It's a Pusher (coolant loss)
Thread Starter
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 4,729
Likes: 814
From: Portland, OR
Hey guys. Good discussion. I appreciate your insights.
I spoke with my engine guy today. Even though he thinks I'm nuts doing this SBE thing, he is always a good source if info.
He did my fancy valve job and took .003 off the surface. So he does have a small stake in the project.
So, he agreed that having two studs that turned at 75 ft/lbs was not a good sign. He also questioned using the ARP spec on these cheap studs. And also asked if I used the latest and greatest ARP lube. I dunno! It was left over from my ls1 build two years ago.
I asked if he thought that using the LS9's with the bigger bore would be a problem and he said no.
My studs came from ProComp. I waited monts for them. If I'm not mistaken, they have since pulled them fro the market for "issues"?
Anyone hear that? I'm thinking I got some duds.
Btw, I didn't see 7 layer cometics specifically for the 5.3? Just a 4.8-5.7 five layer.
I'll get the thing apart and see if anything is obvious.
I believe I'll bend over bend over red rover and get the arp schtuds and LS9 gaskets.
I'll keep you posted
I spoke with my engine guy today. Even though he thinks I'm nuts doing this SBE thing, he is always a good source if info.
He did my fancy valve job and took .003 off the surface. So he does have a small stake in the project.
So, he agreed that having two studs that turned at 75 ft/lbs was not a good sign. He also questioned using the ARP spec on these cheap studs. And also asked if I used the latest and greatest ARP lube. I dunno! It was left over from my ls1 build two years ago.
I asked if he thought that using the LS9's with the bigger bore would be a problem and he said no.
My studs came from ProComp. I waited monts for them. If I'm not mistaken, they have since pulled them fro the market for "issues"?
Anyone hear that? I'm thinking I got some duds.
Btw, I didn't see 7 layer cometics specifically for the 5.3? Just a 4.8-5.7 five layer.
I'll get the thing apart and see if anything is obvious.
I believe I'll bend over bend over red rover and get the arp schtuds and LS9 gaskets.
I'll keep you posted
hey Ron.. I have been running ls9 and arps on my 3.830 bore l33 5.3 block and have had the heads off 5 times now with my arps torqued to 80psi.. last weekend i had the boost reference/retard hose come off.. I didnt know what happened and tried to make another pass after knowing i had a vacuum leak and vacuum boost guage was reading 8.5 to 9 down from 12-13 and went and made another pass and it laid over in third so i lifted.. well i found the problem but made 1 and a half or so passes at 32*.. i found today it had pushed some water into the overflow.. I wondered kindof but didnt think about it until today why i was running around 180* for my 50 or so miles i drove today(missing water in the rad that was in the overflow tank) of temp even that night.. but figured it out today.. all is well and i made 3 more passes that night with the best being 9.54 at 142.. so hopefully i can say ls9 gaskets are the way to go.. Ill know more if the temp doesnt stay in the 165 range it normally does.. man these are bad ars little motors.. I know that..
Thread Starter
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 4,729
Likes: 814
From: Portland, OR
I missed that same warning sign. Rad was 4" low, and the cruising temp was up.
These things are touchy on level! I'm also going to hook up the rear steam vents.
Caught your last post! Car is running well.
I weighed mine. 4 wheel race scales. 3380 with me in it
Ron
These things are touchy on level! I'm also going to hook up the rear steam vents.
Caught your last post! Car is running well.
I weighed mine. 4 wheel race scales. 3380 with me in it
Ron
i have the rear steams hooked up on mine as well Ron.. i figured they have em there for a reason and for 20 bucks i bought someones fronts and put them on the back with a t going back to the rad..
anyway sorry you have to do some work but all will be well in the end..
our cars are closer than it seems at this point.. mine was 3420 last time i wieghed it.. if i could only get the tci 4 link to work to the point of a 1.39 sixty i think i could pull an 8.99 out of it lol
anyway sorry you have to do some work but all will be well in the end..
our cars are closer than it seems at this point.. mine was 3420 last time i wieghed it.. if i could only get the tci 4 link to work to the point of a 1.39 sixty i think i could pull an 8.99 out of it lol
Hey guys. Good discussion. I appreciate your insights.
I spoke with my engine guy today. Even though he thinks I'm nuts doing this SBE thing, he is always a good source if info.
He did my fancy valve job and took .003 off the surface. So he does have a small stake in the project.
So, he agreed that having two studs that turned at 75 ft/lbs was not a good sign. He also questioned using the ARP spec on these cheap studs. And also asked if I used the latest and greatest ARP lube. I dunno! It was left over from my ls1 build two years ago.
I asked if he thought that using the LS9's with the bigger bore would be a problem and he said no.
My studs came from ProComp. I waited monts for them. If I'm not mistaken, they have since pulled them fro the market for "issues"?
Anyone hear that? I'm thinking I got some duds.
Btw, I didn't see 7 layer cometics specifically for the 5.3? Just a 4.8-5.7 five layer.
I'll get the thing apart and see if anything is obvious.
I believe I'll bend over bend over red rover and get the arp schtuds and LS9 gaskets.
I'll keep you posted
I spoke with my engine guy today. Even though he thinks I'm nuts doing this SBE thing, he is always a good source if info.
He did my fancy valve job and took .003 off the surface. So he does have a small stake in the project.
So, he agreed that having two studs that turned at 75 ft/lbs was not a good sign. He also questioned using the ARP spec on these cheap studs. And also asked if I used the latest and greatest ARP lube. I dunno! It was left over from my ls1 build two years ago.
I asked if he thought that using the LS9's with the bigger bore would be a problem and he said no.
My studs came from ProComp. I waited monts for them. If I'm not mistaken, they have since pulled them fro the market for "issues"?
Anyone hear that? I'm thinking I got some duds.
Btw, I didn't see 7 layer cometics specifically for the 5.3? Just a 4.8-5.7 five layer.
I'll get the thing apart and see if anything is obvious.
I believe I'll bend over bend over red rover and get the arp schtuds and LS9 gaskets.
I'll keep you posted
Once you get the heads off drill out the rivets holding the gasket layers together. The 2nd layers purpose is to help hold the gasket in place. If your engine builder doesn’t see a problem with the LS9 gasket positioning on an alum block 5.3 bore then I’d get a new engine builder. As said the standard felpro MLS gasket is a better option.
Thread Starter
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 4,729
Likes: 814
From: Portland, OR
What fel pro part number? 1160? Or the cheap $17 ones? They make a few. I'll check them out.
I understand the lube issue. I used arp lube, I just don't know if it was their latest stuff.
His comment on the large bore gasket being ok was based on the fact that the liners are cast in place then machined flush with the deck.
Myself I've not even seen a photo of the gasket on the block to see for myself.
I understand the lube issue. I used arp lube, I just don't know if it was their latest stuff.
His comment on the large bore gasket being ok was based on the fact that the liners are cast in place then machined flush with the deck.
Myself I've not even seen a photo of the gasket on the block to see for myself.
What fel pro part number? 1160? Or the cheap $17 ones? They make a few. I'll check them out.
I understand the lube issue. I used arp lube, I just don't know if it was their latest stuff.
His comment on the large bore gasket being ok was based on the fact that the liners are cast in place then machined flush with the deck.
Myself I've not even seen a photo of the gasket on the block to see for myself.
I understand the lube issue. I used arp lube, I just don't know if it was their latest stuff.
His comment on the large bore gasket being ok was based on the fact that the liners are cast in place then machined flush with the deck.
Myself I've not even seen a photo of the gasket on the block to see for myself.
I came off as a bit of a ****** there. Lots of guys making power on the alum 5.3 with the LS9 gasket, that doesn’t mean it’s the best choice. I’m sure your engine guys plenty knowledgeable. But if someone big into the boosted LS world tells me its less than an ideal… I figure I need all the help I can get! Only trying to help…
I believe they are the 26191pt “permatorque” Felpro gaskets.
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/fe...FUKCMgodlA8AFA
Ebay had the cheapest ARP-2000 bolts I could find as well at 272$ shipped. Got mine Saturday.
Good luck!
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This wouldnt be the first time ive seen studs loosen up with only one torque pass on them.
When i installed mine, i torqued them completely down, in the proper sequence, then uninstalled them. I did this 4 times. You could feel the diffence between the first and second passes. The third was a lil less, and the fourth there was no change. There is definitely some strectch in there that needs to be accounted for. I torqued mine 85ftlbs (ARP's)
When i installed mine, i torqued them completely down, in the proper sequence, then uninstalled them. I did this 4 times. You could feel the diffence between the first and second passes. The third was a lil less, and the fourth there was no change. There is definitely some strectch in there that needs to be accounted for. I torqued mine 85ftlbs (ARP's)
This wouldnt be the first time ive seen studs loosen up with only one torque pass on them.
When i installed mine, i torqued them completely down, in the proper sequence, then uninstalled them. I did this 4 times. You could feel the diffence between the first and second passes. The third was a lil less, and the fourth there was no change. There is definitely some strectch in there that needs to be accounted for. I torqued mine 85ftlbs (ARP's)
When i installed mine, i torqued them completely down, in the proper sequence, then uninstalled them. I did this 4 times. You could feel the diffence between the first and second passes. The third was a lil less, and the fourth there was no change. There is definitely some strectch in there that needs to be accounted for. I torqued mine 85ftlbs (ARP's)
I loosened approx 1/2 turn and retorqued all studs in sequence 5 times to 80ftlb. Puts a strain on the old guns!
Don't think the stud is permanently stretching though. I thought once a fastener stretches and doesn't stretch back it's junk?
I believe the purpose is mainly to "break in" the threads, which reduces loss to thread friction. Ultimately giving you better clamping force/stretch for the torque applied. According to what most say if this process is done you shouldn't need a retorque after a heat cycle. Though I still think I will. Also when I go back to check the studs tonight I shouldn't get any additional rotation at 80ftlb.
Thread Starter
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 4,729
Likes: 814
From: Portland, OR
Just checked the drivers side studs. None moved. So just the two on the pass side.
Forced, the best method to see if they stayed put is to mark the nut, back it off a bit and retorque. It should return to the same spot.
I've a long ways to go before the heads are off. All that pretty work I did......
Forced, the best method to see if they stayed put is to mark the nut, back it off a bit and retorque. It should return to the same spot.
I've a long ways to go before the heads are off. All that pretty work I did......
Thread Starter
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 4,729
Likes: 814
From: Portland, OR
Got the pass side head off. This is what I've found. Rear cylinder, not where the studs were loose.
Compare this cyl to the one below
Gasket, look to the right
My guy left the surface pretty rough....
Compare this cyl to the one below
Gasket, look to the right
My guy left the surface pretty rough....
Thread Starter
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 4,729
Likes: 814
From: Portland, OR
Thread Starter
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 4,729
Likes: 814
From: Portland, OR
I know. But I don't have a machinists straight edge.
I'll haul them to my guy. He can check. And he can loan me his tool for the block. I doubt it's the block though.
At least I've found the problem. Stunned need to get the drivers side off, which is harder.
Then clean the river of coolant....
Thank god for shop vacs!
I'll haul them to my guy. He can check. And he can loan me his tool for the block. I doubt it's the block though.
At least I've found the problem. Stunned need to get the drivers side off, which is harder.
Then clean the river of coolant....
Thank god for shop vacs!
Thread Starter
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 4,729
Likes: 814
From: Portland, OR
Just a side note. No leaking at the block deck. Looks perfect. It's baby butt smooth.
Also, although frustrating, it's not an LS1 gasket issue, nor is it an issue with the studs.
So when it goes back together, on with the show!
Also, although frustrating, it's not an LS1 gasket issue, nor is it an issue with the studs.
So when it goes back together, on with the show!