To much torque
06-14-2012, 08:32 PM
#21
Teching In
iTrader: (6)
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Columbus, OH
Posts: 23
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I'd keep the motor stock, and use your budget to help the car actually utilize the power you've got now. Those 30-year-old F60-15's have got to go, as they'll be the first thing that will make you lose in any race. Once you have the car up & running w/ the L33, get yourself some nice 15x10's (or wider) for the rear, and some drag radials. That'll chew up 1-2k of your budget. Save the rest & wait for things to break.
06-14-2012, 10:40 PM
#22
On The Tree
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 191
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The intention was to get down to 1500 before the cage and the new seats and 5 point harness.
Id guess at 2000-2200 after its all said and done, but that's a long way off.
1500-1800 pounds and 330 HP seems like it will be plenty fast and keep me busy for quite a while.
Frame seems pretty beefy, but I don't really know that much about it, I will start an actual build thread tomorrow and post pictures, then you can give me an opinion. I have it all apart and will try to get as much detail as possible.
Tires on it are about 8.5, I was hoping to find some appropriately spaced american racing rims to match what I have and go 10 wide on race days, or have some widened, will stick out a bit, but I will live, not up for doing fiberglass work to make flares.
4-5 grand budget is for original build/rebuild, not for future upgrades such as a turbo and a cage, I am just going to run it "stock" for a year or two and upgrade systems over time.
As you may have guessed I am a bit of a noob at this, I used to work as a grunt in a high performance shop cleaning up after guys who (supposedly) knew what they were doing, but that was 17 years ago, and whatever I "thought" I knew then has 17 years of dust on it now.
I have no intention of running 10s for a good long time, and the roll cage Wanted would be an 8 point cage minus the bars over the doors, hopefully qualifying a a 6 point cage? (car is ridiculous to get in and out of already, those bars across the doors would be impossible)
you guys have all been a great deal of help, and I don't mind criticism at all. I appreciate being pointed in the right direction.
Id guess at 2000-2200 after its all said and done, but that's a long way off.
1500-1800 pounds and 330 HP seems like it will be plenty fast and keep me busy for quite a while.
Frame seems pretty beefy, but I don't really know that much about it, I will start an actual build thread tomorrow and post pictures, then you can give me an opinion. I have it all apart and will try to get as much detail as possible.
Tires on it are about 8.5, I was hoping to find some appropriately spaced american racing rims to match what I have and go 10 wide on race days, or have some widened, will stick out a bit, but I will live, not up for doing fiberglass work to make flares.
4-5 grand budget is for original build/rebuild, not for future upgrades such as a turbo and a cage, I am just going to run it "stock" for a year or two and upgrade systems over time.
As you may have guessed I am a bit of a noob at this, I used to work as a grunt in a high performance shop cleaning up after guys who (supposedly) knew what they were doing, but that was 17 years ago, and whatever I "thought" I knew then has 17 years of dust on it now.
I have no intention of running 10s for a good long time, and the roll cage Wanted would be an 8 point cage minus the bars over the doors, hopefully qualifying a a 6 point cage? (car is ridiculous to get in and out of already, those bars across the doors would be impossible)
you guys have all been a great deal of help, and I don't mind criticism at all. I appreciate being pointed in the right direction.
06-15-2012, 11:02 AM
#24
When in doubt, go to the source. With a little more searching i found the original manual from the manufacturer.
http://www.fiberfab.us/manuals/earlyvalkyrie.pdf
Says the special shaft ups the rating to 375 torque and 375 HP, after that it has to be upgraded to the four spider gear differential... or if you are anticipating hard starts such as drag racing....
I also found out that they made a production model of this car, with the 450 hp big block and the Pantera transaxle they claimed a top speed of 180 MPH, and that it was the fastest production car in the world, even came with a parachute.
I am still looking to the 4 spider gear upgrade, as id still like to throw a turbo on here and pass the 500 hp mark. For the moment, I am jsut going to build it as is though,
Took the body off last night, wire brushing all the rust off, and repainting the frame, repainted the trans asembly as well, I supose I should start a build thread and post pictures.
http://www.fiberfab.us/manuals/earlyvalkyrie.pdf
Says the special shaft ups the rating to 375 torque and 375 HP, after that it has to be upgraded to the four spider gear differential... or if you are anticipating hard starts such as drag racing....
I also found out that they made a production model of this car, with the 450 hp big block and the Pantera transaxle they claimed a top speed of 180 MPH, and that it was the fastest production car in the world, even came with a parachute.
I am still looking to the 4 spider gear upgrade, as id still like to throw a turbo on here and pass the 500 hp mark. For the moment, I am jsut going to build it as is though,
Took the body off last night, wire brushing all the rust off, and repainting the frame, repainted the trans asembly as well, I supose I should start a build thread and post pictures.
Yah, they've got it covered here. I actually read through the manual. Short input shaft, housing re-enforcement plate, diff mod to lsd (4 spider gear). These mods pretty much cover the weak points. Kinda funny that a company found a use for parts from a Corvair. Keep us posted on progress. Interesting build.
06-15-2012, 03:54 PM
#25
On The Tree
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 191
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
These cars were actually quite popular 40 years ago. they made a 450 hp 180 MPH monster, and then said, here is a kit, you can do it too, and for 1/4 of the price, with redily available parts.
07-10-2012, 10:59 PM
#26
On The Tree
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 191
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Ok, been thinking about this for a while.
I have a plan.
I am thinking to run a largish single turbo. I will run 3 inch pipe back to the muffler location, then join the pipes and run them into an electric exhaust cut out. When closed the exhaust will exit through the two mufflers. when open the exhaust will be directed into the big *** turbo.
in first and second gear the turbo will always be left off, when shifting into third (or at a preset RPM in third) gear I will activate the cut out (or deactivate) The same activator will trigger the first nozzle of a 2 nozzle water meth injection kit and open the cut out 1/2 to 3/4 of the way, hopefully resulting in 2-5 lbs of boost. upon shifting to 4th gear the cut out opens fully and the water meth system goes into high gear.
I only want to generate about 8lbs of boost when wide open. and I don't know anything about tuning and hope to avoid having to shoot huge amounts of fuel in when the boost is running, in theory I am hoping just the water/meth will provide enough octane.
I know for certain that more then 300 torque will frag my differential in short order no matter how careful I drive. Some guys with experience with this set up have told me to forget about 1st gear, that the first time I leave the line in 1st gear at anything near full throttle will be the last time I drive my car before upgrading the diff.
The turbo would have to be large, cus with the turbo off the motor still has to drag all of its air through the turbo, since the car will be over powered off the line and will NEVER hook the power it has, a little restriction might not be a bad thing?
Once up over 50 or 70 MPH (depending on how it dialed in and I could always change it) the boost would kick in and "pull" me to the finish line to make up for the lost torque and the "push" off the line.
Also I wonder if I couldnt find or have made an electric exhaust cut out that would give me a bit more control (almost like a wastegate) to make the turbo spin some and get up to say 1 lb of boost jsut to make sure I wasnt starving the motor in the "non boost" position.
I have looked for a way to do this with an external waste gate and a boost controller but those two items seem to add up to a big dollar amount in a hurry Vs 1-200$ for an electric cut out.
"Why dont you jsut upgrade the diff?" upgrading the diff will cost $800 minimum, and at that point I simply move from the diff being the weak link to the trans being the weak link, I can upgrade the diff and get about 50-75 more torque before the trans grenades, I can then upgrade the trans for about another 1-1.5k and move my torque limit from 300 to 400 (IF I drive carefully) so for $2500 I can add 1 foot pounds and still have to leave the line in second gear.
So my line of thinking is forget about 1st gear, forget about doing a holeshot. and leave behind some push while adding a bunch of pull, and hopefully not have all the boost come on at one big BANG that would probably grenade the diff anyhow only it would blow up at 70 MPH instead of 20
I have a plan.
I am thinking to run a largish single turbo. I will run 3 inch pipe back to the muffler location, then join the pipes and run them into an electric exhaust cut out. When closed the exhaust will exit through the two mufflers. when open the exhaust will be directed into the big *** turbo.
in first and second gear the turbo will always be left off, when shifting into third (or at a preset RPM in third) gear I will activate the cut out (or deactivate) The same activator will trigger the first nozzle of a 2 nozzle water meth injection kit and open the cut out 1/2 to 3/4 of the way, hopefully resulting in 2-5 lbs of boost. upon shifting to 4th gear the cut out opens fully and the water meth system goes into high gear.
I only want to generate about 8lbs of boost when wide open. and I don't know anything about tuning and hope to avoid having to shoot huge amounts of fuel in when the boost is running, in theory I am hoping just the water/meth will provide enough octane.
I know for certain that more then 300 torque will frag my differential in short order no matter how careful I drive. Some guys with experience with this set up have told me to forget about 1st gear, that the first time I leave the line in 1st gear at anything near full throttle will be the last time I drive my car before upgrading the diff.
The turbo would have to be large, cus with the turbo off the motor still has to drag all of its air through the turbo, since the car will be over powered off the line and will NEVER hook the power it has, a little restriction might not be a bad thing?
Once up over 50 or 70 MPH (depending on how it dialed in and I could always change it) the boost would kick in and "pull" me to the finish line to make up for the lost torque and the "push" off the line.
Also I wonder if I couldnt find or have made an electric exhaust cut out that would give me a bit more control (almost like a wastegate) to make the turbo spin some and get up to say 1 lb of boost jsut to make sure I wasnt starving the motor in the "non boost" position.
I have looked for a way to do this with an external waste gate and a boost controller but those two items seem to add up to a big dollar amount in a hurry Vs 1-200$ for an electric cut out.
"Why dont you jsut upgrade the diff?" upgrading the diff will cost $800 minimum, and at that point I simply move from the diff being the weak link to the trans being the weak link, I can upgrade the diff and get about 50-75 more torque before the trans grenades, I can then upgrade the trans for about another 1-1.5k and move my torque limit from 300 to 400 (IF I drive carefully) so for $2500 I can add 1 foot pounds and still have to leave the line in second gear.
So my line of thinking is forget about 1st gear, forget about doing a holeshot. and leave behind some push while adding a bunch of pull, and hopefully not have all the boost come on at one big BANG that would probably grenade the diff anyhow only it would blow up at 70 MPH instead of 20
