Got a bad engine from a reputable shop, what would you guys do??
08-28-2014, 06:15 PM
#61
I completely agree about the moderation, there a few uncensored forums you can check out. But in all honesty the best place to learn the truth about shops and vendors is in person at meets and races. If you ask around enough and do some digging, you can weed out the occasional disgruntled customer or isolated incident (things happen) and form a sound decision IMO. Usually if a shop is starting to go down hill or is having repeated issues there is a paper trail.
08-29-2014, 11:25 AM
#63
I would like to start by saying this is our motor. We have been working with the OP on the issue. The only reason this issue was not resolved months ago was due to a mis communication. The motor that was sent to the OP was incorrect and we take full responsibility for the problem( I will go into the problem later in this post). We did ship the motor back to TMS and then back to the OP at the expense of TMS, and made all necessary changes. Once the motor was shipped back to the OP we received an email regarding additional expenses to pick up and drop off the motor. We asked what the expenses were and what the total was. We did not receive any response. It was at this point that we were under the impression that the problem was resolved. This was a poor assumption, We should have never assumed this and continued to work to contact the OP. When we were informed of this thread we immediately contacted the OP in a attempt to resolve the issue. We contacted him not because we are trying to save face but because it is the right thing to do. We are working with the OP to resolve the issue now and I am sure in the end all will be happy as he enjoys his TMS motor that is now in his truck.
I would also like to personally touch on the "removing threads" detail of this. I am sure the moderator who has now chimed in on this can verify that we have never at any time made any attempt to remove any information from this or any forum. We do believe in the system and the ability for anyone to speak freely about their opinions on any subject. You can find anything and everything that has ever been written about TMS online now and always as we will never alter it in any way. I do not want anyone to purchase from us under any false impression that we are perfect. WE ARE NOT. We do however strive to produce the best product available on the market at a fair price. We have had failures, We have made mistakes and we will make more. We do take every opportunity to learn from our mistakes to ensure that they are held to a minimum. We do ask that you keep all mistakes in perspective. You can read of probably 6 or 10 problems that have come about with TMS motors on various forums and pages. These are not all of them, We do have more. We keep track of every motor produced and any problem that comes up regardless of fault. We have produced a total of over 1700 LS motors since opening TMS. We are proud of the fact that our rate of failure is around 1%. I would like it to be 0% but this is a mechanical item. Even with the best parts assembled perfectly sometimes things fail, Sometimes humans make mistakes. When these things happen we do make every effort to correct them often to a point that is so overwhelming we have been accused of committing "financial suicide" by some competitors. We will continue to do this, I have no intent on making our faults any ones problems but our own. We will also continue to strive for the impossible goal of 0%.
Now for the motor in question. When any TMS motor is sold it goes into our sales system. It is then manually moved to an online database where the details of the motor are input. These range from generation block type, reluctors, all the way to intended use. This is where the problem was with this motor. When the motor was input the incorrect info was put in. Instead of a high boost ring gap it was sent as a NA ring gap. This was MY personal mistake. We have since revised our system. Now when any motor is input in the database it must be signed by 2 people in sales to verify that the info is accurate. We also have now set in place a way for the machinist to open the original invoice that was created and sent to the customer to verify and check all information. This should eliminate the possibility for anything like this to happen again.
I am sorry for the lengthy explanation of all that has happened here. I hope this clears up any question of our credibility or engine building ability. I know that there are people who do not like TMS, I can see that with some of the posts here. That is something we have to live with. Any company that moves the kind of product that we do will have people who do not agree with what they are doing. We have in the past and will continue to make every effort to please all who come in contact with us. Customer service is our #1 goal and will be that way 50 years from now. We are eternally grateful for the amazing customers that we have had the pleasure of doing business with in the past and look forward to those who we will be able to work with in the future.
Thank you,
Kyle Thompson
Owner of Thompson Motorsports
I would also like to personally touch on the "removing threads" detail of this. I am sure the moderator who has now chimed in on this can verify that we have never at any time made any attempt to remove any information from this or any forum. We do believe in the system and the ability for anyone to speak freely about their opinions on any subject. You can find anything and everything that has ever been written about TMS online now and always as we will never alter it in any way. I do not want anyone to purchase from us under any false impression that we are perfect. WE ARE NOT. We do however strive to produce the best product available on the market at a fair price. We have had failures, We have made mistakes and we will make more. We do take every opportunity to learn from our mistakes to ensure that they are held to a minimum. We do ask that you keep all mistakes in perspective. You can read of probably 6 or 10 problems that have come about with TMS motors on various forums and pages. These are not all of them, We do have more. We keep track of every motor produced and any problem that comes up regardless of fault. We have produced a total of over 1700 LS motors since opening TMS. We are proud of the fact that our rate of failure is around 1%. I would like it to be 0% but this is a mechanical item. Even with the best parts assembled perfectly sometimes things fail, Sometimes humans make mistakes. When these things happen we do make every effort to correct them often to a point that is so overwhelming we have been accused of committing "financial suicide" by some competitors. We will continue to do this, I have no intent on making our faults any ones problems but our own. We will also continue to strive for the impossible goal of 0%.
Now for the motor in question. When any TMS motor is sold it goes into our sales system. It is then manually moved to an online database where the details of the motor are input. These range from generation block type, reluctors, all the way to intended use. This is where the problem was with this motor. When the motor was input the incorrect info was put in. Instead of a high boost ring gap it was sent as a NA ring gap. This was MY personal mistake. We have since revised our system. Now when any motor is input in the database it must be signed by 2 people in sales to verify that the info is accurate. We also have now set in place a way for the machinist to open the original invoice that was created and sent to the customer to verify and check all information. This should eliminate the possibility for anything like this to happen again.
I am sorry for the lengthy explanation of all that has happened here. I hope this clears up any question of our credibility or engine building ability. I know that there are people who do not like TMS, I can see that with some of the posts here. That is something we have to live with. Any company that moves the kind of product that we do will have people who do not agree with what they are doing. We have in the past and will continue to make every effort to please all who come in contact with us. Customer service is our #1 goal and will be that way 50 years from now. We are eternally grateful for the amazing customers that we have had the pleasure of doing business with in the past and look forward to those who we will be able to work with in the future.
Thank you,
Kyle Thompson
Owner of Thompson Motorsports
08-29-2014, 12:18 PM
#64
read your whole reply, stand up answer to the reality of the situation. Any business owner knows he can't get to perfect. Hell Six Sigma is what a lot of big manufactures attain or drive toward, and that's not zero failures either. things do happen, it's how they are handled and corrected.
08-29-2014, 01:22 PM
#65
I hate to say this as a sponsor on here but IMO you should never base your purchasing decision solely on a company's reputation on a single forum, especially a big purchase. On many forums there is too much moderation going on and a lot of negative gets deleted about sponsors so you never get a true feedback on that company. Its impossible to please everyone 100% of the time and everyone makes mistake but when an issue comes up, how the company handles it the important thing to me.
08-29-2014, 01:54 PM
#66
It is no problem. I am not implying that you were pointing us out and agree that there should be extensive research on any purchase such as a motor. I just wanted to clarify that we will take no part in hiding anything good or bad.
08-29-2014, 02:22 PM
#67
Glad that you all were able to resolve the issue in a professional manner. Taking responsibility of a mistake says a lot. All that matters is that the issue was resolved. Their will always be gang bangers in forums and he sad part is I would estimate 90% of the people bashing have never done business with your company.
08-30-2014, 12:54 PM
#72
See, the process does work. The OP did the right thing by posting a thread asking for opinions, but not getting into name bashing, which got him feedback of what was legitimate expectations. The company upon hearing the issue, contacted him and worked with him to resolve the situation.
I always recommend people talk directly to the company FIRST before coming on here or any internet based group and slinging mud. Sometimes, all that it accomplishes is a lot of hurt feelings and empty wallets.
I always recommend people talk directly to the company FIRST before coming on here or any internet based group and slinging mud. Sometimes, all that it accomplishes is a lot of hurt feelings and empty wallets.
08-30-2014, 02:28 PM
#73
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Thats a very stout answer from TMS. I sell tires for big rigs as a side business, and even the top of the line michelin tires fail within a few miles of use. I hope to buy a block from tms in the future.
08-30-2014, 03:21 PM
#74
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Pretty cool to see how this was handled from beginning to end - both the customer & the vendor showed class. 
I felt that it's particularly noteworthy that not only did Thompson make a reasonable effort to resolve this particular issue, but they also adjusted their processes to try to keep it from coming up again - that strikes me as a business that wants to be around for the long haul. Nicely done guys.
I felt that it's particularly noteworthy that not only did Thompson make a reasonable effort to resolve this particular issue, but they also adjusted their processes to try to keep it from coming up again - that strikes me as a business that wants to be around for the long haul. Nicely done guys. 