slowlsx

iTrader: (28)

Anybody have a diagram of i should run my 3rd pump inline? i already have 2 255 walbros in the tank with -8 Feed and i have a Bosch 044 that i am wanting to do inline.

looking to see if anyone has any diagrams or pictures of how to do this, also would it be recommended to run it on a hobbs switch? currently my 255's are both always running with hot wire kits.

i put this in the FI section because only FI people run 3 pumps!!

FourG63 97GST

iTrader: (1)

This is what I did for a secondary. it T into the factory system before the rail.
let me know if the link shows up, it's hosted on FB.

T/ALT1

iTrader: (3)

I like that, I also have 2-255LPH's and want to add a 3rd pump instead of changing the whole setup.

stevieturbo

Draw exactly what you are referring to. As putting pumps inline is pretty pointless unless you are looking to bump up fuel pressure.

slowlsx

iTrader: (28)

Well I thought it was as easy as putting the bosch 044 between the 2 255's and where I connects to my fuels rails but im not sure if that is how it should be done or not?

More or less looking for advice on how I coukd integrate this 3rd pump into my fuel system to where I woukd benefit from it lol.

stevieturbo

To gain flow, pumps need to be in parallel like you have already done with the Walbros.

Easiest and cheapest option would be to stick a 3rd Walbro in.

Forcefed86

iTrader: (4)

Couldn't he use pressure to compensate for flow? This would bump your injector size up at the same time. Very common place in the import world. Keep total pressure under 100 and you should be fine.

If you ran the 044 inline and cranked your base pressure up (65 or so?) you'd have alot more fuel to play with. The 2 255 will push through the 044 just fine. Set up the 044 on a pressure switch to come on at 1psi.

What kind of boost/power are you wanting to make?

stevieturbo

If the Walbros cannot provide enough flow, putting another pump in the path is going to offer negligible improvement to flow.

So no you cannot use pressure to compensate for flow, because without sufficient flow you wont have the pressure in the first place

Forcefed86

iTrader: (4)

That’s not how I understand it…. By putting a pump inline the supply pumps don’t have to work at the same elevated pressures. The twin intank pumps will move a lot more volume at lower pressures. So by using the 3rd pump inline for pressure, I'd think the 2 intank pumps would put out more volume.

a4ls2goat

I did something similar on my evo.

If the bosch is placed inline you definitely have to have it on full time. If not you will have issues pushing fuel through a dead pump. I tried having mine come on with boost and it didnt work. The car would start bucking at cruising speeds.

runsfromdacops

You will gain flow buy the fact that the feed pumps (wabros in this case) are not trying to make any real pressure. They are just providing flow to the next pump in line. The flow will dramticly increase as pressure is reduced. The same is true for the in line 044 it will be "feed" fuel from the in tank pumps and will not have to work as hard to flow more. Also 044s flow much more at higher pressure so u have that on you side as well

Forcefed86

iTrader: (4)

Strange, I’ve done it with no issues. TT supra pump intank, 044 inline. Also pushed through an 255 inline pump with no issue.

stevieturbo

A pump added inline will flow a little more, but certainly not a lot more.

It would be a very inefficient and messy way to gain a small amount of flow. Just do the job right.

Or change the 2 Walbro's in tank to a pair of Bosch or something

Forcefed86

iTrader: (4)

I don’t agree. If you look at the attached pic you will see the pump flows MUCH more at 10psi than it does at say 50psi. Multiply that by 2 pumps and you’re looking an additional 200lph+ (similar to adding an additional pump!). Nothing inefficient or “wrong” about it. It’s a tried and true method that people have used for years.

denmah

iTrader: (2)

we have done a 340 in tank, and 044 pusher, i think twin 255s and a 044 should work well also, twin 255s are beasts though

try it out and let us know how it does

stevieturbo

So now you're wanting to feed 2 x Walbro's into a single 044 ??

You can't be serious ?

Ultimately you will still be limited by the flow abilities of each single pump, and if you feed 2 into 1....that 1 will then become the restriction.
It isnt going to suddenly start flowing double by magic.

Just do the job right and stop ******* about.

Preston99WS6

iTrader: (7)

Couple of theory's here.

Stevie Turbo You are right by stating that 2 pumps in parallel will increase flow rate. And that this particular scenario is not going to work as stated.

Two pumps in series increases pressure, with very negligible gains in flow rate. But it is possible to increase flow this way

How to gain flow with a pump in series. The way these small pumps work is the higher pressure you have the lower there flow rate and the opposite would be true lower pressure yields a higher flow rate.
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Now what can be done is a pump with a higher flow rate than the two 255's combined can be installed in between the tank and rails. The larger pumps suction will cause the discharge pressure of the twins to lower increasing their flow rate. The purpose of the twins becomes to feed the larger pump. Then the larger pump will boost the pressure back to wherever the regulator is set.

The problem the OP is going to have is the bosch 044 is rated at 300 lph @ 55psi so he is going to try and force 510 LPH through it fluids are essentially incompressible for all engineering analysis. Its not designed to flow that much so its will become a restriction. That being said I have two bachelors one in mechanical engineering and one in nuclear engineering and I am a operator at a nuclear power plant, pumps play a big role in what I do.

Now with our new found knowledge if the OP was going to use something that had a flow rate in the 800 LPH area instead he would be able to flow a lot more fuel. As the discharge pressure of the twins would lower and there volumetric flow rate would increase to well over 400 LPH appiece. I would suggest A-1000 but I am not sure that the twins can put out that much flow at the reduced pressure and starving a pump leads to cavitation and ultimately the big pump would break if the twins aren't up to the task but 750-800LPH would be what I would look for, but that's what google is for.

Forcefed86

iTrader: (4)

Oh I'm serious, and I've done it. Now of course I can't tell you exactly what was gained. Or the exact pressures or flow rates. I know a 255hp intank feeding an 044 was able to push just under 600whp on e85 through stock 3/8 steel fuel lines and -6 an hoses at 65psi of base pressure.

I agree with what Preston99WS6 is saying. I don't think the pressure between the intank and the "booster" pumps is as low as he is thinking though. There is no fuel sump tank so I think there is a decent amount pressure built up between the pumps. That has a compound effect and allows more total pressure to be run as it makes the 044's job a bit easier.

Also know of a member running a turbo 6.0 well into the 900hp range on e85. His Magnafuel 4303 wouldn't keep up, so he installed an 044 inline and inj DC dropped form 100 to 70. Works great now. So the 044 can't be as much of a restriction as you think.

pyro719

iTrader: (5)

Why not run dual walbro 450's? I made close to 500awhp in my galant vr4 on a single walbro 400 on e85. Oh and that was on the "heart breaker" Dyno dynamics dyno

snapc3

If the 044 is fed by 2 pumps it would become more efficient and have a higher flow rate because it is working at a lower effective pressure. IF the Walbros were able to flow and maintain 50 psi at the inlet of the 044 and it is regulated to 65 psi, the 044 is working at the difference of 15 psi and will flow what its rated at 15 psi.