Well...A lot has happened since the last time I was on here.

Cars, tools etc. all sold... Moved down to help my aging parents (Who happen to live right next to hell itself... 118 today and supposed to be 120 for the next 5 days... I just kicked open the gates of hell to try cooling it down a bit. (It's high 80's inside my 5th wheel with the a/c blasting.)

Throw in the Covid crap, along with no garage just a carport to work in, leaves a lot of time to beat your head against a wall while your sweating your *** off and your beer is evaporating as fast as you drink it. LoL

So... Plan A was to throw a 5.3 with a s475, Holley Terminator, T/B TH400 etc. into a New Edge Mustang I got and go play this winter.

But...There is no shop/garages for rent anywhere around here...

Which brings me to plan "B".

Money is going to be tight for awhile so instead of buying a s475 ,Holley ecu , T/B TH400 etc.I'm going to use some of that money to enclose the carport when/if the temps get back down to a point I don't self combust trying to work on it.

I took inventory of the crap I drug down and some of the stuff I have gotten for cheap since I got here and have been bouncing ideas around in my head and figured I would bounce them off some of you and get your response/ideas.

Here is what I have and what I'm looking to try and do on the cheap.

New Edge Mustang...Rough around the edges. Was built half way decent but has been sitting for about 5 or 6 years.
12 point mild steel cage, decent suspension, built 8.8 with 3.73.

Needs tires, most of the fuel system, wiring and a lot of TLC. Should weigh about 2900-3000# maybe lighter if I put it under the knife a bit.

Parts I have...
04 gen3.5 (good rods 24 tooth wheel) 200,000 mile 5.3. No intake, has truck exh. manifolds. Ran decent.
Sloppy stg2 cam.
Early TH400 that is a good core with 16 element sprag so I can install a 34 element sprag.
Another 8.8 with 2.73 gears.
GT45 turbo from a old project that never got built.
NOS Sniper 100-150 shot kit.
10 gal fuel cell.
3 gal fuel cell.
Couple of 650 dp Holleys.
Probably some other crap I am forgetting... Happens a lot when you get to be a old fart like me.

I am looking to run 1/8 mile, grudge, no prep, and some south of the border races.
I would like to be in the 5.5-5.9 second 120-125 mph range which good old Mr. Wallace says I will need 800-850 hp to achieve.

I have a lot of blown alcohol (mechanical fuel injection) BBC experience along with some old school blow thru carb (Nothing like what is available now) which all took place 15-20 years ago.

So... Plan "B" version 1.0 looks something like this.

Check the ring gap and engine condition.
Replace badly worn parts that need it.(Badly worn being the key word)
Add the sloppy cam, springs.
F body or other cheap oil pan that will work.
MSD 6014 box and Holley mid rise single plane intake.
Build a 650 blow thru carb.
Add cold side, BOV, carb hat.
GT45 turbo, hot side and twin waste gates
Add sniper n20 kit.
Build manual valve body th400 with just the bare minimum of parts needed to make it live at this power level.
No trans brake. Just foot brake with 75-100 shot n20 of the line.
Cheapest converter that will work with this combo.
Swap the 2.73 into 8.8 or possibly 3.08 and run only 1st and 2nd. in 1/8 and have 3rd. for cruising.

So here is where I need your input.

I like meth and have used it with n20 on a buddys blown gas carbed BBC to great effect... It loved it.

I got to looking at the Sniper kit I have and it is currently set up for a 150 shot with 62 n20 and 54 fuel jets if I remember correctly.

I checked out a couple of different jet charts for n20 and Methanol and if I swap them around I should be close to around a 90hp n20 shot depending on the bottle pressure and about 2.5 to 3 times increase in fuel (methanol) depending on fuel pressure.

I would run a stand alone methanol system up front with the 3 gallon fuel cell and the cheapest pump that will work with meth.

This is something I have been wanting to try for a long time on a blow thru application.

I can get 100 octane fuel which I will run when racing (91 octane on low boost on the street) for the carb set up.

The MSD box only has a 2.5 bar map sensor (21lbs. boost or so)

So from the research I have made the gt45 is maxed out on a 5.3 with a combo like mine to around 19-24lbs. and 600-650 hp.

That's shy of what I need by 150-200hp.

That's were I "think" my hybrid n20 system might work.

With a cooling effect of the meth plus the 2-3 times extra exhaust gas pressure which should make for instant boost (which is why I plan on running two waste gates)

This is the point I need to bounce this off other people wiser than me...

I'm pretty certain it would work for my version 1.5 which I will get too in a bit but I'm not real certain, just what effect it would have on a turbo system that is maxed out on both the turbine and compressor side.

I would really like to squeeze everything I can out of this one gt45.

If the consensus is that this will NOT work... Then I would like to get input on what you think of version 1.5 which is what I was originally thinking of doing when I first starting this whole thought process.

Version 1.5 is getting another gt45 and using the N20/METH to light it off foot braking.

Oh...And to just make it clear...I would use the n20meth for the full run on both versions.

I am pretty certain that this combo would work really well for a cheap setup.(other than the 100lbs. of turbo hanging off the wrong end)

I am really interested in what you guys think.

 

Couple issues I see. Don’t get me wrong I like carbs! But you’ll be at such a disadvantage compared to EFI. Won’t be able to tune cylinders individually, won’t have the ECU “auto tune” to help with tuning and phasing in of large amounts of METH etc... It will make the alky injection and carb integration twice as hard. Personally I’d buy an MS3. They have more I/O options are setup for methanol control, traction control, boost by speed… etc… the same cost basically at $1040, just more options. You’ll be hard pressed to be competitive without traction control, boost by speed, etc in no prep. Event. But if your hell bent on a carb for cost, I get it!

The gt45 is just a plain old dinosaur, really shooting yourself in the foot there. Id buy a set of affordable twins. You can get 2 billet 78/75s for $267 each shipped. Best deal out there IMO. Even 1 would be better than that gt45. Worst case is you need a 75 shot for a second or so and you can shut the nitrous off once the turbos get “lit”. Its expensive to run N20 the entire pass, and plain not needed.

I honestly think with that setup and a lot of meth injection you wouldn’t need an intercooler for your goals. Direct port would be cool, but probably overkill on a cheap build. Ramp in 20gph on each turbo, pre-turbo. Then tune around the added enrichment from the meth on the carb. Again, EFI would really make that easy and wouldn’t cost that much more to run a stock manifold and cheap injectors. That said E85 alone would do the same thing if it’s an option. It would be easier.

Good luck!

 

I always thought “plan B” meant you told her, “ you love her and if she wants the baby, sure we’ll have a baby”

lol learn Simon new every day here lol

 

UPDATE !!!!
Plan B (version 2.0)


So... After finally getting family and friends thru a bunch of this covid crap I am going to try and get this project going forward before the gates of hell open again and my tools turn to liquid metal.

Quick rundown on what it is and the new parts and choices I need to make.

New Edge Mustang...Rough around the edges. Was built half way decent but has been sitting for about 5 or 6 years.
12 point mild steel cage, decent suspension, built 8.8 with 3.73.

Needs tires, most of the fuel system, wiring and a lot of TLC. Should weigh about 2900-3000# maybe lighter if I put it under the knife a bit.

New parts have * by them...

Parts I have...
04 gen3.5 (good rods 24 tooth wheel) 200,000 mile 5.3. truck manifolds. Ran decent.
* ( New possible candidate...01 lq4 6.0 with ly6 rods and pistons) *
Sloppy stg2 cam.
Early TH400 that is a good core with 16 element sprag so I can install a 34 element sprag.
* (New possible candidate...01 4l80e) *
Another 8.8 with 2.73 gears.
* B/W cast wheel S480 turbo *
* 01 truck computer, intake, wiring harness etc.*
10 gal fuel cell.

I am looking to run 1/8 mile, grudge, no prep, and some south of the border races.

So... Plan "B" version 2.0 now looks something like this. (New parts *)

Check the ring gap and engine condition on both engines
Add the sloppy cam, springs.
F body or other cheap oil pan that will work.
*01 Truck intake and fuel rails *
Add cold side/hot side
*B/W cast wheel S480 with possible v1 race cover*
Build manual valve body th400 with just the bare minimum of parts needed to make it live at this power level.
*Build 4l80e as above*
No trans brake. Just foot brake with shot of n20 of the line.
Cheapest converter that will work with this combo.
Swap the 2.73 into 8.8 or possibly 3.08 and run only 1st and 2nd. in 1/8 and have 3rd. for cruising.
* 3.73 and run the 4l80e*
* factory 01 truck computer*
*Snake Eater injectors*

So...My big questions for the brain trust here is...

Which engine should I use, to get the most out of the cast wheel s480 turbo ???

If I run the race cover would that change your opinion on which engine ???

* Keep 3.73's and run the 4l80e* ???

* Run factory 01 truck computer* ???

This has to stay "low budget" as the piggy bank is just now getting off of life support.

Looking forward to hearing everyones idea's.

 

Kind of need to decide between street car and good manners or purpose built 1/8th IMO. What ET do you need to run to be competitive? Pretty Key to suggest anything specific.

The 5.3 will go farther for your money, esp. when turbo limited w/ the S480. The 6.0/4l80e will bring in much better resale if you currently have them. You can literally buy 3-4 small bore motors for the cost of a 6.0 around here. Cost VS performance isn't there with a 6.0 IMO. Not worth the hype...

K.I.S.S. is the best practice when building a race car IMO. No electronic trans, no factory ECU, no highway gears. Manual valve body trans, aftermarket ECU, and as good of a driveline as you can afford. A converter isn't the place to cut corners. It's about he most key part there is in a drag car IMO. One of the few places I spend money. Power is easy. Spend your money on driveline parts, ECU, and converter.

I'm one of the few using an TH400 as you describe, but I have trans built for 1200+ and I'm maybe pushing 700. I'm not sure if using a TH400 as a "glide with OD" is feasible with big power and a minimally built trans. I know the 4l80e will cost a lot more... and then you're stuck with a factory ECU or more expensive aftermarket ECU to control it. Not the route I'd go.

The SS2 isn't going to get you the RPM you want with a small bore motor either... If you want it to perform, you need to rev it out. Meaning springs, better cam, pushrods. Maybe even a china short runner intake if it's in your budget. You don't want power falling off at 6500ish where it does with that cam. You want to be more like 7500... And you want it to stall to 4k ish.