metros

^^^Is that with stock oil pump or aftermarket?

Just came over to FD with LS1, switching from an s2000. Looking to see the requirements to make this car reliable on track.

dtfastbear

That's stock oil pump and aftermarket oil cooler. I use the lingenfelter adapter right above the stock filter location to plumb the whole thing.

pkincy

iTrader: (1)

Whatever solution you pick you need one. My last 2 track days each cost me a crank and rods in the first 20 minute session. I suppose I should have thought of an oiling problem the first time when I scored the crank and spun the bearings but it wasn't until after I repaired it and it happened again that I realized it is a design problem (at least on hot asphalt with good suspension and race rubber) in a high G situation.

Now I run a digital Oil Pressure guage set to flash at 25 psi and it is about my eye level on the A pillar.

Perry

Scott@GMHTP

Our STI Killer currently runs a stock LS6 (oil pump, cam, etc) with the Improved Racing baffle in an F-body oil pan. To my knowledge there are no issues with oil pressure, consumption or starvation. Those who are familiar with the car can attest it lives a hard life making high-G turns on our test track and Sebring using our BMR suspension and Toyo R888s. We usually run Amsoil 10W30 or Mobil 1 5W30. Should we make some valvetrain upgrades, though, the plan was to go with a blueprinted LS6 oil pump.

http://www.gmhightechperformance.com...des/index.html

dtfastbear

Sebring has no sustained left hand turns. What about your test track? I've never seen an issue in rights, only long 180 degree LEFT hand fast sweepers.

pkincy

iTrader: (1)

Precisely right. It is left handers that cause the problem.

The Carousel at Sears Point (hint: I am old), many places at California Speedway, Turn 2 at Thunderhill, Talladega Turn when running CCW at Buttonwillow, end of the drag strip on Firebird Main in Phoenix, etc.

Perry

Fb0dy0nly

iTrader: (10)

No one has talked about this setup really here, any thoughts?
http://www.improvedracing.com/produc...products_id=30

Or there is this one too that is suppose to work well..
http://www.mastmotorsports.com/2010/...%20Pans&id=160

From what scott says above, seems like the issue is with the pan and baffle system on stock ls pans. If that is the case, these should help resolve oiling issues without the need for coolers or even possibly accusump depening on how much you are thrashing the car in the corners

dtfastbear

I've used the Improved Racing baffle in a stock F-body pan. I've also used the V8Roadsters pan (my LS1 is in a miata, so there are some swap-specific parts) which has its own baffling. Both are very well made pieces and both work well at keeping the oil in the pan around the pickup. But I believe the real problems with G's are up inside the motor/heads and that the oil doesn't drain down quickly enough. The pan baffles solve part of the problem but not the entire problem. At least that's what my experience has demonstrated. I'm no expert on the cause, but I've got plenty of evidence on the results/outcomes.

Again, I only see the issue on very long, high G (much higher than street applications) left hand corners. YMMV.

Cheers,

Dean

pkincy

iTrader: (1)

Many folks solve or mitigate the problem with a pretty large overfill of the pan.

On the LS1 pan it can hold 7 qts without getting in the way of the baffle or crank apparently.

dtfastbear

What has never been clear to me is exactly what is happening inside the engine that allows the pressure to drop in long lefts...

If enough oil is being trapped up in the motor and not draining back such that the oil pickup starts to scavenge for oil, then a combination of oil pan baffles, lifter tray mods and overfill should absolutely work to eliminate the pressure dip.

If the problem is that the G's somehow cause an interruption in the flow of oil that the oil pump cannot overcome but an Accusump somehow helps (it provides pressure from a slightly different point in the engine), then any amount of overfill or baffles won't rectify the problem. Would a higher pressure oil pump, in that case?

Or, is the problem NOT one of these two simplified options?

Seems like a lot of speculation, but I've yet to see a concrete explanation.

Thoughts?

Cheers,

Dean

Andy1

I've read a lot of discussion on this forum in this regard. I'll speculate it's probably a combination of a couple of things going on in combination, so resolving one of them is not the lone answer, and both would likely be required to fix the problem (or perhaps there's more?).

So baffling the pan is, in my estimation, necessary to control oil sloshing around to prevent or minimize exposing the oil pick up. However, if the volume of oil in the pan is insufficient due to oil being trapped in the heads, the baffled pan is rendered useless. Thus, returning the oil back to the pan where the baffled pan can do its' thing seems like the potential solution.

Oil getting trapped in the heads is not an issue isolated only to the LSx, but it seems to be more prevelant. Employing external oil drain back lines is not a new idea. I have seen where the Arias LSx hemi heads incorporate them, so perhaps they've learned something that many here have speculated on; it's an oil drain back issue. I've also seen external oil drain back lines on SBC's in roadrace applications even when using dry sump. External drain backs are a somewhat un-tidey solution for an occasional track/HPDE car. Perhaps someone has found an effective way to do it internally. Some have said that drilling the plastic pushrod guides helps, but it's not clear how effective that really is in a roadrace application. Thoughts?

Andy1