greinder03

iTrader: (11)

228/232 .598/.600 on a 111
ls6 intake
ls6 heads
3800-4000 stall converter
double springs
chromoly push rods

should make 420-450 rwhp right
cant wait
i wonder how long trans and rear are going to last spraying a 100 shot to above set-up

Assman

iTrader: (2)

Should be a good setup, maybe think about double springs for that big of a cam. And you will want to change your pushrods, even if they are the same lenght(which I doubt) the stockers are weak.

Phoenix 5.7

iTrader: (7)

1.75 will never work, no chance in hell, and no damn reason. that is a huge lift cam as ground. and duals are a necessity with high lift cams. stock valve LS6 heads should work, but if they have bigger valves, u will probably have PtV issues. dunno on pushrod length, call TSP and ask them, hell, u need to call them anyway instead of piecing together stuff.

greinder03

iTrader: (11)

why wont 1.75 rocker work??????
and yes i am going to call tsp, im just trying to learn about how everything works

Phoenix 5.7

iTrader: (7)

cause the cam already has big lift as ground, around 630 if i remember right, higher ratio rockers are for stock and small cams.

Brad Hutchcraft

iTrader: (8)

Definitely not going to work, for a number of different reasons. Call TSP and they will explain this better for you. But just glancing at the cam specs posted on their page, I would say that the cam, although not a monster with its duration, has a TON of lift on the intake side. I would say its probably an XER lobe, but Im definitely not an expert. And on the exhaust side, has a bit more duration, and alot less lift, making me think its on an XE lobe. The intake is TOO aggressive for a beehive spring. You need the Dual Springs.
The pushrods, even though this is an auto car, will want to be replaced as well. Just save yourself the heartache of bending or snapping the factory pushrod with that nasty cam.
The converter is a good choice in my opinion..
The heads are a good step up too...
And dont even think about the higher ratio rockers. You already have close enough ptv, but adding unneccessary lift to that camshaft will probably send the intake valve right into the top of your flat-top piston... not good.

Check out the cam guide in this section, and read, reAD, READ! It has a wealth of useful information and short cuts, and is SO helpful.

to answer your question bluntly,

the cam is good, the heads are good, and the converter is good, but everything else is a negative.

greinder03

iTrader: (11)

so im going to run
ms4 cam
ls6 heads
3800 stall converter
double springs
chromoly push rods
should be badass.
theres no way i can upgrade the rockers. what is the stock ratio? arent aftermarket ones lighter and better for high rpm's

thanks for the help

Asmodeus

You could run a higher rocker ratio, but your springs would need so much seat pressure to control a lobe ramp that violent with anything higher than stock 1.7's that your stock lifters would liquify.. or pee themselves first THEN liquify. The intake lobe on the MS4 is a comp LSK lobe. It can turn a dual spring into butter within 20,000 miles. It's a good idea to check them every 10.

The convertor seems a little small for the MS4, but it COULD work, just won't be optimal. And if you've got stock gears in the rear end, you should think about changing those too. ESPECIALLY if they're 2.73's.

Drivability in an A4 will suffer with that cam, it needs a REALLY good tune.

But yeah, it will scream. The piston to valve clearance will be tighter than the recommended safety margin, so make sure the valves don't float or you could tap the piston and bend them.

jroc2312

Nicely done !!!!!

Phoenix 5.7

iTrader: (7)

stock is 1.7. yella terra superlights(or is it ultraligt) might be good. rebuild stockers by harland sharp might be the way to go. most of the aftermarket rockers are actually heavier.

greinder03

iTrader: (11)

what would be an adequate stall? 4000 4200?
there is no special springs to make the springs not go to butter in 20,000

Top Fuel

iTrader: (8)

4400 would be the best stall for that cam.

the LSK lobes are harsh and will eat springs as already covered. You have to ask yourself is that lobe necessary for your app? Most people on this board dont have heads that flow well enough up top to utilize that lift. Save yourself the valvetrain issues, get an MS3

greinder03

iTrader: (11)

its only going to be driven to the races every friday and saturday night, andmaybe car shows once in a while. so i am trying to get the most power my budget can handle, and right now ls6 heads are all i can afford so i need the biggest cam ls6 heads can handle, and i heard the ms4 is perfect.
i talked to a guy at virginia speed and he said this cam was perfect for ls6 heads and made better power with less lift. what your guys opinion??
228/232 .598/.600 on a 111 should make 440 rwhp with ls6 heads and bolt ons??
i was just going to get an ms4 cause i can get one cheaper used! im on a budget

tylermurphy1

iTrader: (1)

okay im goin to get a magicstick 4 cam with the prc valve springs and push rods...double roller timing chain all through TSP...also getting Comp Cams Pro Magnum Rockers, Hooker LTs, Y Pipe and Exhaust...SLP which will be here tuesday....wat else would i need besides a tune....im bein told i need to upgrade my heads...i have an LS6 block...its a freak from factory....

Asmodeus

While an LS6 block is rare, it doesn't mean anything in terms of performance (or strength, just better oiling and bay to bay breathing). 01's also have the LS6 intake (ALL 01's do), but not the LS6 heads. You have your bases covered for your installation, but the MS cams were designed to work with stock heads, so you will be ok with them.

greinder03

iTrader: (11)

228/232 .598/.600 on a 111 or ms4 with stock ls6 heads

moeZ28

iTrader: (7)

The MS4 camshaft has specs of : 239/242 .649/.609 with 1.7 ratio rockers. If you put 1.75 ratio rockers on it, your lift will be .668/.627. You will definitely need dual valve springs, either patriot extremes or PRC Platinum duals (which I highly recommend). You will most likely have to shim them too. Those rockers arent needed in your application. PTV clearance will be an issue without flycutting or aftermarket pistons.

greinder03

iTrader: (11)

thanks for the help, much appreciated

hammertime

iTrader: (1)

I would avoid the temptation to go with the biggest cam for the most power. Smaller cams can make similar power without being such a bear to tune and drive at low speeds in a sane manner. Sure a converter will help mask that, but for track use, you're looking for a 4500 or so stall to be ideal. It's also worth noting that a stock automatic isn't going to last long without some upgrades if you spin the engine high enough to take advantage of the cam's full potential (7000+).
That cam installed on a 108* or 107* ICL will make more usable power up to about 6200 rpm, and has 10 degrees less overlap than the MS4. IMO, it will be a lot easier to tune and live with when you are not at WOT, and it will work much better with your 3800 stall.

Brad Hutchcraft

iTrader: (8)

I actually like this camshaft better for your specific app. First, it has only moderate duration, and the lifts just to .600 lift. This would work MUCH better with your factory intake manifold, and would produce a much more usable power band. And because of the 111lsa, I would even see about milling your heads to about 59 cc or so to pick up a little torque as well. Your valvetrain would be safer, your car would have more midrange, and your converter would put you right in the meat of your powerband. This seems like the better choice to me. Guys like Asmodeus have been on this forum for some time, and are giving you AWESOME advice. You are definitely doing the right thing by asking ALOT of questions.. good luck.