Converter for boost....billet lockup or no?
not that it really matters on changing your opinion, but my trans is built as good as it’s gonna get. Probably has even more attention to detail in it than a shop would put forth. The only one part is does not have is the different first gear ratio carrier by sonnax. Everything else has been done. Billet input and out put shafts. 4l79 drum with th350 clutches in the 3-4. Anything that can be had billet is in there. Wide 2-4 band. I even tack welded the low reverse drum snap ring because I’ve seen them pop off with higher pressures. Really too much to list. Yea it’s still a 4l60, but I’ve beat on it since the beginning of the year snd it’s not skipped a beat. Might as well test it to it’s full capacity to see what I can get away with on my customers builds. I’ve found so far that 4 pinion planets hold just fine. That was an expense that I’d add in that I no longer feel is needed. I had a buddy test out a lesser build in a full weight, nitrous 4th gen that ran low 9’s (almost broke in the 8’s) and it would last about 10 months of beating the **** out of it relentlessly. He went to the track at least three weekends a month. He broke the 12 bolt more than the trans. 1.2 60fts and sometimes the car would leave and scrape the back bumper. Anyways. Enough of that.
well, I wish it were that easy. I'll have to pay $500-$600 to upgrade to the billet convertor. Not sure I want to drop any more coin on this trans. I'll probably end up selling this trans and stall and going to a 4l80. I had a dream that I swapped my trans out for a 6 speed manual. Lol. never.
I know how you feel about spending money though. I spent the last few years saving money in a race car fund expecting my sbe to blow. Now my race car fund is up to 15g and a HPR 402 short block for $5800 has caught my eye but I’m having trouble parting with the cash and thinking I’ll keep running the sbe until it dies.
Last edited by BCNUL8R; Dec 3, 2019 at 04:50 AM.
TECH Junkie
Joined: Jul 2015
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$500 in a build isn't really much in the big picture. I had a friend run an RPM built 4l60e with a lock up converter with around 1200 rwhp for a few years without issues. He got the car down to 5.0x in the 1/8th before breaking the rear end. It's a C5 and after breaking the diff he decided to go 9" and switch to a power glide at that same time. Car probably would have went high 7's in the 1/4 mile.
I know how you feel about spending money though. I spent the last few years saving money in a race car fund expecting my sbe to blow. Now my race car fund is up to 15g and a HPR 402 short block for $5800 has caught my eye but I’m having trouble parting with the cash and thinking I’ll keep running the sbe until it dies.
I know how you feel about spending money though. I spent the last few years saving money in a race car fund expecting my sbe to blow. Now my race car fund is up to 15g and a HPR 402 short block for $5800 has caught my eye but I’m having trouble parting with the cash and thinking I’ll keep running the sbe until it dies.
$500 in a build isn't really much in the big picture. I had a friend run an RPM built 4l60e with a lock up converter with around 1200 rwhp for a few years without issues. He got the car down to 5.0x in the 1/8th before breaking the rear end. It's a C5 and after breaking the diff he decided to go 9" and switch to a power glide at that same time. Car probably would have went high 7's in the 1/4 mile.
I know how you feel about spending money though. I spent the last few years saving money in a race car fund expecting my sbe to blow. Now my race car fund is up to 15g and a HPR 402 short block for $5800 has caught my eye but I’m having trouble parting with the cash and thinking I’ll keep running the sbe until it dies.
I know how you feel about spending money though. I spent the last few years saving money in a race car fund expecting my sbe to blow. Now my race car fund is up to 15g and a HPR 402 short block for $5800 has caught my eye but I’m having trouble parting with the cash and thinking I’ll keep running the sbe until it dies.
That being said, I have faith in the 4l60. I ran a stock one with a shift kit/ cooler with a FTI 3800 for years in my H/C/I stripper 4th gen. A friend of mine bought the car and put a 150shot on it and it is still going after 5 bottles and shifting at 7k.
Now knowing the OP already has a well built 4l60e, it may hold up with a lock up converter.... Will depend on the tune and how it's driven.
I get it. But why waste $250-$350 if I don’t need to. That’s my point. (Gonna cost me $250 to get it restalled this go round anyways).
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Yet another reason why I love having that left pedal... never need to pay someone to adjust it. Its always there whether you want to leave at idle or 7000 RPM!
So so while I understand not wasting money you are going to find yourself spending a lot more in that driveline. Then you will soon realize these take a lot to 60’ well and mph on the big end will only do so much for your ET. So you’re going to need double adjustable shocks and struts etc.
I’ve had several yank converters 2800, 3200ss, 3600ss, and now a 3400 pas. I daily drove all of them and the 3600 was getting to the limit of a daily and that was behind a 408. My current 3400pas would be good for you, but you might take a look at their pro series as well.
there’s ups and downs to each. What matters to me most is:
I get stuck in traffic a lot. A standard sucks in those situations
clutches are expensive. And they are a wear item, more so than a convertor. Not to mention slave and master cylinders add more potential issues
a standard isn’t as consistent
a standard isn’t as fast in a faster car. My motto is, a standard makes a slow car faster but a fast car slower.
a standard is harder on drivetrain parts
but in the upside, when you aren’t in traffic, a standard might be more fun. And it sounds cooler dragging the gears out. Other than that, I’ll keep my auto.
You’ve got some thinking to do heading down this path. This is my second one of these and drivelines are expensive. I don’t know if you would be “wasting” money, but consider this...you are looking at probably needing a posi as the stock is weak. My first car had a kazz lsd which I highly recommend but they are $1000. I was going to go that route again, but found a freshly built diff with a strange spool and new level 2 gforce stubs for $900 to my door so I went that route. The spool isn’t ideal, but the deal was right and I don’t mind it. Stock stubs, half shafts, and drive shaft are all a problem at the power level you are seeking. I built my driveline for an 800 rwhp goal. Beyond that you are better served going straight to one of the 9” irs setups or the moser sra setup.
So so while I understand not wasting money you are going to find yourself spending a lot more in that driveline. Then you will soon realize these take a lot to 60’ well and mph on the big end will only do so much for your ET. So you’re going to need double adjustable shocks and struts etc.
I’ve had several yank converters 2800, 3200ss, 3600ss, and now a 3400 pas. I daily drove all of them and the 3600 was getting to the limit of a daily and that was behind a 408. My current 3400pas would be good for you, but you might take a look at their pro series as well.
So so while I understand not wasting money you are going to find yourself spending a lot more in that driveline. Then you will soon realize these take a lot to 60’ well and mph on the big end will only do so much for your ET. So you’re going to need double adjustable shocks and struts etc.
I’ve had several yank converters 2800, 3200ss, 3600ss, and now a 3400 pas. I daily drove all of them and the 3600 was getting to the limit of a daily and that was behind a 408. My current 3400pas would be good for you, but you might take a look at their pro series as well.
I had a 3600 pas originally and I liked it better than my SS3200. I was planning on doing a pas3800 because I want the car to leave harder. I know I’m gonna break ****. I’m surprised I haven’t yet besides the driveshaft. I have spares of everything to get me right back on the road should I break something. And then I’ll order upgraded replacements. If I break the rear, I’ll put my spare in and build this one. This is also a reason for going with a 5.3 vs ls3 or a big cube motor like I originally planned. I was trying to keep the tq down to help things live. There’s always a method to my madness.
There was a video I saw of a gto with a 5.3 making I believe 1200 whp roll racing a bunch of fast stuff and getting whooped. You know what they all had in common...less peak power but more cubic inches. The only thing that gto beat in the video was a pickup.
I screen captured that list from the Facebook gto group. The vast majority of those are over 400” combos with I think one 5.3 at the bottom. Not saying it can’t be done, but cubic inches in a heavy car make it easier.
lolzz, should have added #LOCKUPLIFTSHEADS
I agree, certainly ups and downs to any setup. Clutches really aren't that bad compared to the price of built autos and converters. Unless of course you go for the fancy multi disk carbon setups, of which everyone I know with them doesn't like it as much as they thought they would. I get it, driving a manual isn't for everyone or hardly anyone anymore apparently as most car manufacturers discontinue them. Guess people think it sucks to actually pay attention to driving.
But going from a stock tr-6060 and basic $900 clutch to a $4000 powerglide and $1000 billet converter setup was worth a whopping .4 second to me, and the glide was on more boost. Just doesn't seem worth it to me to give up all the street fun for a couple tenths at the track a few times a year. Now that said some people just can't drive and for them it could be a much more drastic improvement going to an auto.
I would argue that typically the efficiency of a manual makes the fast car "faster", but the auto makes the fast car "quicker". Basically ET vs MPH and the whole reason we now have lockup converters, so you can get the efficiency of a manual up top with the launch consistency of an auto.
Either way I just threw the one liner out there as a joke... to each their own!
there’s ups and downs to each. What matters to me most is:
I get stuck in traffic a lot. A standard sucks in those situations
clutches are expensive. And they are a wear item, more so than a convertor. Not to mention slave and master cylinders add more potential issues
a standard isn’t as consistent
a standard isn’t as fast in a faster car. My motto is, a standard makes a slow car faster but a fast car slower.
a standard is harder on drivetrain parts
but in the upside, when you aren’t in traffic, a standard might be more fun. And it sounds cooler dragging the gears out. Other than that, I’ll keep my auto.
I get stuck in traffic a lot. A standard sucks in those situations
clutches are expensive. And they are a wear item, more so than a convertor. Not to mention slave and master cylinders add more potential issues
a standard isn’t as consistent
a standard isn’t as fast in a faster car. My motto is, a standard makes a slow car faster but a fast car slower.
a standard is harder on drivetrain parts
but in the upside, when you aren’t in traffic, a standard might be more fun. And it sounds cooler dragging the gears out. Other than that, I’ll keep my auto.
But going from a stock tr-6060 and basic $900 clutch to a $4000 powerglide and $1000 billet converter setup was worth a whopping .4 second to me, and the glide was on more boost. Just doesn't seem worth it to me to give up all the street fun for a couple tenths at the track a few times a year. Now that said some people just can't drive and for them it could be a much more drastic improvement going to an auto.
I would argue that typically the efficiency of a manual makes the fast car "faster", but the auto makes the fast car "quicker". Basically ET vs MPH and the whole reason we now have lockup converters, so you can get the efficiency of a manual up top with the launch consistency of an auto.
Either way I just threw the one liner out there as a joke... to each their own!