BIG 3 upgrade / 200 amp alternator
 

BIG 3 =
Alternator to battery positive
Engine to chassis ground
Battery - to chassis ground


Stock 105amp vs 200amp {tested output sheet reads 220.4amps }

http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s...Picture159.jpg
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Some comparison shots

Factory alternator power lead vs 7/16'' Craftsman wrench
http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s...Picture161.jpg


Factory vs Kicker 4 gauge {Note : this would be a good upgrade on a smaller amp alternator stock 105amp / 130amp / 160amp etc .}
http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s...Picture162.jpg


1/0 gauge vs 4 gauge vs stock

http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s...Picture163.jpg


I went ahead and bought 20' of red for power leads / 4' black for grounds of Knukoncepts Fleks 1/0 gauge since I am using a higher amperage alternator .
Also bought [7] 1/0 gauge ring terminals { used 2 from alternator to battery , 2 for engine to chassis ground , 2 for battery - to chassis ground . I used the other one to go to my amps . }

1/0 gauge vs Kicker 4 gauge

http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s...Picture164.jpg

Wire count inside insulation , crappy pic but you can see the difference ,
1/0 gauge vs stock alternator power lead

http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s...Picture166.jpg

Alright , heres some install shots , didnt have access to the camera during installation but I did try my best to capture a few and the end result .

Started by removing the old alternator , be carefull not to rip out the small wire going to it like I did :bang: . All's well though as I bought a new terminal with what looks to be a little better gauge wire . No pics of removal but here is a nice removal guide I found from WhiteBird00 ..

Next to come since I had more free room to work was the Engine to Chassis ground . The stock ground is very small , I just left it inplace and run another one . I went off the factory engine mount stud and found a nut to fit it . Its a small fine thread nut .

http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s...Picture167.jpg

Bolted to the Chassis I found the factory ABS mount to have a bolt in the right place so I removed it . Had to slightly wallow out my ring terminal end to get the bolt through .

http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s...Picture170.jpg

I run the ground away from the header tube and the steering linkage , also left some slack for engine movement .

Engine to Chassis ground upgrade complete http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s...Picture168.jpg

Next I installed the new alternator , run the power lead . Used the factory mounting holders . Here is some shots from the alternator to battery positive .

Alternator to Battery power lead upgrade complete

http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s...Picture181.jpg
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http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s...Picture187.jpg
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Next was the Battery negative to body/chassis ground , self explanitory .

Battery Negative to Body/Chassis ground upgrade complete

http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s...Picture177.jpg


Now with the extra 14.5' of power wire left and the extra 1/0 gauge ring terminal I wanted to upgrade to my amps . Went from dual 4 gauge { each one runs to its own amp } to a single 1/0 gauge .
The small 4 channel amp was fine with 4 gauge at only 300watts rms or so , but the sub amp I was pushing it with that long of a run running over 1,000 watts rms through a single 4 gauge power lead .
I also like how it cleaned up the under hood look .

Before

http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s...Picture140.jpg

After

http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s...Picture195.jpg
http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s...Picture172.jpg

Amps input won't accept a 1/0 gauge so I boought a 1/0gauge input / dual 4 gauge output fused distribution block . Have less than 2' of 4 gauge now going to the sub amp instead of 13' which should make a slight difference .
Got it from Knukonceptz , its there Konfused block , has 2 100 amp mini ANL fuses , small 4 channel has built into it 2 20amp blade fuses .

http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s...Picture173.jpg
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Well before the upgrades with the car running the voltage would drop into the 12's and stay there until I turned the volume back down . Obviously if the voltage is dropping I wasn't getting the full output from the sub amp to the sub .

Now after the upgrades the voltage only has dropped to 13.9volts playing it full tilt . Made a big difference in the way it hits also . That was with the car idling .

So there it is , the BIG 3 upgrade on a '2000 F -body . If you were to do the same I think you could order about 6' of power wire / 3' of ground wire .

Out of the 24' I had about 3-4' left over .

Where's the fuse between alt and battery?

Stock it doesn't have one , so I didn't see the need for one .

I was going to put one in though , have 2 extra Kicker ANL fuse holders , 2 100amps / 60amp fuses . Factory is 50amp fuse at the distribution block . Once I seen the factory didnt use one I just went with it , no smoke yet .

never seen that on a car:confused:

no pic of the pwr thru the firewall?:(

nice work

his power wire goes through with the pcm wires not much to see

Nice this is something I'd like to do eventually. Probably when I put in a new motor to have a better electrical system for the high performance engine. I guess you wouldn't really need it now, but are you running a capacitor?

thats some sick wires dude

im surprised you didnt get a red top to go with all that major wiring

No fluxcapacitor .

1.21 gigawats:D

I always wanted to do the big three in my Honda but never did. Still running the stock alternator too which amazes me considering it is 70 Amps and I run the following:

MB Quart QAA1000... 1000 Watt 4-channel to CDT M-6's, 5.25's, tweets and Focal 6x9's.

Hifonics 2006D... 2000 Watt Mono D to two FI-Q 12" subs.


That's 3000 watts and all I have is a Stinger cap and a Kinetics 1400 series battery. The battery was well worth it. I am amazed that nothing has happened and it actually will flex the roof :D

how do you like that wire? i used the same thing in my firebird. i was very happy with it and it is so easy to work with it at the size that is it. cant beat it for the price either.

that's a sweet install. Now you need a kickass battery, you could even relocate it to the trunk now that you already have the 1/0 cable run back there.

Actually, you could leave your stock battery under the hood and just add a small suplemental battery to the trunk.

Don't do any capacitors, they are a waste of money.

IMO with my own eyes a good deep cycle gel battery >cap or big wires. That first before anything. I know some say wires pick things up but never saw the proof on a meter or Amp probe to prove it.

I've done the big 3 on three of my vehicles and seen before and after on half a dozen more. Only one did it not make a dramatic difference. It's JUST as important as the battery. Battery is a source/storage - the BIG 3 upgrades the entire circuit. Only as good as the weakest link kinda thing...

Ive seen big3 make huge improvments more then once

Would it be worth my time and money to do it on a system that doesn't make the volts go down? I only have a couple 10" Comp VRs. The stock system seems fine..

If your lights arent fluctuating at all then the big3 prly wont do much for you, but it wont hurt to do it

nice work

nice writeup dude..... i need to do this really bad, all my lights flicker at night and i can also hear my electric rear mount oil pump fluctuating with the lights!

Very nice write up but I have one question. I looked on Summit Racing's website at alternators and they give two different styles GM CS130 and GM CS130D. Do you know if there is a difference as far as fitment goes with these or should they both work without a problem? Any info on this would be great. Thanks!

Alternator > wires=battery >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> capacitor in terms of importance

Ok, my stock alternator was failing so I went ahead and ordered a 220 Amp High Output alternator and just finished doing the "Big 3" with 1/0 gauge wire and when the car is running at idle, the voltmeter on my instrument cluster only reads like 11.5 volts or so, but if i rev the engine up just a couple hundred rpms, then it comes up to normal and at driving speed, everything looks fine. What gives? Why is the voltage so low at idle?

Are you running an underdrive pulley on your crank?

Higher amp alternators typically give up low RPM voltage...at least the ones I've had experience with on my own car. I had to bump up my idle to 900 RPMs with my previous 160 amp alternator to keep it charging with my underdrive pulley.

Nope, stock crank but the new alternator has a smaller than stock pulley on it. But my logic tells me that it would spin faster that way and bump the output up at idle, right?

Yes, you are correct in your assumption...if you wanted to know hard numbers, it is just a ratio of the diameters of the crank and alt pulleys, you know the engine RPM, so the only variable left is the alt. RPM.

Regardless of that, though, your alternator doesn't sound like it is functioning properly. Did the manufacturer supply you with a sheet that spec'd out its turn-on RPM? That would be a good nugget of information to know...

No, I didn't get any spec sheet with it but my guess is that it's got a bad voltage regulator. I called the place today when I got home from work and talked to the guy and he said that they are tested prior to shipment so I'm going to take it off and take it to AutoZone and have them run it on their diagnostic machine and see whats up.

Where did you get your alternator? And let us know the test results...

whered you get the stud/nut to go into the battery.. I want todo the wire upgrade while I got the car apart plus I just ran my 4G for my amp

Nice write-up man.
:cool:

I have gold DB Link studs that have the extension on the top so you can tap into it instead of trying to fit it in the stock one. Pepboys has one as well that is a standard one that should work.

It is doubtfull that it is the voltage regulator, and the toolbags at autozone will be lucky to tell you anything with their tester, they do not have the capability to tell you what Idle output will be.

My Powermaster alternator came with a dyno sheet showing exactly what it put out and at what RPM.

Great write up. Thanks for the pics :nod:

Nice! Very nice write-up with great pictures! :D

STICKY! :nod:

Yeah this one should be a sticky.
:nod:

And what purpose does these new cables serve? Or what problems do they solve?

Ohm's Law . Less resistance in an electrical circuit . More Current flow , there are saftey features also .

I Need A H/o Alternator For My 02 Ls1 (help!!!)
 

so my alternator is fukkin up i have 2 pairs of HID lights and fogs so when i turn on the car if i use the fogs it will not turn them on 100% they will start blinking and i hear noise on my speakers please help!!!!

Are you positive your alternator is bad ? Sounds more like it could be a wiring issue .

I have a Voltex 6000K kit on my beater Integra and it has no problem firing them off even with the engine turned off . The car has a very small battery in comparison to these F bodies fwiw . I do have the BIG 4 / 170 amp alternator done to this vehicle also but really means nothing for something so small [lighting off HID's ] .

Great write up.

How did you get all the ring terminals onto the 0 gauge wire?

This might have to be the next upgrade to the ol' Camaro.

Easiest way is to twist the wire as your pushing it into the ring terminal .

Great thread thumbs UP

ttt.... REALLY GREAT FUCKEN THREAD!

https://ls1tech.com/forums/stereo-el...questions.html

Spot number 34.

Added it to the FAQ. Nice write-up.

Great write-up, but why no flexloom over the cables?:confused:

Because it's useless and fugly?

Gave me +1.5V @ idle.

I'll agree with the fugly, but not useless. :D

Uh nooo the pics are gone.. typical, just when i was going to start this project.... duh

cws T/A - any chance you could re-up the pics or make a handy pdf of the write-up?

Thank you very much for the time and effort you put into this,
Corday

Would 2 gauge wire be enough for a 200+ amp alternator? There is someone who make a kit for our cars (not a sponsor) but uses 2 gauge.

thats what i used.

Yep, 2ga is fine. I'd still prefer 0, though.

no pics,

omg what should i do :confused:

:thinker:

https://ls1tech.com/forums/stereo-el...rades-d-6.html

no images
 

I'm like so confussed without images.

1 image is worth a 1K words.

can someone update the pictures it is saying the photos have been moved or deleted

so is the big 3 running 3 negatives (grounds 2 big 1 oem) and 1 positive (power from Alt big)? And with the grounds are the 2 big grounds to the chassis?

Back from the dead?

So IMHO the pics need to be re-uploaded or someone else needs to make a sticky to replace this one. This one is useles now...

Well when I purchased and installed my new 200 amps alternator from Motorcityreman ( I deal with the owner directly, even in sunday), i read this

http://www.motorcityreman.com/technical-info.html

He send me a new small alternator pulley for free. Obviously I had to install a shorter serpentine belt than OEM.

regards

dochidalgo

Is there a big 3 kit? I'm in the market and if so, who and where and how much?

"BIG 3": Engine to Chassis ground, Alternator to Battery positive terminal, Battery to Chassis ground.

is there a big 3 kit, i also would be interested as well, pm me if you have to for nonsponsor stuff, thanx!!!!!

Contact Ian, at Kee Audio he's a sponsor here. If he can't fix you up with a kit, he should be able to point you in the right direction.:nod:
http://www.keeaudio.com/

awesome that this thread has no more pictures.

i have no idea what the engine to chassis ground is or what i'm doing to replace/swap it. any pointers? pictures would have been awesome...

Here's a link to another write up on this I found. I looks like it's for an LT1 though. Obviously our alternators are a little more out of the way so I'm not sure if the wire length requirements will be the same.

http://www.fbodyonline.com/big-three-upgrade/#more-867

Engine to chassis ground: look for a braided metal strap bolted to the block in the area a little further back from the alternator. The braided metal strap bolts to the chassis down below the ABS block. Then you have the obvious: Battery - to chassis ground, and the Alternator + to Battery + .

actually the easiest bolt to use was (if you've changed your alternator before) the bolt that holds in the alternator rear bracket. they say its unnecessary, and plus, many aftermarket alternators won't even work with it, so it's very accessible and was a 10 minute job to add a couple of washers to the bolt that goes into the engine and then put on a 4ga wire and bolt it to the engine.

I used the same one when I did the Big 3.

I didn't recommend that location since i don't know if he would be able to use it.

he is actually me :P i didn't know what to use so i posted on here, but in the time between that posting and your posting, i figured out a good bolt to use. ironically, we used the same one :)

big 2 complete now need alt. to + of battery
 

I have done the big 2 - battery to body & back of alt. mounting to body (same place as the braided wire just added to the braided.

I'm wanting to complete the big 3 w/ +battery to alt. I'm thinking it needs to be connected to the charging out of the alt.

?. what wire on alt. to connect to? and what size ring connetor?

? doe's the alt. have to be removed?

images would be good.

Thanks

This thread is no longer sticky/linked worthy.

Seriously need pics updated....doing this project now. x2 for not sticky worthy

I was planning on doing this soon so I went through the stickies but all the pictures are gone. Anyone else know a good write up on doing the big three? thanks

marked for later...next project....Thanks

Just in case anyone is curious about wiring differences. Some use power wire some use welding wire. I found a good review of several car audio 1/0 gauge wire. Though 1/0 is overkill, i think most people is 2 and 4 gauge, this review still shows the manufacturer differences. take it for what it is.

http://www.caraudio.com/forums/wirin...omparison.html

https://ls1tech.com/forums/generatio...lternator.html

really people............its not that hard

OK so I connect the output from atl. to the positive of the battery here for big 3 correct?


Attachment 664234

also is it OK to just use wire w/out a fuse?

Thanks