Anybody know if the law passed on 19 jun which makes it legal to carry a firearm in ur car without a CCL

 

i would like to know to

 

It simply clarified the section on "travel". You still need a CHL if you want to drive around town with a gun in your car. Plus if you travel outside the state its a REALLY good idea to have one.

 

Good question, I not sure, anyone know.

I am thinking about getting my CCL, here shortly, when I move back home, should be able to get it then for sure.

JET

cant wait to be legal to carry

 

Just make sure whatever state you are traveling to honors the Tx CHL. Some do, but others don't.

 

States with reciprocity/unilateral agreements.

http://www.txdps.state.tx.us/adminis...eciprocity.htm

May 4, 2005 Connecticut
Unilateral Proclamation, see note below
April 14, 2005 Iowa
Unilateral Proclamation, see note below
March 24, 2005 Nevada
Unilateral Proclamation, see note below
February 28, 2005 Pennsylvania
February 25, 2005 South Carolina
February 4, 2005 North Dakota
December 29, 2004 Colorado
December 29, 2004 New Mexico
Unilateral Proclamation, see note below
November 29, 2004 Montana
November 22, 2004 Georgia
September 7, 2004 Mississippi
September 3, 2004 Utah
August 9, 2004 Idaho
April 19, 2004 North Carolina
July 25, 2002 Wyoming
August 30, 2000 Kentucky
August 30, 2000 Tennessee
August 28, 2000 Florida
September 15, 1999 Arizona
August 31, 1998 Louisiana
July 24, 1998 Oklahoma
February 19, 1998 Arkansas

Texas Establishes Concealed Handgun License Unilateral Proclamation With Other States

May 4, 2005 Connecticut
Note: Effective immediately, Governor Perry has issued a proclamation that allows persons with permanent (plastic) concealed handgun licenses from Connecticut to legally carry in Texas. Connecticut permanent license holders will be required to follow texas law while carrying in this state. Temporary (paper) Connecticut concealed handgun licenses are not recognized under this proclamation. This proclamation is unilateral and is not a reciprocal agreement. Texas concealed handgun license holders will not be allowed to carry in Connecticut.

April 14, 2005 Iowa
Note: Texas Governor Rick Perry signed a unilateral proclamation recognizing Iowa Concealed Handgun Licenses on April 14, 2005 allowing citizens with concealed handgun licenses issued by Iowa to legally carry concealed handguns in Texas. This is not a reciprocal agreement, therefore, Texas Concealed Handgun Licenses holders may NOT carry concealed handguns in Iowa.

March 24, 2005 Nevada
Note: Texas Governor Rick Perry signed a unilateral proclamation recognizing Nevada Concealed Handgun Licenses on March 24, 2005 allowing citizens with concealed handgun licenses issued by Nevada to legally carry concealed handguns in Texas. This is not a reciprocal agreement, therefore, Texas Concealed Handgun Licenses holders may NOT carry concealed handguns in Nevada. This is the second “unilateral” proclamation in addition to eighteen reciprocity agreements. The handgun license reciprocity list includes Arkansas, Arizona, Florida, Georgia, Idaho, Kentucky, Louisiana, Mississippi, Montana, North Carolina, Oklahoma, Pennsylvania, Tennessee, Utah, Wyoming, Colorado, North Dakota and South Carolina.

December 29, 2004 New Mexico
Note: Texas Governor Rick Perry signed a unilateral proclamation on December 29, 2004 allowing citizens with concealed handgun licenses issued by New Mexico to legally carry concealed handguns in Texas. This is not a reciprocal agreement, therefore, Texas Concealed Handgun Licenses are NOT recognized in New Mexico and Texas citizens with concealed handgun licenses may NOT legally carry concealed handguns in New Mexico. This is the first "unilateral" proclamation issued by Texas.


Main CHL page

http://www.txdps.state.tx.us/adminis.../chlsindex.htm


HB 823
http://www.capitol.state.tx.us/cgi-b...RSION=5&TYPE=B

modifies Penal Code Section 46.15 and states that a person is presumed to be traveling if the person is in a private motor vehicle, not otherwise engaged in crime other than a traffic violation, not prohibited by law from possessing a firearm, not a member of a criminal street gang as defined by law, and not carrying a handgun in plain view.

Current law puts the burden of proof solely on the individual to prove to the state that he is traveling while HB 823 shifts that burden of proof to the state with the presumption of innocence and a clearer definition of the traveler.

The changes to the PC 46.15 are historic and real but much should be considered before making the decision to travel in Texas with a handgun and without the benefit of a concealed handgun license.

Thank you for this goes to to Rep. Keel and Senator Hinojosa for taking on a very old problem effecting Texans and visitors to Texas.


Here is the text of the bill.

H.B. No. 823




AN ACT

relating to the applicability of the offense of unlawful carrying
of weapons to certain persons and to the consequence of certain
presumptions in the prosecution of a criminal offense.
BE IT ENACTED BY THE LEGISLATURE OF THE STATE OF TEXAS:
SECTION 1. Section 46.15, Penal Code, is amended by adding
Subsection (i) to read as follows:
(i) For purposes of Subsection (b)(3), a person is presumed
to be traveling if the person is:
(1) in a private motor vehicle;
(2) not otherwise engaged in criminal activity, other
than a Class C misdemeanor that is a violation of a law or ordinance
regulating traffic;
(3) not otherwise prohibited by law from possessing a
firearm;
(4) not a member of a criminal street gang, as defined
by Section 71.01; and
(5) not carrying a handgun in plain view.
SECTION 2. Section 2.05, Penal Code, is amended to read as
follows:
Sec. 2.05. PRESUMPTION. (a) Except as provided by
Subsection (b), when [When] this code or another penal law
establishes a presumption with respect to any fact, it has the
following consequences:
(1) if there is sufficient evidence of the facts that
give rise to the presumption, the issue of the existence of the
presumed fact must be submitted to the jury, unless the court is
satisfied that the evidence as a whole clearly precludes a finding
beyond a reasonable doubt of the presumed fact; and
(2) if the existence of the presumed fact is submitted
to the jury, the court shall charge the jury, in terms of the
presumption and the specific element to which it applies, as
follows:
(A) that the facts giving rise to the presumption
must be proven beyond a reasonable doubt;
(B) that if such facts are proven beyond a
reasonable doubt the jury may find that the element of the offense
sought to be presumed exists, but it is not bound to so find;
(C) that even though the jury may find the
existence of such element, the state must prove beyond a reasonable
doubt each of the other elements of the offense charged; and
(D) if the jury has a reasonable doubt as to the
existence of a fact or facts giving rise to the presumption, the
presumption fails and the jury shall not consider the presumption
for any purpose.
(b) When this code or another penal law establishes a
presumption in favor of the defendant with respect to any fact, it
has the following consequences:
(1) if there is sufficient evidence of the facts that
give rise to the presumption, the issue of the existence of the
presumed fact must be submitted to the jury unless the court is
satisfied that the evidence as a whole clearly precludes a finding
beyond a reasonable doubt of the presumed fact; and
(2) if the existence of the presumed fact is submitted
to the jury, the court shall charge the jury, in terms of the
presumption, that:
(A) the presumption applies unless the state
proves beyond a reasonable doubt that the facts giving rise to the
presumption do not exist;
(B) if the state fails to prove beyond a
reasonable doubt that the facts giving rise to the presumption do
not exist, the jury must find that the presumed fact exists;
(C) even though the jury may find that the
presumed fact does not exist, the state must prove beyond a
reasonable doubt each of the elements of the offense charged; and
(D) if the jury has a reasonable doubt as to
whether the presumed fact exists, the presumption applies and the
jury must consider the presumed fact to exist.
SECTION 3. The changes in law made by this Act apply only to
an offense committed on or after the effective date of this Act. An
offense committed before the effective date of this Act is covered
by the law in effect at the time the offense was committed, and the
former law is continued in effect for that purpose. For purposes of
this section, an offense was committed before the effective date of
this Act if any element of the offense was committed before that
date.
SECTION 4. This Act takes effect September 1, 2005.




______________________________ ______________________________

President of the Senate Speaker of the House

I certify that H.B. No. 823 was passed by the House on April
20, 2005, by a non-record vote; and that the House concurred in
Senate amendments to H.B. No. 823 on May 27, 2005, by a non-record
vote.

______________________________
Chief Clerk of the House


I certify that H.B. No. 823 was passed by the Senate, with
amendments, on May 24, 2005, by the following vote: Yeas 29, Nays
2.

______________________________
Secretary of the Senate



APPROVED: __________________

Date





__________________

Governor

 

Thats too much to read

 

I have my CHL. The key word is concealed. You can carry certain types of guns in plain view just not concealed. Like a handgun would be.

-Tracey

 

did the 18 year old active military CHL bill pass?

 

huh?

About the only thing you can carry in public is a long gun (specifically a shotgun) that is unloaded. But the caveat to that is that if it causes a "disturbance" (i.e. somone calls the police as you are carrying a weapon down the street you could be charged with disturbing the peace for instance.

This bill simply clarifies the rules on travel which have always been ambiguous. It is now up to the state to prove you weren't traveling if they find a gun in a vehicle and you don't have a permit.

 

I believe that was one of the other bills that passed along with the other 7 or 8 that Perry signed a few weeks ago, there was a thread on it here somewhere that stated what all was passed. Might see if oyu can find it.

Brian

 

that's great now I cant carry my UZI

 

idiot. what purpose would carrying an uzi serve? inciting a public riot? or getting your dumb *** shot?

 

cypur I was just kidding I dont even own a uzi man seek help buddy.

 

ahh....i've known people that own them, but they don't make comments like that like that. so when ppl say dumb **** like that and don't add in a 'lol' or a : jest : or something like that, i react. sorry bout that.

 

Cypher beat me to it...I was about to say the same thing. There are people dumb enough to do it out there..

 

69 TA ur right there r some stupid people out there who would do something like that
and for anyone who was offended my bad next time I'll put the "LOL" in there

 

Yes it was signed, and yes you WILL be able to carry a gun in your car around town etc. The new section now defines "traveling" as being in your car. whereas it wasnt very clear before and people thought you have to be crossing county lines etc etc.

Yes you will be able to legally carry in your car without a CHL once the law takes effect in september.

 

I also would like to add that being a sevice member serving in Iraq I am aware the effect's of violence. And totally appreciate what freedom I have back home

 

interpretation from an attorney (from friendswood) that runs texaschlforum.com:


Presumptions can be rebutted, unless the statute expressly states the presumption is unrebuttable. However, with HB823, the only way to disprove the presumption is to disprove the facts underlying the presumption. All you have to do is establish the elements of the presumption. When dealing with HB823, this means that 1) you're in a private motor vehicle; 2) not committing a crime (other than Class C traffic violations); 3) not prohibited from possessing a firearm; 4) not a member of a street gang; or 5) not carrying a handgun in plain view.

The presumption goes to the jury, if there are facts establishing elements 1) through 5). In order to rebut the presumption, the state must prove that one of the listed elements (the facts establishing the presumption) do not exist, and this must be proven "beyond a reasonable doubt." Only by disproving one of the 5 elements will defeat the presumption. It matters not if you have fresh groceries in the car, are on your regular route to and/or from work, or don't have any luggage. It wouldn't matter if you told the officer you were just driving three blocks from your house to a neighbor's home. Can you be arrested? Sure, but most LEO's are not going to waste their time and no responsible ADA is going to accept the charges, unless there is evidence you don't meet one or more of elements 2) through 5).

Note the statute's instructions on what is required to rebut the presumption:

(2) if the existence of the presumed fact is submitted to the jury, the court shall charge the jury, in terms of the presumption, that:
(A) the presumption applies unless the state proves beyond a reasonable doubt that the facts giving rise to the presumption do not exist;
(B) if the state fails to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that the facts giving rise to the presumption do not exist, the jury must find that the presumed fact exists;

Also, the Legislative history of this bill makes it abundantly clear that the intent was to allow people to carry guns in their cars without a CHL.

There is a ton if misinformation in the newsgroups on this issue, most of which is based upon erroneous attempts to apply pre-HB823 case law.

Was there a cleaner way to achieve this goal? You bet! However, I suspect the author of the bill felt it be less controversial to focus on "traveling" currently in the Penal Code, rather than make a more overt change that would draw more attention to the bill.

Regards,
Chas.


So, in otherwords, starting September 1, 05, you WILL be able to carry a gun in your car legally without a texas CHL. In the past you could have a gun in your car, but it could not be within your immediate reach. Now you will be able to carry a loaded handgun under your seat or whever you please, as long as you meet the criteria (you can legally posess, not in a gang etc).