My CTS-V Brake Upgrade Thread
07-16-2016, 06:48 AM
#1
My CTS-V Brake Upgrade Thread Well. I'm going to take a crack at this. Please be advised this will be one of my largest undertakings that I will personally tend to so if I make any mistakes, well..live and learn. This project is going to be a slow collection of parts to upgrade my wheels & tires, as well as all 4 Brakes to late CTS-V Brakes. There is a kit out there that allows you to convert the rear brakes with the only exception is that you will need to hone out the inner drum of the rotors to fit over the parking brake. I believe the front rotors also have to be honed out on the late model brakes as you have to use Caddilac Rotors PN# 25851237 vs the Corvette Z06 rotors of which can be used on the early model CTS-V brakes.
If I'm wrong by any of this I am more than open to correction, this is just what I gather so far.
To keep cost as low as possible, I'm likely going to use early model CTS-V Front Calipres and late model CTS-V Rear Calipres.
The reasons are as follows:
Once again - If Im wrong about anything, I'm open to correction.
So here goes for my parts list:
Wheels:
Tires:
Brake Calipers:
Rotors:
Conversion Parts:
I ordered the rear wheels already. If you have any suggestions for me, please feel free to let me know.
If I'm wrong by any of this I am more than open to correction, this is just what I gather so far.
To keep cost as low as possible, I'm likely going to use early model CTS-V Front Calipres and late model CTS-V Rear Calipres.
The reasons are as follows:
- Early Model CTS-V Brakes cost ALOT less
- Front rotors won't require honing as I can use Z06 rotors.
- Late Model CTS V Rear Calipres won't require any modification asside from the kit (which I'll post later)
Once again - If Im wrong about anything, I'm open to correction.
So here goes for my parts list:
Wheels:
x2 AV5 19X9.5 5X120 +35 Rear - $250 [INSTALLED](I got a deal on these)
x2 AV3 19X8.5 5X120 +35 Front - $300 [INSTALLED]
x2 AV3 19X8.5 5X120 +35 Front - $300 [INSTALLED]
x2 Kuhmo Ecsta LE SPORT KU39 - 255/35/R19 FRONT - $332 [INSTALLED]
x2 Kuhmo Ecsta LE SPORT KU39 - 295/30/R19 REAR - $416 [INSTALLED]
Mount / Balance / Roadside Warranty - $200 [COMPLETED]
x2 Kuhmo Ecsta LE SPORT KU39 - 295/30/R19 REAR - $416 [INSTALLED]
Mount / Balance / Roadside Warranty - $200 [COMPLETED]
x2 04 - 07 Front Calipers, Pins & Pads: $320 [INSTALLED]
Powdercoat Front & Rear Calipers / Brembo Logos on fronts + Rebuild all four Calipers: $350 [COMPLETE]
Powdercoat Front & Rear Calipers / Brembo Logos on fronts + Rebuild all four Calipers: $350 [COMPLETE]
x2 2010 + Camaro SS Front Rotors - $122.58 [INSTALLED]
PRIMECHOICE PART NUMBER: PR65177PR
x2 98-02 F-Body Rear Rotors & Pads + CTS-V Rear Rotors - $106.80 [INSTALLED]
PRIMECHOICE PART NUMBER: LW-PERF65052750
PRIMECHOICE PART NUMBER: PR65177PR
x2 98-02 F-Body Rear Rotors & Pads + CTS-V Rear Rotors - $106.80 [INSTALLED]
PRIMECHOICE PART NUMBER: LW-PERF65052750
Front Brake Lines: $85.00 [INSTALLED]
Hub Centric Rings: $5.00 @ Discount Tire Store [INSTALLED]
Front Rotor Hub Bore: $65 [COMPLETED]
Hub Centric Rings: $5.00 @ Discount Tire Store [INSTALLED]
Front Rotor Hub Bore: $65 [COMPLETED]
Last edited by Need4Camaro; 10-30-2016 at 07:09 AM.
07-17-2016, 09:13 AM
#4
TECH Senior Member
Is this for looks only? Why are you doing the rears as well? In a panic stop (or any hard type stop situation) you are going to lock up the rear brakes.
07-17-2016, 03:42 PM
#5
For the rears, why would they lock up? I mean it's not absolutely mandatory that I do them but I'm confused as to why they would react any differently with ABS if they work just fine on a CTS?
07-17-2016, 04:23 PM
#6
TECH Senior Member
No. Stock brakes just aren't cutting it for me even for DD especially after driving some fairly newer cars with larger brakes.
For the rears, why would they lock up? I mean it's not absolutely mandatory that I do them but I'm confused as to why they would react any differently with ABS if they work just fine on a CTS?
For the rears, why would they lock up? I mean it's not absolutely mandatory that I do them but I'm confused as to why they would react any differently with ABS if they work just fine on a CTS?
First, have you tried good pads with blank rotos, not some ceramic junk? They will be more than enough for a street car as people sucessfully race with that setup. The big reason people get different calipers is because the factory ones can spread when road racing and abusing them at triple digit speeds.
Next, never compare one car to another in the sense you are doing now. Just because something works on a certain car doesnt mean it will work on ours. A cts has irs, and close to 50/50 weight balance while the fbody has a solid axle 3 link suspension and 55/45 weight distribution. Guys who simply upgrade the rear pads alone get brake hop and lockup when braking hard, its how the suspension and brakes are setup, hard to get around it. The front brakes are the ones that do most of the work.
07-18-2016, 01:02 AM
#7
Douchebag On The Tree
My CTS-V Brake Upgrade Thread You need to do a search as you are about to waste a ton of money.
First, have you tried good pads with blank rotos, not some ceramic junk? They will be more than enough for a street car as people sucessfully race with that setup. The big reason people get different calipers is because the factory ones can spread when road racing and abusing them at triple digit speeds.
Next, never compare one car to another in the sense you are doing now. Just because something works on a certain car doesnt mean it will work on ours. A cts has irs, and close to 50/50 weight balance while the fbody has a solid axle 3 link suspension and 55/45 weight distribution. Guys who simply upgrade the rear pads alone get brake hop and lockup when braking hard, its how the suspension and brakes are setup, hard to get around it. The front brakes are the ones that do most of the work.
First, have you tried good pads with blank rotos, not some ceramic junk? They will be more than enough for a street car as people sucessfully race with that setup. The big reason people get different calipers is because the factory ones can spread when road racing and abusing them at triple digit speeds.
Next, never compare one car to another in the sense you are doing now. Just because something works on a certain car doesnt mean it will work on ours. A cts has irs, and close to 50/50 weight balance while the fbody has a solid axle 3 link suspension and 55/45 weight distribution. Guys who simply upgrade the rear pads alone get brake hop and lockup when braking hard, its how the suspension and brakes are setup, hard to get around it. The front brakes are the ones that do most of the work.
I'm all for anyone upgrading their brakes, but you should be smart about it instead of just throwing parts at it. If you wanted to do it for looks, I'd say go for it, but since you say you want it for the performance, there are better things to do.
Your braking performance is limited most by your tires. If you have some $70 rock hard tires on your car you aren't stopping well. Period.
Can your stock brakes engage ABS? If so, they aren't the issue and what you aren't liking about your brakes is most likely the feel, not the actual performance.
Is it possible you're looking for better immediate bite? That's gonna be your pads. A "comfort" branded ceramic or even a high metallic full race pad won't give you the same initial bite as a high quality street pad, for different reasons.
You could look into steel braided lines. Some people say they're a placebo effect, but most people swear by them. I'm a "it can't hurt" kinda guy.
I honestly think going from a sliding caliper to a fixed caliper does just as much, if not more for than the steel braided lines though. In that case, the CTS-V calipers are an upgrade. However, the only tangible upgrade they offer over a properly set up stock system, using the same tires, would be taking the heat of track driving. Larger rotors and larger pads means they can take and dissipate more heat before the brakes start fading. That's should only be an issue on track cars though.
A properly set up stock system with sticky tires is more than anyone could ever need on the street.
That said, go for the upgraded fronts. They're awesome, I have fixed brembo calipers on my car and I love them. You just most likely don't need them. And definitely don't do the rears. It's just not a good idea on an Fbody and usually makes the car worse.
Last edited by justin455; 07-18-2016 at 01:08 AM.
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07-18-2016, 04:17 AM
#8
You need to do a search as you are about to waste a ton of money.
First, have you tried good pads with blank rotos, not some ceramic junk? They will be more than enough for a street car as people sucessfully race with that setup. The big reason people get different calipers is because the factory ones can spread when road racing and abusing them at triple digit speeds.
Next, never compare one car to another in the sense you are doing now. Just because something works on a certain car doesnt mean it will work on ours. A cts has irs, and close to 50/50 weight balance while the fbody has a solid axle 3 link suspension and 55/45 weight distribution. Guys who simply upgrade the rear pads alone get brake hop and lockup when braking hard, its how the suspension and brakes are setup, hard to get around it. The front brakes are the ones that do most of the work.
First, have you tried good pads with blank rotos, not some ceramic junk? They will be more than enough for a street car as people sucessfully race with that setup. The big reason people get different calipers is because the factory ones can spread when road racing and abusing them at triple digit speeds.
Next, never compare one car to another in the sense you are doing now. Just because something works on a certain car doesnt mean it will work on ours. A cts has irs, and close to 50/50 weight balance while the fbody has a solid axle 3 link suspension and 55/45 weight distribution. Guys who simply upgrade the rear pads alone get brake hop and lockup when braking hard, its how the suspension and brakes are setup, hard to get around it. The front brakes are the ones that do most of the work.
He's right. Fbodies just don't do well with upgraded rears. They end up essentially doing too much which upsets the balance of the car.
I'm all for anyone upgrading their brakes, but you should be smart about it instead of just throwing parts at it. If you wanted to do it for looks, I'd say go for it, but since you say you want it for the performance, there are better things to do.
Your braking performance is limited most by your tires. If you have some $70 rock hard tires on your car you aren't stopping well. Period.
Can your stock brakes engage ABS? If so, they aren't the issue and what you aren't liking about your brakes is most likely the feel, not the actual performance.
Is it possible you're looking for better immediate bite? That's gonna be your pads. A "comfort" branded ceramic or even a high metallic full race pad won't give you the same initial bite as a high quality street pad, for different reasons.
You could look into steel braided lines. Some people say they're a placebo effect, but most people swear by them. I'm a "it can't hurt" kinda guy.
I honestly think going from a sliding caliper to a fixed caliper does just as much, if not more for than the steel braided lines though. In that case, the CTS-V calipers are an upgrade. However, the only tangible upgrade they offer over a properly set up stock system, using the same tires, would be taking the heat of track driving. Larger rotors and larger pads means they can take and dissipate more heat before the brakes start fading. That's should only be an issue on track cars though.
A properly set up stock system with sticky tires is more than anyone could ever need on the street.
That said, go for the upgraded fronts. They're awesome, I have fixed brembo calipers on my car and I love them. You just most likely don't need them. And definitely don't do the rears. It's just not a good idea on an Fbody and usually makes the car worse.
I'm all for anyone upgrading their brakes, but you should be smart about it instead of just throwing parts at it. If you wanted to do it for looks, I'd say go for it, but since you say you want it for the performance, there are better things to do.
Your braking performance is limited most by your tires. If you have some $70 rock hard tires on your car you aren't stopping well. Period.
Can your stock brakes engage ABS? If so, they aren't the issue and what you aren't liking about your brakes is most likely the feel, not the actual performance.
Is it possible you're looking for better immediate bite? That's gonna be your pads. A "comfort" branded ceramic or even a high metallic full race pad won't give you the same initial bite as a high quality street pad, for different reasons.
You could look into steel braided lines. Some people say they're a placebo effect, but most people swear by them. I'm a "it can't hurt" kinda guy.
I honestly think going from a sliding caliper to a fixed caliper does just as much, if not more for than the steel braided lines though. In that case, the CTS-V calipers are an upgrade. However, the only tangible upgrade they offer over a properly set up stock system, using the same tires, would be taking the heat of track driving. Larger rotors and larger pads means they can take and dissipate more heat before the brakes start fading. That's should only be an issue on track cars though.
A properly set up stock system with sticky tires is more than anyone could ever need on the street.
That said, go for the upgraded fronts. They're awesome, I have fixed brembo calipers on my car and I love them. You just most likely don't need them. And definitely don't do the rears. It's just not a good idea on an Fbody and usually makes the car worse.
For the brakes themselves, I sometimes find myself having to downshift (A4 trans) to assist my car in stopping in emergency situations but in dry conditions, no I havent been able to get the ABS to engage. In wet conditions I have. They're standard autozone replacements, nothing special. My tires are pretty decent, much better than my previous tires. 245/50/16 front and 255/50/16 rear. They were about $145 per tire and are Z rated (honestly its hard to even find them in this size around here let alone for $70) I dont think my tires are the issue though. They're Kumho's in the front and BFGoodrich in the rear.
I'll forgo the rears but I still think I want to do the fronts.
07-18-2016, 11:57 AM
#9
&
Ah. Okay. I never thought about the weight distribution and yeah that makes sense. Too much braking power in the rear and not enough weight back there. I'll forgo the rears and just do a standard brake job in the back.
For the brakes themselves, I sometimes find myself having to downshift (A4 trans) to assist my car in stopping in emergency situations but in dry conditions, no I havent been able to get the ABS to engage. In wet conditions I have. They're standard autozone replacements, nothing special. My tires are pretty decent, much better than my previous tires. 245/50/16 front and 255/50/16 rear. They were about $145 per tire and are Z rated (honestly its hard to even find them in this size around here let alone for $70) I dont think my tires are the issue though. They're Kumho's in the front and BFGoodrich in the rear.
I'll forgo the rears but I still think I want to do the fronts.
Ah. Okay. I never thought about the weight distribution and yeah that makes sense. Too much braking power in the rear and not enough weight back there. I'll forgo the rears and just do a standard brake job in the back.
For the brakes themselves, I sometimes find myself having to downshift (A4 trans) to assist my car in stopping in emergency situations but in dry conditions, no I havent been able to get the ABS to engage. In wet conditions I have. They're standard autozone replacements, nothing special. My tires are pretty decent, much better than my previous tires. 245/50/16 front and 255/50/16 rear. They were about $145 per tire and are Z rated (honestly its hard to even find them in this size around here let alone for $70) I dont think my tires are the issue though. They're Kumho's in the front and BFGoodrich in the rear.
I'll forgo the rears but I still think I want to do the fronts.
But like stated before some good rotors and pads on the rear paired with the CTS-V fronts make a fantastic stopping setup.
07-18-2016, 12:40 PM
#10
Douchebag On The Tree
&Ah. Okay. I never thought about the weight distribution and yeah that makes sense. Too much braking power in the rear and not enough weight back there. I'll forgo the rears and just do a standard brake job in the back.
For the brakes themselves, I sometimes find myself having to downshift (A4 trans) to assist my car in stopping in emergency situations but in dry conditions, no I havent been able to get the ABS to engage. In wet conditions I have. They're standard autozone replacements, nothing special. My tires are pretty decent, much better than my previous tires. 245/50/16 front and 255/50/16 rear. They were about $145 per tire and are Z rated (honestly its hard to even find them in this size around here let alone for $70) I dont think my tires are the issue though. They're Kumho's in the front and BFGoodrich in the rear.
I'll forgo the rears but I still think I want to do the fronts.
For the brakes themselves, I sometimes find myself having to downshift (A4 trans) to assist my car in stopping in emergency situations but in dry conditions, no I havent been able to get the ABS to engage. In wet conditions I have. They're standard autozone replacements, nothing special. My tires are pretty decent, much better than my previous tires. 245/50/16 front and 255/50/16 rear. They were about $145 per tire and are Z rated (honestly its hard to even find them in this size around here let alone for $70) I dont think my tires are the issue though. They're Kumho's in the front and BFGoodrich in the rear.
I'll forgo the rears but I still think I want to do the fronts.
Or your calipers could be sticking from either corrosion on the piston or seized slide pins. Both of those would cause poor braking performance as well.
I say still go for the CTS-V upgrade in front as new hardware is never a bad thing, but you should inspect your entire braking system because it doesn't sound like it's in working order. The stock system is pretty good even by today's standards and shouldn't need engine braking to assist slowing the car down.
07-18-2016, 05:33 PM
#11
TECH Senior Member
&
Ah. Okay. I never thought about the weight distribution and yeah that makes sense. Too much braking power in the rear and not enough weight back there. I'll forgo the rears and just do a standard brake job in the back.
For the brakes themselves, I sometimes find myself having to downshift (A4 trans) to assist my car in stopping in emergency situations but in dry conditions, no I havent been able to get the ABS to engage. In wet conditions I have. They're standard autozone replacements, nothing special. My tires are pretty decent, much better than my previous tires. 245/50/16 front and 255/50/16 rear. They were about $145 per tire and are Z rated (honestly its hard to even find them in this size around here let alone for $70) I dont think my tires are the issue though. They're Kumho's in the front and BFGoodrich in the rear.
I'll forgo the rears but I still think I want to do the fronts.
Ah. Okay. I never thought about the weight distribution and yeah that makes sense. Too much braking power in the rear and not enough weight back there. I'll forgo the rears and just do a standard brake job in the back.
For the brakes themselves, I sometimes find myself having to downshift (A4 trans) to assist my car in stopping in emergency situations but in dry conditions, no I havent been able to get the ABS to engage. In wet conditions I have. They're standard autozone replacements, nothing special. My tires are pretty decent, much better than my previous tires. 245/50/16 front and 255/50/16 rear. They were about $145 per tire and are Z rated (honestly its hard to even find them in this size around here let alone for $70) I dont think my tires are the issue though. They're Kumho's in the front and BFGoodrich in the rear.
I'll forgo the rears but I still think I want to do the fronts.
Try a set of good pads and make sure the rest of the braking system is in good working order.
Example of good pads for the street:
http://www.stranoparts.com/partdetai...D=16&ModelID=8
OR
http://www.stranoparts.com/partdetai...D=16&ModelID=8
More here:
http://www.stranoparts.com/searchbym...D=16&ModelID=8
07-20-2016, 05:35 PM
#15
Well, my rear wheels came...
&
These are for the rears and are 19x9.5 ... I havent had time to test fit anything.
For the fronts Im going 19x8.5. Im ordering the fronts at the end of the month.
For the Brakes I guess that changes it to 2010 SS Rotors, 2 Front 6 Piston CTS Calipers, Stock rear brake setup.
I'm still not sure about the tires yet.
&
These are for the rears and are 19x9.5 ... I havent had time to test fit anything.
For the fronts Im going 19x8.5. Im ordering the fronts at the end of the month.
For the Brakes I guess that changes it to 2010 SS Rotors, 2 Front 6 Piston CTS Calipers, Stock rear brake setup.
I'm still not sure about the tires yet.
07-21-2016, 02:20 PM
#16
You can still do the 4 Piston CTS-V in the front, They still work just fine with the 2010 Camaro SS Rotors. Plus you'll save plenty of cash. I went with 6 piston because it would bug me seeing them everyday and I would be like damn I should have gone with 6 piston. Plus you don't have to enlarge the caliper mounting holes either.
Try to look for an old school machine shop the isn't computerized and doesn't charge by the hour. Fine somewhere where they will charge you a Flat Rate price to bore out both rotors. Just take an old rotor and drop it off so they can make it perfect.
Try to look for an old school machine shop the isn't computerized and doesn't charge by the hour. Fine somewhere where they will charge you a Flat Rate price to bore out both rotors. Just take an old rotor and drop it off so they can make it perfect.
07-23-2016, 03:55 PM
#17
Just wondering, for my wheels, since they are 5x120 bolt pattern (not 5x120.65) will I need hub centric rings? my hub bore for the wheels is 74.1 mm . I dont know what the hub / axle is.
Also will Flynbye 's brake lines work on the 09 + CTSV Brakes?
Edit: Found out they will.
Also will Flynbye 's brake lines work on the 09 + CTSV Brakes?
Edit: Found out they will.
Last edited by Need4Camaro; 07-23-2016 at 04:05 PM.
07-23-2016, 04:33 PM
#18
I was toying around with some more browsing as I would really like these Brakes powder coated / non painted in red. I can get that down but it will cost about $1k total.
If I wanted to save alittle bit of money, could I use these instead?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/GM-OEM-2015-...pXjqUb&vxp=mtr
I was told by zzperformance that they're the same as CTS-V brakes. Will they be a direct bolton in that case?
If I wanted to save alittle bit of money, could I use these instead?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/GM-OEM-2015-...pXjqUb&vxp=mtr
I was told by zzperformance that they're the same as CTS-V brakes. Will they be a direct bolton in that case?
07-24-2016, 02:22 PM
#19
Just get 5x4.75 wheel spacers. I used 8mm think ones on my set up. There's a link to them on my parts list in the video. Make sure they're hub centric not universal because they will throw your wheels off balance.
They look like the same mounting pattern but IDK to be honest. You can always return them if they don't work. I would go with CTS-V since they're known to work.
They look like the same mounting pattern but IDK to be honest. You can always return them if they don't work. I would go with CTS-V since they're known to work.
08-02-2016, 11:50 AM
#20
You can still do the 4 Piston CTS-V in the front, They still work just fine with the 2010 Camaro SS Rotors. Plus you'll save plenty of cash. I went with 6 piston because it would bug me seeing them everyday and I would be like damn I should have gone with 6 piston. Plus you don't have to enlarge the caliper mounting holes either.
I would really prefer the 6 Piston over the 4 Piston but I am afraid of screwing up on the part where I enlargen those holes and the calipers don't match up. I was told to use a Half Inch Drill with a 14mm bit and it would be cake walk. Can you confirm this? The 6 Piston is super tempting. how difficult is it to drill that hole out?
So I ordered the Brake Lines, I didn't get them from Flynbye because I've heard numerous horror stories where people have paid them and never heard anything else from him and never got their product, plus he's very difficult to get a hold of. I tried calling him multiple times and got through once and was told he would call me back which didnt happen.
I ordered a standard set of slotted / drilled F-Body rotors and pads for the rear.
I also ordered 2 new wheels 19x8.5 5x120 40mm Offset on the front. What sucks is, I found out the AVAT AV5's were on back order and the manufacturer states there's no ETA when they will be producing them again, meaning they could even be discontinued. I had to settle for a very similar wheel, the AV3's, but these have Rivets, so it's going to be alittle mismatch..I'm hoping it doesn't look "too" off, or I may try to return my AV5's and get AV3's all the way around. Trying to avoid returning them though because I'll be out of pocket for shipping on that.
Finally...For the CTS-V brake, not sure what I want to do. I don't know if I want to paint them, or powder coat them. Painting is obviously much cheaper
Last edited by Need4Camaro; 08-02-2016 at 12:00 PM.