out of it, especially since I will rarely make it to the track.

As far as the wheels go, does going with a wider wheel limit anything with regards to turning performance? I plan on being in the twists and turns just as much as launching, so I need a balance. Also, can anyone give me any feedback on getting the stock WS6 speedlines widened? Is it possible? I really like the look of them, and really hate the cost of new rims .

How would going to 18" rims effect driving performance? Can I do an 18x11?

Finally, I keep seeing that almost everyone with an M6 goes to a 4.11 gear ratio, but I really don't want to up the cruising RPMs because this car does see the highway for decent drives from time to time. Is this not really that big a factor concerning MPG? Is it one of those things that as soon as I ride in a car with them I'll understand?

Has anyone here upgraded to Strano swaybars over the WS6 swaybars? That's one upgrade that I can't seem to find definitive positive feedback on, so I'll keep looking.


Thank you everyone who has responded to this thread, you have helped me immensely with the direction my car will be taking.

ThumperNC24

iTrader: (1)

Wider is better, the additional grip is worth the slight extra weight. When strano races he runs 315s on all corners

I run 18s because I like the look, but overall 17s are better for performance. Probably most noticeable at the dragstrip, but in general heavier is worse and 18s weigh more than 17s. I can't really comment with real numbers, but they are not as good. I don't think the difference is extreme under street conditions - ride quality will be hurt slightly because of lower profile stiffer sidewalls.

I have 4.10s and run 2k RPMs @ 75 on the highway and the performance gain is huge, especially in the seat of the pants department. I broke mine and am putting the same thing back in. It will hurt MPG, but I get 22-23 highway @ over 80mph in my cammed car with 4.10s. I go to college 6 hours from home and have no problem making the drive...

and yes, the strano bars will be way better than the WS6. Definitely worth it - Strano can tell you how much more roll stiffness. it is on my list of things to buy.