4L60E slow 3 -> 4?
Thread Starter
On The Tree
Joined: Feb 2011
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4L60E slow 3 -> 4? New to the autotrannys and i just finished my first rebuild with success i think.
One thing worrys me which was also before rebuild, is 3 to 4 shift. Its compared to the other shifts, very slow.
PCM have also retuned with shift kit, but my problem stays the same.
Im very pleased with all the other shifts and the way how my tranny handles power.
Give me a hint where i should look for? Im thinking its more mechanical than a tune now?
One thing worrys me which was also before rebuild, is 3 to 4 shift. Its compared to the other shifts, very slow.
PCM have also retuned with shift kit, but my problem stays the same.
Im very pleased with all the other shifts and the way how my tranny handles power.
Give me a hint where i should look for? Im thinking its more mechanical than a tune now?
Moderator
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 7,322
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From: Ann Arbor, MI
A WOT 3-4 shift will take place at 130mph+ .
I stay in 3rd on the drag strip.
Where/why would you ever need to worry about WOT 3-4 shifts?
You probably would need a set of 2nd and 4th billet pistons to improve the shift.
I stay in 3rd on the drag strip.
Where/why would you ever need to worry about WOT 3-4 shifts?
You probably would need a set of 2nd and 4th billet pistons to improve the shift.
Moderator
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 7,322
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From: Ann Arbor, MI
OK, so we are talking about the 2-3 shift then.
Tell me what 3/4 frictions you used, what clearance they have, and especially how big you drilled the 3rd feed hole in the separator plate.
If this was a "stock" rebuild, I would suggest installing at least a "partial" shift kit which will require dropping the valve body.
Tell me what 3/4 frictions you used, what clearance they have, and especially how big you drilled the 3rd feed hole in the separator plate.
If this was a "stock" rebuild, I would suggest installing at least a "partial" shift kit which will require dropping the valve body.
Thread Starter
On The Tree
Joined: Feb 2011
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Actually i did this wisely in my point of wiew. I have so little knowledge yet with these things and pretty good shop to work with, so i ordered this kit from PBA.
http://www.700r4l60e.com/store/produ...&cat=55&page=1
Its in -72 nova with around 450hp LS1 and yank 3000. Street use only
First i drive it 50 to 100 miles easily and tried few WOT pulls and the shift was annoingly slow.
Today i did some WOT pulls again and shift feels faster now than yesterday.
Maybe the frictions are driven in now or how it feels different than yesterday, i dont know.
If this problem stays the same as yestersday or get worse, is there any tricks i can try?
I did some search and half quart oil i can try to add, but how about the tune?
Now i have TSP mailorder tune with my specs. Is there anything i can do with tune here?
Instruction with the kit was good and clearances was spot on. I only had to put one thicker endplate to forward cluch. I think it was because of dead wavy plate or so. but it works
http://www.700r4l60e.com/store/produ...&cat=55&page=1
Its in -72 nova with around 450hp LS1 and yank 3000. Street use only
First i drive it 50 to 100 miles easily and tried few WOT pulls and the shift was annoingly slow.
Today i did some WOT pulls again and shift feels faster now than yesterday.
Maybe the frictions are driven in now or how it feels different than yesterday, i dont know.
If this problem stays the same as yestersday or get worse, is there any tricks i can try?
I did some search and half quart oil i can try to add, but how about the tune?
Now i have TSP mailorder tune with my specs. Is there anything i can do with tune here?
Instruction with the kit was good and clearances was spot on. I only had to put one thicker endplate to forward cluch. I think it was because of dead wavy plate or so. but it works
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Moderator
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 7,322
Likes: 528
From: Ann Arbor, MI
PBA sells a nice proven kit and the shifts should be very fast and firm.
As I have posted many times, I suggest you purchase a Trans pressure gauge. Lookip "ATD 5550" on Amazon, it is only $35.
The hose is long enough that you can hang it from your driver's side mirror or windshield and monitor pressure while you drive.
First report what the pressure is in Park (75), Reverse (175) and Drive (75). Blip the throttle and tell us how high it goes, it should get up to around 220.
With those pressure readings, I'm sure PBA can diagnose the problem and I will take a shot at it too.
As I have posted many times, I suggest you purchase a Trans pressure gauge. Lookip "ATD 5550" on Amazon, it is only $35.
The hose is long enough that you can hang it from your driver's side mirror or windshield and monitor pressure while you drive.
First report what the pressure is in Park (75), Reverse (175) and Drive (75). Blip the throttle and tell us how high it goes, it should get up to around 220.
With those pressure readings, I'm sure PBA can diagnose the problem and I will take a shot at it too.
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Verdad Gallardo Thread Starter
On The Tree
Joined: Feb 2011
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Okay, so no solutions from tuning here. Next step is monitoring pressures.
I order pressure gauge to be sure. It might take a while when i can measure it, but seems its the only way now. Will be back then. Thanks for help!
I order pressure gauge to be sure. It might take a while when i can measure it, but seems its the only way now. Will be back then. Thanks for help!
Thread Starter
On The Tree
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 130
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Ordered ATD 5550 gauge and it should be here within a week or so.
Did some driving again and now i can say i definetly have some problem.
It missed WOT gear change and run to the limiter. . . . damn it.
Normal driving is still fine.
Did some driving again and now i can say i definetly have some problem.
It missed WOT gear change and run to the limiter. . . . damn it.
Normal driving is still fine.
Moderator
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 7,322
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From: Ann Arbor, MI
I suspect very low line pressure - don't go WOT or you will quickly wear out the frictions.
I assume you rebuilt the pump; here are some possible problems:
1. You forgot the yellow filter on the side of the pump.
2. You forgot the o-ring under the oil seal under the pump slide.
3. Installing the supplied stator shaft bent the pump housing.
I'm not implying you aren't a good builder, but these problems have been reported by others.
I assume you rebuilt the pump; here are some possible problems:
1. You forgot the yellow filter on the side of the pump.
2. You forgot the o-ring under the oil seal under the pump slide.
3. Installing the supplied stator shaft bent the pump housing.
I'm not implying you aren't a good builder, but these problems have been reported by others.
Thread Starter
On The Tree
Joined: Feb 2011
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Definitely not gonna drive the car way like that. Jumping to the limiter scared me so i parked my car in carage.
One of your hints what causes the problem made me think and im 50% sure its there.
1. Filter is in the pump. Kit didnt include new one, but i wash the old one and its in place.
3. Pump housing is straigh. I have a good bench press and i supported housing near as center as possible. It was a snug fit but i checked it after with straight edge.
2. This one! O-ring is there, but it might be installed wrong way. Its only two weeks from rebuild so i remember something. If i recall correctly i installed O-ring towards pump case. Sloppy build here.
Thats my bad and only one to blame here. I couldnt wait for pressure gauge to arrive. There is a problem anyway. Pulled tranny out from the car today and opening the pump to see whats inside as soon as i can.
Hope i didnt burn anything yet. Oil is still fresh and clear at least.
One of your hints what causes the problem made me think and im 50% sure its there.
1. Filter is in the pump. Kit didnt include new one, but i wash the old one and its in place.
3. Pump housing is straigh. I have a good bench press and i supported housing near as center as possible. It was a snug fit but i checked it after with straight edge.
2. This one! O-ring is there, but it might be installed wrong way. Its only two weeks from rebuild so i remember something. If i recall correctly i installed O-ring towards pump case. Sloppy build here.
Thats my bad and only one to blame here. I couldnt wait for pressure gauge to arrive. There is a problem anyway. Pulled tranny out from the car today and opening the pump to see whats inside as soon as i can.
Hope i didnt burn anything yet. Oil is still fresh and clear at least.
Moderator
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 7,322
Likes: 528
From: Ann Arbor, MI
Couple things...
First, surprised you had to wait so long for the pressure gauge. Its available on Amazon for free 2-day shipping for Prime members.
Next, I understand you are anxious to fix it and therefore removed the trans, but it would have been helpful to first connect the pressure gauge as that would have helped steer us in the right direction.
Last, I have limited experience (and not a clairvoyant) and only suspected low line pressure, based on your description. If you don't find anything wrong with the pump, we might not know what to check next.
I'm not comfortable having people remove the their trans and tear it down based on just one of my posts. And least not until others chime in. (You might not have described the problem correctly, I might have misunderstood you, or I might simply be wrong.)
Good luck and keep us posted.
First, surprised you had to wait so long for the pressure gauge. Its available on Amazon for free 2-day shipping for Prime members.
Next, I understand you are anxious to fix it and therefore removed the trans, but it would have been helpful to first connect the pressure gauge as that would have helped steer us in the right direction.
Last, I have limited experience (and not a clairvoyant) and only suspected low line pressure, based on your description. If you don't find anything wrong with the pump, we might not know what to check next.
I'm not comfortable having people remove the their trans and tear it down based on just one of my posts. And least not until others chime in. (You might not have described the problem correctly, I might have misunderstood you, or I might simply be wrong.)
Good luck and keep us posted.
Thread Starter
On The Tree
Joined: Feb 2011
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Well, i live in northern Europe and i did order the gauge from ebay because from my experience they can delivier stuff 1-2 weeks depends where its sent. Not familiar with Amazon. Ordering from ebay i know emidiately shipping costs an i can calculate customs and toll. Many times shipping is more expensive than the item, but the cost of the customs is prize+shipping counted together. Weird or what. Its pretty expensive here to build some american muscle. 
I get your point. Its my hobby to fix and build cars so its not a big deal to remove transmission. Not afraid the labor. I can leave it and drive other vehicle if i need to. Driving season here is short, so dont want to wait too many weeks.
When i put back together my pump, it was the only time when i havent any back up information at that time where i could check the right order. So its a big chance i messed up there with O-ring and metal ring order.
At that time when pressure gauge arrives i have tranny back together in car and i will do measuring then. Just want to check pump. Luckily its first thing to remove there.
I get your point. Its my hobby to fix and build cars so its not a big deal to remove transmission. Not afraid the labor. I can leave it and drive other vehicle if i need to. Driving season here is short, so dont want to wait too many weeks.
When i put back together my pump, it was the only time when i havent any back up information at that time where i could check the right order. So its a big chance i messed up there with O-ring and metal ring order.
At that time when pressure gauge arrives i have tranny back together in car and i will do measuring then. Just want to check pump. Luckily its first thing to remove there.
TECH Junkie
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 3,045
Likes: 713
From: Poplarville, MS
Yeah, a little premature in pulling the trans out. Now you must pull it all apart and check everything. If nothing is visibly wrong you will need to air check everything, paying close attention to air leaks around the boost valve sleeve. Sonnax sells a boost valve with o-rings around the sleeve that will stop that air leak.
Attached are some instructions from a Sonnax Sure Cure® Kit that has some very good info that can be used even if you’re not installing their kit. The last few pages shows you what parts to test and how to air test them.
Attached are some instructions from a Sonnax Sure Cure® Kit that has some very good info that can be used even if you’re not installing their kit. The last few pages shows you what parts to test and how to air test them.
Thread Starter
On The Tree
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 130
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Yes i know, just having so strong feeling that i messed up with that O-ring and metal ring order. Same time its easy check oilpan if there is material from frictions. It really felt weird when it was delayed shift first and then it felt better and the last time WOT pull hit the limiter. I will post when i progress with this.
One question comes in mind. I ordered all new solenoids, forcemotor and wiring kit earlier, but i didnt installed wirings becase tcc solenoid was different than the old one. The old one have screen filter and this new wiring with tcc solenoid have not screen or even grooves to installi it? Is this wrong model of tcc solenoid or what?
Bought it from ebay and supposed to be models 1996-02.
One question comes in mind. I ordered all new solenoids, forcemotor and wiring kit earlier, but i didnt installed wirings becase tcc solenoid was different than the old one. The old one have screen filter and this new wiring with tcc solenoid have not screen or even grooves to installi it? Is this wrong model of tcc solenoid or what?
Bought it from ebay and supposed to be models 1996-02.
I got that AC Delco 7 piece wire harness with all solenoids, force motor, etc and the TCC solenoid didn't have the slot where you would twist the new filter in. I was advised to not worry about it not having a filter.
