Considerations for unprepped tracks?
Thread Starter
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 2,169
Likes: 1
From: Dallas, TX / Boston, MA
Considerations for unprepped tracks? The track i go to (New England Dragway) does virtually no track prep (VHT) on street nights. What can I do to help my dismal 2.3s 60' times?
I'm using BFG KDW's 275/40/17 all around, with the mods listed below... I've tried running 35,25,20psi and havent really noticed a heck of a lot of difference. I've heard both sides of the coin, to lower pressure for track duty, and the other side saying that since they're street tires, to just run street pressure since that's what they are designed to be run on. Does VHT even make a difference for street tires? or is that something that is mostly only beneficial to people with slicks?
granted i'm still learning to launch on a 6-speed, and find the happy medium between bog and spin. I'm hoping to get into the 12's once i get my 60' down to a 2.0 and tighten up my shifts.
I'm using BFG KDW's 275/40/17 all around, with the mods listed below... I've tried running 35,25,20psi and havent really noticed a heck of a lot of difference. I've heard both sides of the coin, to lower pressure for track duty, and the other side saying that since they're street tires, to just run street pressure since that's what they are designed to be run on. Does VHT even make a difference for street tires? or is that something that is mostly only beneficial to people with slicks?
granted i'm still learning to launch on a 6-speed, and find the happy medium between bog and spin. I'm hoping to get into the 12's once i get my 60' down to a 2.0 and tighten up my shifts.
From my experience it is best to lined up directly behind cars using slicks, and that know what they are doing. VHT helps even street tires hook up. As for tire pressure, it is best to air them up to the point where the contact patch is the widest and most complete. This can be verified by doing a burnout, not a brake stand, and seeing if the tire marks are an even shade of black. Too low would show as the outer edges being darker ... too high and the out edges would be a lighter shade. I usually do a 5 second burnout behind a fast car running slicks, I make sure I am on top of his tire groove. I do the burnout out of the water and floor it all the way up to the line. Then I experiment with different stalls to see which is just shy of bogging fo the line.
Using this technique on unprepped tracks, where most low 12 second cars on drag radials are cutting 2.2s, I can cut 1.9s with my high 12 second SS.
Using this technique on unprepped tracks, where most low 12 second cars on drag radials are cutting 2.2s, I can cut 1.9s with my high 12 second SS.
On The Tree
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 124
Likes: 0
From: Ewing, NJ
You can always pick up some VHT in a spray bottle and saturate your tires with it. I only go to the track on gamblers' nights because they have track prep. It's a waste of my time to go on a street night.
g
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Slayer, without a drag radial or better your not going to much on street night. Get a sticky tire on that car and you shouldn'd have many problems. I've been cutting consistant 1.50s no problem at NED street night.
Here's the deal on Wen nights. The right lane prep is virtually perfect at the begining of the night do to the fact that rental was just ending as the gates opened for street night. I would stick to the right lane most of the night. Also, as you know, any jackass can roll through the water box. If you see the car in front roll through with street tires, try and line up out of his groove. As mentioned above carry your burnout as far as you can up to the line without rolling past the beams, the track is covered in all kinds of little ***** from the street tires.
Here's the deal on Wen nights. The right lane prep is virtually perfect at the begining of the night do to the fact that rental was just ending as the gates opened for street night. I would stick to the right lane most of the night. Also, as you know, any jackass can roll through the water box. If you see the car in front roll through with street tires, try and line up out of his groove. As mentioned above carry your burnout as far as you can up to the line without rolling past the beams, the track is covered in all kinds of little ***** from the street tires.
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IMO, go with a good tire.
Nitto's and BFG's a decent tires, but they are not a replacement for a good
set of "cheater" slicks or true slicks on a poorly preped track.
I recommend a set MT Drag Radials, a regular bias ply ET Street/Hoosier. Or even a true slick on an extra set of rims.
Nitto's and BFG's a decent tires, but they are not a replacement for a good
set of "cheater" slicks or true slicks on a poorly preped track.
I recommend a set MT Drag Radials, a regular bias ply ET Street/Hoosier. Or even a true slick on an extra set of rims.
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Verdad Gallardo Thread Starter
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 2,169
Likes: 1
From: Dallas, TX / Boston, MA
went up tonight (wed), and got a new best ET (13.466 @ 105.70) and a new best 60' (2.173). i ran consistent 13.5s ET's and 2.2s 60' all night, so i'm starting to get more consistent with the 6-speed.
my launches were ok, i upped my launch rpm from 1200 to 1500 and got no bogging, but now i have to correct spinning. i tried launching at 1700 a few times, but that was just too much spin, so i'm gonna try to make 1500 work.
i did try to line up with teh rubber of people with slicks, but as the night went on, and the rice built up, it got harder to get behind someone with slicks. (yes, i did run the right lane all night). my fastest run was actually my last run of the night, which was after the '15 minute break', which means the car sat for about 30 mins to cool down a bit. (i was hot lapping the rest of my runs)
i'd love to get drag radials, but i just spent my current car budget ordering a set of headers, a TB, a TA, and the tune i will need after that... so i'm deathly afraid of cracking the rear if i put DR's on, cuz i dont have the $$$ to replace it if it craps out.
my launches were ok, i upped my launch rpm from 1200 to 1500 and got no bogging, but now i have to correct spinning. i tried launching at 1700 a few times, but that was just too much spin, so i'm gonna try to make 1500 work.
i did try to line up with teh rubber of people with slicks, but as the night went on, and the rice built up, it got harder to get behind someone with slicks. (yes, i did run the right lane all night). my fastest run was actually my last run of the night, which was after the '15 minute break', which means the car sat for about 30 mins to cool down a bit. (i was hot lapping the rest of my runs)
i'd love to get drag radials, but i just spent my current car budget ordering a set of headers, a TB, a TA, and the tune i will need after that... so i'm deathly afraid of cracking the rear if i put DR's on, cuz i dont have the $$$ to replace it if it craps out.
Thread Starter
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 2,169
Likes: 1
From: Dallas, TX / Boston, MA
here's my whole slip, incase anyone can tell me anything useful from it:
60': 2.173
330: 5.827
1/8: 8.806
MPH: 82.57
1000: 11.335
1/4: 13.466
MPH: 105.70
60': 2.173
330: 5.827
1/8: 8.806
MPH: 82.57
1000: 11.335
1/4: 13.466
MPH: 105.70
What rpm are you shifting at? Those KDW's are pritty good just a little less sticker than the Nittos how much air preasure do you have in them when you race? You spin off the line at all, does the car bog or do you feater it out of the hole?
My best time with the stock rubber was 13.4 I droped a half a sec. with the DR's
My best time with the stock rubber was 13.4 I droped a half a sec. with the DR's
Thread Starter
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 2,169
Likes: 1
From: Dallas, TX / Boston, MA
shifting at 6000... or at least trying to... my powershifting is inconsistent and every now and then i hit the rev limiter.
i ran 25psi in the rear on wed.
i used to bog when i tried launching at 1200, but now i'm launching at 1500 and i'm getting spin... but i've consistently been getting 2.2s 60' on wed, vs. my previous 2.3's, so i'm getting better of the line. i think i need to roll the clutch out a little slower... sometimes it feels like it hooks and then breaks traction. i'm also breaking loose on the 1-2 shift a tad, and chirp on the 2-3 and sometimes 3-4 as the night goes on
i ran 25psi in the rear on wed.
i used to bog when i tried launching at 1200, but now i'm launching at 1500 and i'm getting spin... but i've consistently been getting 2.2s 60' on wed, vs. my previous 2.3's, so i'm getting better of the line. i think i need to roll the clutch out a little slower... sometimes it feels like it hooks and then breaks traction. i'm also breaking loose on the 1-2 shift a tad, and chirp on the 2-3 and sometimes 3-4 as the night goes on
Originally Posted by Pro Stock John
#'s look good.
Drag radials definitely help a lot, I don't think I ever saw anyone cut a 1.9 or better on F1's.
Drag radials definitely help a lot, I don't think I ever saw anyone cut a 1.9 or better on F1's.
, but we had autos (stock stalls). 
Why don't you try going down to like 20 psi that's what I use to run at the track with my stockers they didn't get loose at the end of the track and I use to leave at around 2500 sometimes 3000 feathering a little.
You power-shift hu, I havent tried that yet. I'm scared of missing and grinding up my trans.
You power-shift hu, I havent tried that yet. I'm scared of missing and grinding up my trans.
Thread Starter
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 2,169
Likes: 1
From: Dallas, TX / Boston, MA
Originally Posted by ace68
Why don't you try going down to like 20 psi that's what I use to run at the track with my stockers they didn't get loose at the end of the track and I use to leave at around 2500 sometimes 3000 feathering a little.
You power-shift hu, I havent tried that yet. I'm scared of missing and grinding up my trans.
You power-shift hu, I havent tried that yet. I'm scared of missing and grinding up my trans.
Speed shift.. let off just enoughso that when the clutch is dropped, it's almost rev matched.. works o.k. for me. Not sure of you removed your front sway bar.. but that helps transfer weight.. might help the car hook with less tire. Best 60 I ever got out of factory f1's was a 2.17, so I don't think that you're doing too bad with the tires you have on really.. a little more pratice, and a 2.0 should be possible.
Not sure how much heat those tires like either.. that's something that you'll have to try, try just spinning them a little to clean them, then try doing a good 10 second burnout, if that helps, up it 5 seconds, try again, and continue on taht path until you see no increase.... by the time you figure out what they like, it will be time for a new set of tires most likly LOL!
Start saving $$ for a rear, driveshaft and a mean clutch..... do all 3 at the same time ( pricy I know... but you'll thank me later ) and then you'll be able to put a tire on and have alot less worries, and see sub 1.8 short times (as long as you don't go to LVD on street night...I think it's even worse with the rice, and water on the track..... there's no real cars even there to put any rubber down usually )
Not sure how much heat those tires like either.. that's something that you'll have to try, try just spinning them a little to clean them, then try doing a good 10 second burnout, if that helps, up it 5 seconds, try again, and continue on taht path until you see no increase.... by the time you figure out what they like, it will be time for a new set of tires most likly LOL!
Start saving $$ for a rear, driveshaft and a mean clutch..... do all 3 at the same time ( pricy I know... but you'll thank me later ) and then you'll be able to put a tire on and have alot less worries, and see sub 1.8 short times (as long as you don't go to LVD on street night...I think it's even worse with the rice, and water on the track..... there's no real cars even there to put any rubber down usually )
Thread Starter
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 2,169
Likes: 1
From: Dallas, TX / Boston, MA
rear end and clutch and drag radials (hopefully on a spare set of wheels) is next on the list after i do the upgrades that i just ordered a couple weeks ago. it'll be a little while before i get enough $$ for that stuff, so i gotta make the stock components last
i just ordered LT headers/ORY, torque arm, and a 160 deg t-stat. i'm doing the install once the headers come in. the install will be followed by a dyno tune.
i never really gave the driveshaft any thought... what is the performance limitation on the stock 3" aluminum driveshaft?
i just ordered LT headers/ORY, torque arm, and a 160 deg t-stat. i'm doing the install once the headers come in. the install will be followed by a dyno tune.
i never really gave the driveshaft any thought... what is the performance limitation on the stock 3" aluminum driveshaft?
