Time for my high mileage APS kit update
04-27-2010, 02:18 PM
#1
Time for my high mileage APS kit update Well folks, it's been over 2 years and 25k miles since I installed my kit on my car. But it started smoking on me midway through last season so something was going on with the turbo(s). I didn't have any major leaks under the car just smoke once in a while when I got into it. So I drove it through the season. My trans was also starting to show signs of wearing so early this spring I decided to take everything apart and rebuild a few things. I had also been collecting parts for over a year for the car. Just hated the thought of taking it off the road because I love driving it. So all the rest of it is going on the car now as well.
Let me begin with saying I had hoped I could get the turbo's out easily. But thanks to this kit dropping the k-member was not a simple solution.
I had to pull all the intake and charge pipes off. I literally took most of the kit off the car just to get at the k-member which would allow me the clearance to get the manifolds & turbo's off. While it was not impossible, it was more of a pain than I expected. Thank god I still have my install manual to make sure I don't miss any steps putting it all back on the car. 
When I pulled the boost hoses off the turbo housings I noticed some oil in the hose where it turns the corner so I know the turbo's were leaking internally.
So turbo's after 2 years of DD use and some abuse at the track. Well they had a TON of sidelash and endplay. I am pretty sure my wheels were touching the housings at times. The edges of the impellers were shiny. So thanks to another member on here I picked up a set of true Mitsubishi 20G-TD06 balanced cartridges. I also sent out my manifolds and housings to be ceramic and powder coated (to keep with my color theme
). Best news was that the APS coolant & oil fittings all bolted right into the Mitsubishi cartridges. But I did use Mitsubishi's oil inlet bolt. I'm just glad I can reuse the rest of my lines with it.
My transmission was also grinding once in a while and showing signs of wear so I found a local rebuilder (who works at one of the sponsors here) to go through my trans for me. I also had the housing powdercoated while it was apart. I was going to paint it but since he had it all apart when I was dropping off my turbo parts, I grabbed that as well and had it done. Surprisingly after 116k on the trans (last 26k with boost) the trans really wans't too bad. I needed a new 2nd gear, all new synchros since they were obviously all worn way down. We upgraded to billet forks, bronze pads and all new synchro's. This thing looks like a work of art now. I almost don't want to put it in the car.
Anyway, on to some pics of what the parts look like now! First two are the before of the trans and one side of the turbo's. The rest are after.
Let me begin with saying I had hoped I could get the turbo's out easily. But thanks to this kit dropping the k-member was not a simple solution.
I had to pull all the intake and charge pipes off. I literally took most of the kit off the car just to get at the k-member which would allow me the clearance to get the manifolds & turbo's off. While it was not impossible, it was more of a pain than I expected. Thank god I still have my install manual to make sure I don't miss any steps putting it all back on the car. When I pulled the boost hoses off the turbo housings I noticed some oil in the hose where it turns the corner so I know the turbo's were leaking internally.
So turbo's after 2 years of DD use and some abuse at the track. Well they had a TON of sidelash and endplay. I am pretty sure my wheels were touching the housings at times. The edges of the impellers were shiny. So thanks to another member on here I picked up a set of true Mitsubishi 20G-TD06 balanced cartridges. I also sent out my manifolds and housings to be ceramic and powder coated (to keep with my color theme
). Best news was that the APS coolant & oil fittings all bolted right into the Mitsubishi cartridges. But I did use Mitsubishi's oil inlet bolt. I'm just glad I can reuse the rest of my lines with it.My transmission was also grinding once in a while and showing signs of wear so I found a local rebuilder (who works at one of the sponsors here) to go through my trans for me. I also had the housing powdercoated while it was apart. I was going to paint it but since he had it all apart when I was dropping off my turbo parts, I grabbed that as well and had it done.
Surprisingly after 116k on the trans (last 26k with boost) the trans really wans't too bad. I needed a new 2nd gear, all new synchros since they were obviously all worn way down. We upgraded to billet forks, bronze pads and all new synchro's. This thing looks like a work of art now. I almost don't want to put it in the car.Anyway, on to some pics of what the parts look like now! First two are the before of the trans and one side of the turbo's. The rest are after.
04-27-2010, 02:38 PM
#3
I have a local guy that sponsors my carclub here that did it for me. It really wasn't too bad at all. I think it was around $300 something for all the turbo stuff. I can't remember off the top of my head now. Moved on to other parts of the project mentally. I am just hoping the ceramic works and I won't need the aluminum shields to protect my wires. I never had a problem before with no ceramic and the shields on there.
I am just hoping the ceramic works and I won't need the aluminum shields to protect my wires. I never had a problem before with no ceramic and the shields on there. 
04-27-2010, 11:48 PM
#6
Nice to see your progress Hugger.I really should have coated my exhaust manifolds and exhaust housings before installed the kit. Not sure will remove them now either. But its a good idea and I hate the heat shields, they are sharp as razor blades.
I am using gmpp wires and factory heat shields after having problems with granatelli wires. No problems so far.
I have not taken my car down yet for the LG swap. I just can't bring it down when its nice out and have been driving it but of cross say hail mary's everytime I hit it on the standard aps maybe knock off turbos.They are still boosting so far and no horrible noises but they have to come off soon. I was hoping you would say that the swap over was simple. Now it sounds like a lot more work if all the piping needs to come off to drop the k. But whatever have to do it . I would like to replace the aps silicone with good stuff and proper t bolt clamps. I would like to redo the oil returns or run my scavenger pump all with an and stainless lines. Most of my upgrades seem to be working. My temps stay low with my Ron davis rad and high flow water pump but its only hit 75 hear so far so the true test will come when it hits 90 plus. We don't get that for long so could just park the car if its still having problems in the heat. It never really had any last few seasons but I wasn't running the air just in case. I am old school and can live without air,take off the ttops and not that bad really.
Anyway inspite of the problems big and small with my kit I still am pretty happy with it.
Even with the stock turbos at 7.5psi and my built 408 my car is plenty fast and sounds plenty mean . I dumped the supplied blow offs after first capping them so at least they were open to atmosphere and not recircing but my turbosmart supersonics are much more fun. What is also great is to have cutout and open it you hear the turbos so much better thats awesome also.
There is little stuff to still fix. I am hoping to dump the aps inlets altogether and just run hard pipe. Hoping my aps bmr custom kmember will give me the room to do that. Have to put my front sway back on. Just ordered new shocks and springs to bring my front end up to stock height..car dropped from the iron block and turbo kit. And can't afford any drop on the roads around here.
So hoping things work out great for you. I am really hoping to dyno and track my car finally this season. I was always waiting for something, first it was fuel system after got the car up and running finally near end of first season with the 408 and twin kit. Then it was cam sensor intermittent problem and burning wires up.Then was waiting on gettting a real rear end and then waiting on the 4l80 swap. Now waiting on the LG swap and acl injection install, new shock install and thats about it. Should be ready to dyno and track.
And got some sticky tires of course as well.
But anyway rambling ,this is your thread and things are looking good.! Now have to yell at Barnat pretty sure he said it was pretty easy to put on the LG and swap out the kmember!
I am using gmpp wires and factory heat shields after having problems with granatelli wires. No problems so far.
I have not taken my car down yet for the LG swap. I just can't bring it down when its nice out and have been driving it but of cross say hail mary's everytime I hit it on the standard aps maybe knock off turbos.They are still boosting so far and no horrible noises but they have to come off soon. I was hoping you would say that the swap over was simple. Now it sounds like a lot more work if all the piping needs to come off to drop the k. But whatever have to do it . I would like to replace the aps silicone with good stuff and proper t bolt clamps. I would like to redo the oil returns or run my scavenger pump all with an and stainless lines. Most of my upgrades seem to be working. My temps stay low with my Ron davis rad and high flow water pump but its only hit 75 hear so far so the true test will come when it hits 90 plus. We don't get that for long so could just park the car if its still having problems in the heat. It never really had any last few seasons but I wasn't running the air just in case. I am old school and can live without air,take off the ttops and not that bad really.
Anyway inspite of the problems big and small with my kit I still am pretty happy with it.
Even with the stock turbos at 7.5psi and my built 408 my car is plenty fast and sounds plenty mean . I dumped the supplied blow offs after first capping them so at least they were open to atmosphere and not recircing but my turbosmart supersonics are much more fun. What is also great is to have cutout and open it you hear the turbos so much better thats awesome also.
There is little stuff to still fix. I am hoping to dump the aps inlets altogether and just run hard pipe. Hoping my aps bmr custom kmember will give me the room to do that. Have to put my front sway back on. Just ordered new shocks and springs to bring my front end up to stock height..car dropped from the iron block and turbo kit. And can't afford any drop on the roads around here.
So hoping things work out great for you. I am really hoping to dyno and track my car finally this season. I was always waiting for something, first it was fuel system after got the car up and running finally near end of first season with the 408 and twin kit. Then it was cam sensor intermittent problem and burning wires up.Then was waiting on gettting a real rear end and then waiting on the 4l80 swap. Now waiting on the LG swap and acl injection install, new shock install and thats about it. Should be ready to dyno and track.
And got some sticky tires of course as well.
But anyway rambling ,this is your thread and things are looking good.! Now have to yell at Barnat pretty sure he said it was pretty easy to put on the LG and swap out the kmember!
04-28-2010, 09:17 AM
#7
Thanks Al! I never thought about using the factory heat shields. I still have those on a shelf somewhere..... I may look into that tonight. I just want to make sure I don't have any issues since I DD the car and roadtrip it and such.
Now that you mention it, I do have a worn spot on my pass side silicone hose where it comes out of the cold side and into the charge pipe. I wonder if I need to replace that or if I can protect it with a clamp.... I think it rubbed on the k-member. It was pretty tight in there.
And no need to yell at Barnat. He has a lift. I am on jackstands in my garage. I am sure it might've been easier if I had a hoist. I just couldn't figure out a way without removing all of the other pipes though. But alas, I am not made of unlimited funds. Even though we all wish we were.
Now that you mention it, I do have a worn spot on my pass side silicone hose where it comes out of the cold side and into the charge pipe. I wonder if I need to replace that or if I can protect it with a clamp.... I think it rubbed on the k-member. It was pretty tight in there.
And no need to yell at Barnat. He has a lift. I am on jackstands in my garage.
I am sure it might've been easier if I had a hoist. I just couldn't figure out a way without removing all of the other pipes though. But alas, I am not made of unlimited funds. Even though we all wish we were. Trending Topics
04-28-2010, 10:21 AM
#8
funny thing about that is when i got my t56 magnum it came in a box that said made in mexico. it was the same time the big swine flu was going around. i put a mask on to open the box. lol lol
04-29-2010, 11:33 AM
#10
I would love to dump the aps heat shields. As said they are razor sharp. yeah the factory heat shields are good idea. I am using red GMPP wires thats gm performance parts wires and they shields fit fine on them.So far no problems.
I really do have to put my car down in a week or so and get my upgrade turbos in there. That new aps custom/barnat kmember should be a big help and as said hoping to be able to switch to hard inlet pipes never worry about collapsing again. I will likely this year order replacement silicone and good quality t bolt clamps. They are not super expensive and good insurance against boost leaks.
I have been driving my car since end of march now. Weather has been pretty good ,actually above seasonal for quite a bit of april. So far haven't really got to test the Ron Davis rad or high flow water pump.
I am bolted on my new daily driving tires today. The are toyo tq drag radials and will see how they work out. I have 275/40/17 et street radials also to use for track and some street but do to not working in rain and really short life figure not use them 24/7. The toyo are supposed to work not bad in rain and we are forecast cooler and rain over weekend so maybe drive car anyway and see how they are. I know they are not supposed to last that long either. If get a season or hopefully two out of them that would be fine. I won't be tracking the toyos I don't think so that should help preserve them some.
I really do have to put my car down in a week or so and get my upgrade turbos in there. That new aps custom/barnat kmember should be a big help and as said hoping to be able to switch to hard inlet pipes never worry about collapsing again. I will likely this year order replacement silicone and good quality t bolt clamps. They are not super expensive and good insurance against boost leaks.
I have been driving my car since end of march now. Weather has been pretty good ,actually above seasonal for quite a bit of april. So far haven't really got to test the Ron Davis rad or high flow water pump.
I am bolted on my new daily driving tires today. The are toyo tq drag radials and will see how they work out. I have 275/40/17 et street radials also to use for track and some street but do to not working in rain and really short life figure not use them 24/7. The toyo are supposed to work not bad in rain and we are forecast cooler and rain over weekend so maybe drive car anyway and see how they are. I know they are not supposed to last that long either. If get a season or hopefully two out of them that would be fine. I won't be tracking the toyos I don't think so that should help preserve them some.
05-18-2010, 09:34 AM
#11
Finally got it started up again. And then had a small fire..... Well this rebuild has been fighting me every step of the way. But we finally got everything put back together and ready to go. Re-attached the battery, primed the fuel system, checked for leaks. Saw none so started it up! She fired right up like I had driven it earlier that day. All my gauges finally work correctly and no problems. Shut it down after a minute to check fluids (after Al's issue he had). No problems there. So we started it up again and let it idle to warm it up and finish filling the coolant. 5 min into it we started seeing white smoke. Initially thought it might be paint from some of the painted parts I added. Then we noticed an orange glow on the pass side and shut it down. By then a flame had appeared and I was running to grab a fire extinguisher. First one I got was empty. 
Luckily the one in the car was full so we got it put out.
No damage to top portion of the engine. Initial inspection looks like my main starter wire melted. I think it may have been too close to the heatshield and melted. And then either arced or somehow contacted the shield and caused the issue. I can't be sure but will find out more tonight when I get back under there.....
So close to finally driving it again..... Everything on this refresh has been 1 step forward and 2 steps back. Gotta love this hobby. It is definitely testing my motivation & will power...
Luckily the one in the car was full so we got it put out. No damage to top portion of the engine. Initial inspection looks like my main starter wire melted. I think it may have been too close to the heatshield and melted. And then either arced or somehow contacted the shield and caused the issue. I can't be sure but will find out more tonight when I get back under there.....
So close to finally driving it again..... Everything on this refresh has been 1 step forward and 2 steps back.
Gotta love this hobby. It is definitely testing my motivation & will power... Last edited by Hugger Z; 05-18-2010 at 10:35 AM.
05-18-2010, 10:03 AM
#12
Good to hear you are close now Hugger.
I have been fixing little issues lately as well. At least think have fixed them. Torque arm was banging tunnel, trans mount and trans pan/case was rubbing crossmember. These problems are from dana 60 and 4l80 swaps. Not big deals but were annoying.
Also had tuning problems with my 80s but seem to be getting those fixed as well.
Have some wierd noises hoping its just brake pads ,swapping out pads today or tommorrow. Front end is too damn low with iron block and aps kit so swapping in new strange shocks and can adjust ride height with them.
Still have to make the time to tear down car and put in the lgs and new kmember. And finish off bunch of stuff when under there. Put the front sway back on, do up my trans cooler lines nicer, hook up and mount the eboost gate solenoids so can boost it up with the new turbos.And have a ton of wiring still to do on nitrous system ,some other little sutff like electric cutout.
Anyway hopefully yours will be up and about and working good with those new replacement snails.I am still getting boost from my standard aps but am still only runnin them at 7.5. Also would like to get the new ones in there so can have water cooling again.I am sure just running oil coiling is making my temps hotter. I have still hit 212 degrees on engine temp and its been 70 to 80 degrees here. Thats with the new ron davis rad, high flow pump, fans on at 170 and forget if had redline water wetter in there too. So wondering how it will be on 100 degree days but we thankfully dont get many of them or for very long.
Wish somone would make aluminum shroud with high flow fans like got on my 91 talon and is available on my 97 talon. I wonder if we can puy a 10 or 12 inch pusher in front of intercooler?
You didnt do any cooling mods yet? Did you run air on hot days? Have to check and make sure both my fans are working . I know at least one is but have to look under there and check both.
May try evans coolant too.
Anyway be watching for your updates Hugger!
I have been fixing little issues lately as well. At least think have fixed them. Torque arm was banging tunnel, trans mount and trans pan/case was rubbing crossmember. These problems are from dana 60 and 4l80 swaps. Not big deals but were annoying.
Also had tuning problems with my 80s but seem to be getting those fixed as well.
Have some wierd noises hoping its just brake pads ,swapping out pads today or tommorrow. Front end is too damn low with iron block and aps kit so swapping in new strange shocks and can adjust ride height with them.
Still have to make the time to tear down car and put in the lgs and new kmember. And finish off bunch of stuff when under there. Put the front sway back on, do up my trans cooler lines nicer, hook up and mount the eboost gate solenoids so can boost it up with the new turbos.And have a ton of wiring still to do on nitrous system ,some other little sutff like electric cutout.
Anyway hopefully yours will be up and about and working good with those new replacement snails.I am still getting boost from my standard aps but am still only runnin them at 7.5. Also would like to get the new ones in there so can have water cooling again.I am sure just running oil coiling is making my temps hotter. I have still hit 212 degrees on engine temp and its been 70 to 80 degrees here. Thats with the new ron davis rad, high flow pump, fans on at 170 and forget if had redline water wetter in there too. So wondering how it will be on 100 degree days but we thankfully dont get many of them or for very long.
Wish somone would make aluminum shroud with high flow fans like got on my 91 talon and is available on my 97 talon. I wonder if we can puy a 10 or 12 inch pusher in front of intercooler?
You didnt do any cooling mods yet? Did you run air on hot days? Have to check and make sure both my fans are working . I know at least one is but have to look under there and check both.
May try evans coolant too.
Anyway be watching for your updates Hugger!
05-18-2010, 10:39 AM
#13
Nope, nothing other than my stock shroud & stock fans. I had problems running warm for a few days but that was when I discovered the overflow tube was cracked. It was in the high 90's on those days too. It stayed level while driving but if I had A/C on it got pretty high. After I replaced that tube I had zero issues. I guess we'll see how it does this season but I am not expecting any issues.
05-18-2010, 10:55 AM
#14
hmm .you can add redline water wetter it seems to help. Do you have your fans set to come on at like 160 or 170 and both to come on?
Stock cooling system eh?
I may be getting more heat from iron block, still have no water cooling to the turbos since that one is internally cracked and am using rad trans cooler and aux as well since drive car in colder weather and wanted to be able to get some heat in the trans to warm it up. I may have one fan not working hard to see without crawling under the car its tight in there with the ron davis. Now not saying I am overheating or anything yet but thought I could hold under 212 on a 80 degree day no problem with the new cooling mods.
I was into boostage quite bit though . Usually its running like 175. Have to turn on air though and see what that does to temps. I imagine my 3400 stall not being locked around town is also contributing maybe will lock it up around town and see what diff that makes .Since trans fluid is running thru rad cooling trans likely also helps cool engine and vice versa.
I have heard synthetic oil helps a bit on engine temps and synthetic trans fluid. May try that but rpm recommended just gm fluid not synth in their trans.
Stock cooling system eh?
I may be getting more heat from iron block, still have no water cooling to the turbos since that one is internally cracked and am using rad trans cooler and aux as well since drive car in colder weather and wanted to be able to get some heat in the trans to warm it up. I may have one fan not working hard to see without crawling under the car its tight in there with the ron davis. Now not saying I am overheating or anything yet but thought I could hold under 212 on a 80 degree day no problem with the new cooling mods.
I was into boostage quite bit though . Usually its running like 175. Have to turn on air though and see what that does to temps. I imagine my 3400 stall not being locked around town is also contributing maybe will lock it up around town and see what diff that makes .Since trans fluid is running thru rad cooling trans likely also helps cool engine and vice versa.
I have heard synthetic oil helps a bit on engine temps and synthetic trans fluid. May try that but rpm recommended just gm fluid not synth in their trans.
05-19-2010, 09:02 AM
#15
Well I got the starter wire fixed last night. Started the car up again, let it idle, revved it a few times and heard a metallic noise clunking around. Immediately shut it off and checked my pass turbo as I heard it on that side. Didn't see anything evident or looking out of whack. So I tried to start it again and only got a starter click. I think the fire damaged my solenoid and it fired when I revved the car and killed the starter gear. I only hope it didn't damage my flywheel. So trying to get a mini-starter today and we'll see what I find tonight when I get in there again......
Still close to driving it. It keeps teasing me....
Still close to driving it. It keeps teasing me....
