Pressure drop across intercooler
9 Second Club
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 13,616
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From: Norn Iron
You're using a small pipe, so it only takes a small bleed, ie the MBC to affect your pressure test readings to give a false reading.
You cannot take the results as accurate if your test port is the same as the MBC.
Did one more "test night" yesterday, this time with only dumppipe on. Puts much more power
Set up MBC so that I get 15+ psi in the manifold.
BUT pressure drop across intercooler also increased to almost 5psi at the peak. Pressure lines were on separate ports, with no MBC on them - of cause this didn't affect readings.
So I guess it's time for Treadstone TR-12 4.5" thick cooler, what do you think?
Set up MBC so that I get 15+ psi in the manifold.
BUT pressure drop across intercooler also increased to almost 5psi at the peak. Pressure lines were on separate ports, with no MBC on them - of cause this didn't affect readings.
So I guess it's time for Treadstone TR-12 4.5" thick cooler, what do you think?
9 Second Club
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 13,616
Likes: 185
From: Norn Iron
Very strange.
Bigger is better with intercoolers. A good read about designs. To make sure you get what you need, dont just blindly buy an off the shelf unit.
Contact the seller, give as much detail about your build as possible and then buy the biggest that they recommend.
http://www.are.com.au/techtalk/intecoolersMR.htm#Bar and Plate or Tube and Fin?
Bigger is better with intercoolers. A good read about designs. To make sure you get what you need, dont just blindly buy an off the shelf unit.
Contact the seller, give as much detail about your build as possible and then buy the biggest that they recommend.
http://www.are.com.au/techtalk/intecoolersMR.htm#Bar and Plate or Tube and Fin?
I got a question also. Like all these bottom in/out style coolers, does the air actually get to the top of them? I seen a test on YB I believe and the eBay only cooled like half way up so the top was completely pointless. So it wouldn't matter if it was 8ft tall cause it doesn't cool that high. I know the Treadstone coolers have a baffle to direct air up there but how well does that work and will that effect flow? Reason asking is they had a version on the tr12 but only 10.5" tall vs 12.5" tall. You think that extra 2" up top will help?, especially in a fbody where the top is behind the bumper cover anyways?
I believe DrTurbo said if you cut off one end of the intercooler and flipped it (so it used the entire core) it would cause less restriction (and more hp obviously). I think he said something like 50hp.
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I got a question also. Like all these bottom in/out style coolers, does the air actually get to the top of them? I seen a test on YB I believe and the eBay only cooled like half way up so the top was completely pointless. So it wouldn't matter if it was 8ft tall cause it doesn't cool that high. I know the Treadstone coolers have a baffle to direct air up there but how well does that work and will that effect flow? Reason asking is they had a version on the tr12 but only 10.5" tall vs 12.5" tall. You think that extra 2" up top will help?, especially in a fbody where the top is behind the bumper cover anyways?
From what i can gather air flow into the core is one area where you can massively reduce restriction. good airflow across the whole core should reduce presure drop and increase cooling.
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I got a question also. Like all these bottom in/out style coolers, does the air actually get to the top of them? I seen a test on YB I believe and the eBay only cooled like half way up so the top was completely pointless. So it wouldn't matter if it was 8ft tall cause it doesn't cool that high. I know the Treadstone coolers have a baffle to direct air up there but how well does that work and will that effect flow? Reason asking is they had a version on the tr12 but only 10.5" tall vs 12.5" tall. You think that extra 2" up top will help?, especially in a fbody where the top is behind the bumper cover anyways?
Anyway my IAT's are good & my car runs 9's on a little tc turbo so it can't be that bad I guess.
Reasons for me ditching the intercooler is because in the 1/8th and 1/4 mile drag racing I do It didn't help iat. I ran w/ and w/o meth on my ebay 31x12x4 ic and the iat's jumped over 60* when I was not on the meth. And that was only to the 1/8th.
Anothr reason I got rid of it was because of weight. I think it was like 25lbs.
Another reason was air flow to the radiator.
And last was I think it was a restriction. I mesured my boot at the manifold. I did a back pressure test on the turbine. When the engine saw 11 psi at the intake manifold I had 14psi in the hot side. Could it be that the turbine was too small? It was a 87mm and a 1.25 ar. Could of been a little small yes. But let's say the intercooler was droping 5 psi. That means the compressor would of made 16psi. W/o a ic the engine would of seen 16psi. Bp would of been the same 14psi. All in all the turbo wouldent of had to work as hard to get the same boost to the intake manifold
Anothr reason I got rid of it was because of weight. I think it was like 25lbs.
Another reason was air flow to the radiator.
And last was I think it was a restriction. I mesured my boot at the manifold. I did a back pressure test on the turbine. When the engine saw 11 psi at the intake manifold I had 14psi in the hot side. Could it be that the turbine was too small? It was a 87mm and a 1.25 ar. Could of been a little small yes. But let's say the intercooler was droping 5 psi. That means the compressor would of made 16psi. W/o a ic the engine would of seen 16psi. Bp would of been the same 14psi. All in all the turbo wouldent of had to work as hard to get the same boost to the intake manifold
I'm only going to be using a alkycontrol dual or tripple nozzle meth kit. I use 100% meth. I have thought about doing a 80/20 mix.
But just in case the meth fails or iat get too hot ill have the iat retard table in hptuners set to pull timing
But just in case the meth fails or iat get too hot ill have the iat retard table in hptuners set to pull timing
I was spraying pre & post turbo, hit way over 200 degrees iat before I realized it & it pre ignited on cylinder 1 as soon as it hit 3rd. I was running without a hood and the dip stick flew out of sight into the air.
Some people claim to have no problems but I sure did.
I tried that, blew the side of the block out on pump gas. I found out the ebay intercooler in my application does wonders for iat, it runs ambient or a little above now.
I was spraying pre & post turbo, hit way over 200 degrees iat before I realized it & it pre ignited on cylinder 1 as soon as it hit 3rd. I was running without a hood and the dip stick flew out of sight into the air.
Some people claim to have no problems but I sure did.
I was spraying pre & post turbo, hit way over 200 degrees iat before I realized it & it pre ignited on cylinder 1 as soon as it hit 3rd. I was running without a hood and the dip stick flew out of sight into the air.
Some people claim to have no problems but I sure did.
I mesured my boot at the manifold. I did a back pressure test on the turbine. When the engine saw 11 psi at the intake manifold I had 14psi in the hot side. Could it be that the turbine was too small? It was a 87mm and a 1.25 ar. Could of been a little small yes. But let's say the intercooler was droping 5 psi. That means the compressor would of made 16psi. W/o a ic the engine would of seen 16psi. Bp would of been the same 14psi. All in all the turbo wouldent of had to work as hard to get the same boost to the intake manifold
P.S. Both my Ebay intercoolers did lower temps very good BUT posed restriction. Previous 3.5" (tube and fin) caused my 7psi differential gauge to go off scale.
Now with this 4" bar and plate, I see up to 5psi, but at much higher power.
I need to decide which Treadstone IC I want - usual horizontal flow (TR-12) or vertical (TR-259)
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really daft question here but are you SURE its the IC? What pipe dia are you using? is there any silicon sections that are getting crushed in movement or something? any leaks post IC? have you leak tested the IC and post IC piping? Not trying to pick faults but its worth looking at!
Chris.
Chris.
It doesn't work like that - you have to compare backpressure before the turbo with boost in the manifold itself - thus you can judge how "small" or not so small turbine exhaust housing is. I would say ratio up to 2:1 is (was) considered to be good for a street car, and 1:1 is good for race car.
P.S. Both my Ebay intercoolers did lower temps very good BUT posed restriction. Previous 3.5" (tube and fin) caused my 7psi differential gauge to go off scale.
Now with this 4" bar and plate, I see up to 5psi, but at much higher power.
I need to decide which Treadstone IC I want - usual horizontal flow (TR-12) or vertical (TR-259)
P.S. Both my Ebay intercoolers did lower temps very good BUT posed restriction. Previous 3.5" (tube and fin) caused my 7psi differential gauge to go off scale.
Now with this 4" bar and plate, I see up to 5psi, but at much higher power.
I need to decide which Treadstone IC I want - usual horizontal flow (TR-12) or vertical (TR-259)
also even thoe the ebay 4" ic is 4" thick the in/out are still only 3" od if you mesure the id of that 3" in/out and its near 2.8"
really daft question here but are you SURE its the IC? What pipe dia are you using? is there any silicon sections that are getting crushed in movement or something? any leaks post IC? have you leak tested the IC and post IC piping? Not trying to pick faults but its worth looking at!
Chris.
Chris.