Max Boost on Pump Gas
Bryan, I am not here to argue. I am just stating my experience and the fact that my experience is consistant with what 99% of the other people of this board experience.
Your rude and condescending attitude does not help your cause. If there is a way to get more HP with pump gas I am all ears.
Your rude and condescending attitude does not help your cause. If there is a way to get more HP with pump gas I am all ears.
Originally Posted by Bryan Wilkinson
Not to offend, but I would think one would have tried before comdeming. At least I can say that I have done it. So are you saying that because I am the only one that has done it, that it isnt possible? Or becuase I am the only one that has done it, its not safe. I would have to go back and look but when I came to the forum and asked, what is the maximum amount of power possible on the GM PCM, 600RWHP was the number. When I asked what was the most power I could make on pump gas, I believe the number was around 650. My example is proof that normal engine building rules do not apply to the LS1 family of motors, which every one is basising their opinon on. Not one person on this forum can make that claim. I did the research, spent the money, got the results. No one on the forum has yet to prove to me that it is unsafe, other than it cant be done. The parts in the engine seem to have something different to say about it. when we took it apart, The Carrillo A-Rods, made for 600HP, the bearings, the rings, nothing showed any signs of detonation. Nothing. So prove to me that it is unsafe or not doable. The only reason that I am stepping down in CR, is I want 1100RWHP on the same pump gas. The higher the CR, the better the thermal efficiency. The better the gas mileage. I did not say that you could run 12:1 and on a 427 with pump gas, I reached the limit with 17PSI on pump gas and somwhere around 20:1 dynamic compression, and the limit was not the pump gas, the limit was the weak *** gasket from cometic.
Are you enjoying paying $4.00+ per gallon for gas. and here is the kicker, with dynamic compression being the real measurement, if 822RWHP on Pump gas with 17 psi of boost is possible, anything south of 700 should be extreamly doable. It is not necessary. At 822RWHP if I was on the bleeding edge, 700RWHP is most certainly obtainable on pump gas with his setup and the tune is right.
One more thing, I do not give a flying F&*( if I did not take it down the strip. I drive it on the street, take it on 8 hour plus road trips and every once in a while get the opprotunity to step on it and I pay less than $2.30 a gallon for gas and get 25 miles to the gallon to boot. CAN YOU SAY THE SAME. My guess is not. So the message I would give to you and the rest of the people who have zero clue, quit talking about stuff you know absolutely nothing about. If you build a motor, making 10:1 CR and throw 17PSI at it you blow it up, then you can tell me Im wrong, but basing your information on what everyone else has said here and over the past 50 years of the small block chevy is weak, and not welcomed. The LS style engines are in a class of their own.
Are you enjoying paying $4.00+ per gallon for gas. and here is the kicker, with dynamic compression being the real measurement, if 822RWHP on Pump gas with 17 psi of boost is possible, anything south of 700 should be extreamly doable. It is not necessary. At 822RWHP if I was on the bleeding edge, 700RWHP is most certainly obtainable on pump gas with his setup and the tune is right.
One more thing, I do not give a flying F&*( if I did not take it down the strip. I drive it on the street, take it on 8 hour plus road trips and every once in a while get the opprotunity to step on it and I pay less than $2.30 a gallon for gas and get 25 miles to the gallon to boot. CAN YOU SAY THE SAME. My guess is not. So the message I would give to you and the rest of the people who have zero clue, quit talking about stuff you know absolutely nothing about. If you build a motor, making 10:1 CR and throw 17PSI at it you blow it up, then you can tell me Im wrong, but basing your information on what everyone else has said here and over the past 50 years of the small block chevy is weak, and not welcomed. The LS style engines are in a class of their own.
sheesh..
Originally Posted by parish8
i know a t76 can make over 800rwhp but he has a lot of cubes and will not be in that turbo max eficency range once he turns it up. with my stock headed 408 the best i could do is 640rwhp.
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Originally Posted by Wicked_Hugger99
Quote:
Originally Posted by parish8
i know a t76 can make over 800rwhp but he has a lot of cubes and will not be in that turbo max eficency range once he turns it up. with my stock headed 408 the best i could do is 640rwhp.
Good point, didnt really think of that
What's the reason for dropping the efficiency of the turbo with bigger cubes engine. Anything in the other direction will be increase the lag.
the rpm's of the motor do not really effect what i am talking about.(well they do but at 6500 rpm you will be flowing lots of air.)
here is a compresor map for a t76
in my case i see ~90lb's of air at 16psi, 16psi is 2.1 presure ratio on that chart. if you line up 90lb's and 2.1 bar you will see i am right off the chart. you will be too. this means more heat and less power. a smaller motor would actualy be able to make a little more peek hp than us but we will make a pile of tq down low and have a quick spooling set up wich is a lot of fun to drive. it is all a trade off.
here is the map for a t88
line up 90lb's and 2.1 bar and you can see i am going to be right in the sweet spot
, the larger exhaust housing will have less back presure too. put those 2 things together and i should make quite a bit more power at the same 16psi with the 88 over the 76. the down side is lag, quite a bit of it.
i ran 16psi and a 100shot a few times thru my 4l80e and it took it. the first time i tried to push the t88 with 16psi i broke my tranny input shaft
, i think the 88 is doing it's job.
here is a compresor map for a t76
in my case i see ~90lb's of air at 16psi, 16psi is 2.1 presure ratio on that chart. if you line up 90lb's and 2.1 bar you will see i am right off the chart. you will be too. this means more heat and less power. a smaller motor would actualy be able to make a little more peek hp than us but we will make a pile of tq down low and have a quick spooling set up wich is a lot of fun to drive. it is all a trade off.
here is the map for a t88
line up 90lb's and 2.1 bar and you can see i am going to be right in the sweet spot
, the larger exhaust housing will have less back presure too. put those 2 things together and i should make quite a bit more power at the same 16psi with the 88 over the 76. the down side is lag, quite a bit of it. i ran 16psi and a 100shot a few times thru my 4l80e and it took it. the first time i tried to push the t88 with 16psi i broke my tranny input shaft
, i think the 88 is doing it's job. on the lag part of your question. the lag is longer for a larger turbo because the parts that need to get spining are larger and heavier. also the exhaust housing is designed for a lot more air so it has a larger output on it, it takes more air to really get the thing spining wich takes longer to spool but reduces back presure once it is up and running.
here is a pic of the 76 i had compared to the 88
here is a pic of the 76 i had compared to the 88
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Yeah Parish8, what do you know? So your truck is faster and more reliable than Bryans car at double the raceweight, what does that prove?
Are you enjoying paying 4.00+ a gallon for gas? If you were smart like Bryan you could have spent 50k on your engine and saved 1.75 a gallon! Whos the fool now!
It's obvious that once Cometic learns how to make a real mans head gasket Bryan will be making an easy ONE BILLION horsepower on pump gas!
Are you enjoying paying 4.00+ a gallon for gas? If you were smart like Bryan you could have spent 50k on your engine and saved 1.75 a gallon! Whos the fool now!
It's obvious that once Cometic learns how to make a real mans head gasket Bryan will be making an easy ONE BILLION horsepower on pump gas!
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Parish, you explained it very well.
I already did my calculation before I say T76. I've looked at the consumption charts for 383LT1 engine at Forced Inductions site and found that at 6200RPM, it will flow 64# at 10 psi with 1.68 PR. Also, it will flow 80# at 16 psi with 2.09 PR at 6200RPM.
By looking at the T76 map, both cases will be within the optimum efficiency range of the T76.
The T-88 will perform but at the expense of lag.
What do you think?
I already did my calculation before I say T76. I've looked at the consumption charts for 383LT1 engine at Forced Inductions site and found that at 6200RPM, it will flow 64# at 10 psi with 1.68 PR. Also, it will flow 80# at 16 psi with 2.09 PR at 6200RPM.
By looking at the T76 map, both cases will be within the optimum efficiency range of the T76.
The T-88 will perform but at the expense of lag.
What do you think?
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Originally Posted by bluecamaroz28
By looking at the T76 map, both cases will be within the optimum efficiency range of the T76.
you will be at about 65% on the t76 and 78% on the t88. not really the "optimum" range for the t76 but not too far off either. you can see how you are geting close to falling off the edge of the chart.
lag is no fun and near instant spool is a blast, i would go with the t76.
Originally Posted by INTMD8
Yeah Parish8, what do you know? So your truck is faster and more reliable than Bryans car at double the raceweight, what does that prove?
Are you enjoying paying 4.00+ a gallon for gas? If you were smart like Bryan you could have spent 50k on your engine and saved 1.75 a gallon! Whos the fool now!
It's obvious that once Cometic learns how to make a real mans head gasket Bryan will be making an easy ONE BILLION horsepower on pump gas!
Are you enjoying paying 4.00+ a gallon for gas? If you were smart like Bryan you could have spent 50k on your engine and saved 1.75 a gallon! Whos the fool now!
It's obvious that once Cometic learns how to make a real mans head gasket Bryan will be making an easy ONE BILLION horsepower on pump gas!
I not one time ever said my method was cheaper to build, and just for your information, you can duplicated my setup for under $30K. I just said it was doable and proved it. So when other people ask if it possible, you quit giving them wrong information, and I will quit making a big deal out of it. Its ok to admit when your wrong. Go ahead you can do it. The question was can it be done, the answer is YES. You know as well as I do, I could throw race gas at it, and be well over 1000 at the tires. The thread is about pump gas, and 700 RWHP. Been there, done that. Parish8 has not either. Doesnt matter if he made 2000hp on a 4 cylinder with 116. Most power on pump gas that I can drive all day.
Originally Posted by Bryan Wilkinson
Are you enjoying paying $4.00+ per gallon for gas.
I pay less than $2.30 a gallon for gas and get 25 miles to the gallon to boot.
I pay less than $2.30 a gallon for gas and get 25 miles to the gallon to boot.
Originally Posted by Bryan Wilkinson
I not one time ever said my method was cheaper to build, and just for your information, you can duplicated my setup for under $30K.
if moneys no object in all?
bryan wilkinson at bowling green I want to run your car, heads up I dont care how much horsepower you have, I want to run your car and see what it can do against mine, i'm a big proponent on running on pump gas too, my car might be making a little over 500 to the tire when she gets redone, are you game? to make it fair i'll run on drag radials and you can run on a slick.
loser buys 3 lap dances at the strip club plus drinks.
loser buys 3 lap dances at the strip club plus drinks.
Bryan, I'm calling BS now. You went 12.5@115mph last year as a best I heard at some track rental at Darlington. You subsequently lifted head gaskets twice on the dyno I hear.
So you have the record for 822rwhp on pump gas... ONCE?
You are really setting yourself up for a lot of grief if you keep talking like that and don't seem to run very good.
Also, I went 136mph with belt issues, and that's not where I should be either. Have you at least gone in the 120's? I'm shooting for 140's next time out unless I have problems. I hope you go at least 136 like my old time, which is more indicative of 600rwhp.
So you have the record for 822rwhp on pump gas... ONCE?
You are really setting yourself up for a lot of grief if you keep talking like that and don't seem to run very good.
Also, I went 136mph with belt issues, and that's not where I should be either. Have you at least gone in the 120's? I'm shooting for 140's next time out unless I have problems. I hope you go at least 136 like my old time, which is more indicative of 600rwhp.
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Originally Posted by Bryan Wilkinson
...when we took it apart, The Carrillo A-Rods, made for 600HP, the bearings, the rings, nothing showed any signs of detonation. Nothing. So prove to me that it is unsafe or not doable.
No one doubts that its DOable, but a reliable, repeatable combo it is NOT. You made 822rwhp before ******* up a gasket on a dyno rated for like 2600lbs (or whatever a Dynojet is load-rated to). Big deal. Tune on a Mustang or on the street at WOT. Parish's truck (5000+lbs) runs better (and FASTER) than yours and doesn't break. But I guess he doesn't know **** huh?
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Let's call off bashing, at least in my thread. Is that fair.
Parish,
Do you think a larger exahust headers tubes/pipes to the inlet of the T-76 will ease the backpressure or there wil be no issue of backpressure upto 16 psi.
What was the size you had with the T-76. are you using the same with the T-88.
Parish,
Do you think a larger exahust headers tubes/pipes to the inlet of the T-76 will ease the backpressure or there wil be no issue of backpressure upto 16 psi.
What was the size you had with the T-76. are you using the same with the T-88.