$5000.00 will not do it in FI. If it was that simple every car on the road would be FI'ed. My ATI Super damper, 60 lbs injectors, and Mondo BPV alone add to over $1200.00 already. Add Turbo or Supercharger, tune, fuel pump, intercooler, this, that and pretty soon you are talking real money.


Bottom line: $5000.00 will not do much in the FI world. Sad but true!

 

ive been working out the cost of turbocharging for months now and it comes out to almost exactly 7000 bucks and that includes paying someone to tune it and u doing [/B][/U]ALL[U] installations urself

 

It always comes out to being more than what you think it will cost.. So you should go ahead and add atleast $1000 for "misc."

 

pm me to if you would like to get ahold of the sts rep in houston

 

id just do a basic gmr seed single turbo w/ the t67 upgrade, and street fuel system. thats good for 500rwhp

 

sounds like really what your going for is just a nice sound and some fun to play with every now and then. you should go with STS.

http://www.ststurbo.com/ls1_camaro

add the intercooler and tuning (aswell as small **** like a boost gauge/controller etc.) and you can make it out under 7k. correct me if im wrong

 

Reading the threads, here's my $0.02. The stock STS kit is $4K new. It is very much lacking in what you need. I added a TRT front mount intercooler because even at 5PSI the intake temp was too hot for street use. That was $1K. Now we get into needing upgraded injectors, in-tank fuel pump, TR6 or equivalent plugs, CC918 springs (or even better Patriot Gold dual springs), a boost gauge, tuning, (an AEM or equivalent wideband A/F gauge), custom exhaust work if you don't want the STS to look like a$$, and a blow-off valve for a manual. That's another $1K+. This is assuming you're installing everything yourself. I've added more $$ in heat shielding, misc lines, and most recently ordering a boost-referenced fuel pressure regulator, rails, and line to creat a boost-referenced fuel system. That was $500+ and it's being built on "the cheap".

The above (minus the fuel regulator) + LT headers and a TR224 cam is 426RWHP / 438RWTQ (SAE) at 5PSI. Anything over 5PSI on the stock bottom end is in my personal opinion a recipe for disaster on a daily driver. My dyno numbers equate to 500 flywheel HP, which is what your goal was. I just want to make it crystal clear that NOTHING FI is cheap and that it will cost a good 7K by the time all is said and done.

With a nearly stock car, you could also look at the Vortech aftercooled kit or the ATI. I heard ATI just raised their prices, but the previous cost put them and the Vortech about $6.5-7K after adding all the other necessary hardware to make a streetable 500HP car. The superchargers will produce torque much earlier in the RPM range, which makes them "feel" faster for a daily driver. The turbo won't produce boost till later in the RPM range, but it comes on violently then. The turbo is also not producing boost under light and part throttle loads, which is good for the engine.

Your cheapest bet (keeping the cost under 5K as you stated origonally) would be to add a cam (about $700 for a cam + all gaskets), good heads (about $2700-$3000 with all gaskets), and nice LT headers (another $1K for good ones). That will net you a good 400RWHP or more, depending how aggressive of a cam you get. A good clutch is another must for either scenerio, as the stock one won't last long. I have a Textralia OZ700. THat works well and is street friendly. Cost is over $1K.

Anyhow, kinda long, but hope this helps.

 

I'm going to call a few people, but I think FI may be overstepping my bounds. This is a one shot deal, once the money is spent, it's gone. So if a FI setup is going to have higher maintenance afterwards (like if I damage a turbo bearing or something) I'm going to be dead in the water as my money will be gone.

Here's a new game plan. How about a bulletproof rearend shortend 2 inches on each side. Then get American Racing to make me some custom offset TTII rims for a deep dish look. I can sell my current 17x11 rims to offset the cost. Then upgrade the clutch based on a set of heads, cam and headers (450+hp). Then get some nice polished stainless headers and a lopey cam that sounds wicked. Tune it and then see how much money I have left over and if I even feel the need for more power. If I have the money and feel the need for more HP, I can get the heads and then retune.

I think that makes good sense for a daily driver and I'm not spending a ton of money up front. One small note, I don't really like the way most turbo setups sound, but the BOV whistle is badass. Supercharger whine is badass, too. Ultimately, if I set my sights a bit lower I can get the best sounding setup of all. Headers with that lopey cam. Man I love that!

What do you guys think of that plan?

 

I think you have seen the light. Good luck with the project.

 

If your interested at all.... Turbocharged cars dont lose much if any driveability around town as they dont come into boost. A big cam, head set up will be more trouble with a m6, and may buck and surge dpending on how the tune is, and also will notice a decrease in MPG, but whats that to us Muscle car cars anyway? I still say, with how much your going to spend on heads/cam, dig a little deeper and go for the STS kit. It has much more potential to grow as well. The choice is yours though. I'll be going STS for my daily driver, but to each their own. Hope this helps

 

Have you checked out GMR Speeds Single Street setup. It is a nice kit that will produce 450rwhp on low boost and can be turned up to produce over 500rwhp. And they are a sponsor! their webpage is http://www.gmrspeed.com/

But like everyone said it gets expensive in a hurry.

 

on a side note... dont take advice on something from someone who has never been there or done it.....


this site is really bad about that....

i know for a fact that a 230/236 .581/.598 112lsa and 4.10 gears in a th350 car will scream and sound very nice

400rwhp is nothing to sneeze at and will suprise you... i know it did me... then just put a cheap dry nitrous kit (50-100rwhp) on and use it on special occasions....

as far as headers go dont break the bank get a nice set but doesnt have to be the best (but if you lowered DO NOT get SLP headers... thats what i have, and i actually like them unlike many others but im not lowered and i have a tall drag radial on all the time)

 

7500 will do it, go to the for sale section, buy the brand new Incon kit... put it in... run 5 psi, do 450 rwhp all day on everything stock.
Catch the FI bug, drop another 5g's on stuff, run 8lbs, do 575rw all day.
Get good and hooked on boost, drop another 10g, run up the boost again do about 800rw.
Boost = money money money.
More boost = more money, Its like a good coke habit.

 

See, that right there tells me not to go FI. I inherited some money, so once it's gone I'm back to be being poor.
The thought of putting a down payment on a used vette crossed my mind.
Ehh, no rush. I've got plenty of time to think about it. Thanks for the help guys.

 

Dead on! Im learning this the hard way. Im coming from a big cam and heads setup into FI for the power and drivability. It takes an *** load of money. I bought a used kit minus turbo and its still going to take me about $4k to finish it.

 

Here is a list of items that I recently put together for building up the chassis prior to adding the horsepower. People are always asking the question of whether to go with a head and cam package, or go with a supercharger or turbocharger. There is no way you are to match the power of an ATI ProCharger with a head and cam package unless you use a pretty radical camshaft. Nitrous oxide could be used instead of going the forced induction route, with very good results at a fraction of the cost. A cold air kit would be required if you elect to use nitrous oxide instead of going the forced induction (ATI ProCharger) route. The ATI ProChargers come with a K&N cone filter. With forced induction, such as the ATI ProCharger, the power is always going to be there when you want it, with no nitrous bottles to constantly refill. A turbocharger could be used instead of an ATI ProCharger, but I am not convinced that the turbo kits currently out on the market will stand the test of time. TurboChargers go through extreme heat cycles, which can fracture the turbo housing mounts.
With the items listed below, your car would be quite capable of routinely running low eleven second 1/4 mile times, or faster, when combined with the M/T Street radial rear tires.

Everyone has their opinions on what is the best package, and here is mine.

1. Subframe Connectors - Absolutely necessary to keep your F Body from twisting and stretching. I have seen too many of these cars lose their door to fender gaps from having gone too long without subframe connectors. Subframe connectors will make the car handle better, you'll get fewer squeaks and the car will get better traction.

2. Torque Arm - BMR, Global West and Spohn all make torque arms that relocate the front mount off of the transmission by relocating the front mount back behind the transmission. The relocation of the front mount relieves the stress from the tailshaft of the transmission that the torque arm places on it, as a result of trying to contain the rear-end and it's rotational stresses. The stock torque arm is a stamped piece of sheetmetal that has broken apart for many people, and it sometimes takes out the driveshaft with it when it goes. By relocating the front mount of the torque arm behind the transmission, the geometry of the rear suspension becomes much better and really aids in hooking up the rear suspension. While replacing the torque arm, check the transmission mount, as the stock torque arm places a huge load on the mount, and the mount breaks quite often when using the factory torque arm. The adjustability of these aftermarket torque arms allows the user to adjust the pinion angle of the rear suspension which aids in finding traction.

3. Moser 12 bolt or 9 inch - Sooner or later the weak 7.5" Chevy S-10 derived 10 bolt is going to break. I wouldn't waste any money into attempting to build up the 10 bolt, it just doesn't work. There isn't one strong point to the stocker. For those of you with a six speed transmission, the 10 bolt has broken on many M6 cars with stock power. Expect the worse to happen... 3:73 gears in the Moser rear-end is a good compromise, especially when adding a lot of power to the engine.

4. Driveshaft - The stock GM driveshaft have broken for many enthusiast, both the steel and the 3.0" aluminum GM driveshafts are fairly weak. I recommend an aftermarket 3.5" aluminum driveshaft with a 1350 Yoke with a 1350 U Joint. Combined with the Moser rear with their supplied 1350 yoke, you will have a strong drivetrain.

5. Clutch and pressure plate - I recommend the Spec Stage 3 clutch and pressure plate. Expect some chatter for the first 500 miles, then it will be pretty smooth. I would also add the '01-'02 slave cylinder for the older models, and do the "drill mod" to the master cylinder. Do a search on this forum for the drill mod, and you will see what it entails.

At this point I believe the suspension is capable off supporting a lot of horsepower, and you can go straight to item 14.
For those of you who are dragstrip bound, I would also add a few additional items.

6. Adjustable lower control arms - The aftermarket lower control arms are much stouter, and will not flex like the factory lower control arms. Going with adjustable ones will allow the user to center the rear end in the wheelwell. The stock rear end position from the factory tends to be .5" towards the rear of the car. You really won't notice it until larger diameter tires are installed.

7. Lower control arm relocation brackets - Lower control arm relocation brackets are meant to be used when the car has been lowered, which alters the angle of the lower control arms. We have found that the relocation brackets also help in getting traction in non lowered cars. We use the weld on style that BMR offers.

8. Panhard bar - The factory pan hard bar is pretty flimsy and additional traction can be found by replacing the factory pan hard bar with a heavier duty aftermarket bar. The rear in these cars tends to sit closer to the right side, and by purchasing an adjustable pan hard bar, the rear-end can be centered in the body.

9. Strut Tower Brace - Eliminate flexing in the front end by adding an aftermarket strut tower brace. You will also notice that the car will handle better with a strut tower brace.

10. Battery box relocation - By relocating the battery to the trunk, you will remove a lot of weight off the front of the car and place the weight behind the rear-end, where it will aid in traction. The car will also be able to handle better with the weight relocation.

11. Rear coil spring air bags - By experimenting with adding more air to the right air bag than to the left one, better off the line traction can be found.

12. Adjustable shocks and front coil over springs - We use the Hal QA1 12 way adjustable shocks on our cars. It is easy to adjust these shocks for street use, and then readjust them for strip use by simply rotating the 12 way adjustable dial. The Hal QA1 front coil over springs allows the front end height to easily be adjusted.

13. K member - By replacing the front K member and upper and lower control arms with light weight aftermarket tubular ones, a lot of weight is removed from the front suspension. Since front end weight is removed, better off the line traction and better handling will occur. We have had good success with the BMR parts, and combined with the Hal QA1 shocks and coil over front springs, gives the car a much better chance of getting traction on the starting line.

14. Headers and cat back exhaust - Everyone has their favorites, but we have grown very fond of Hooker and Flowtech headers, and the Hooker and Magnaflow Cat Back exhaust systems.
Flowtech and Hooker ceramic coated headers fit very well, with excellent ground clearance. The ceramic coatings go a long way towards keeping the exhaust temps in the pipes, keeping the engine bay cooler and improving internal exhaust scavenging. These two brands of headers will give you 2.5" more in ground clearance compared to SLP headers.
The Hooker and Magnaflow cat back exhaust systems give these cars a good muscular sound that will not drown out your stereo while driving down the road. The exhaust tubing is larger than the stock tubing and is mandrel bent, for better exhaust flow.

For those of you who want it loud. If you are looking for an exhaust system that will annoy everyone around you, the two above exhaust systems are not for you. The SLP "Loud Mouth" cat back is a good system for those of you who want to be noticed. When we have one of these cars on my dyno with a loud mouth exhaust system, everyone around our area can hear the car!

15. ATI ProCharger D-1SC eight rib supercharger - Simply the best and easiest way to get 450 to 500 rwhp out of your car in my opinion, when combined with headers and a good cat back exhaust system. The car will still see great part throttle gas mileage, overall driveability will still be excellent, and the power is always there when you want it. At 8 pounds of boost, the car will be very dependable, and with the twin high flow air to air intercoolers, unleaded premium is all you need to use. I recommend the ATI ProCharger D-1SC "tuner" kit, as the D-1SC can handle future mods much better than the P-1SC. You will need 42 lb fuel injectors, a 255 litre in tank fuel pump, and chassis dyno tuning with the "tuner" kit.

Hopefully this list will help you in your quest for having a quick car! Bob

 

Killer list.
I have most of the stuff on the list but I did it the half backwardass way.
I did the twin turbo; h/c fuel first then tackled the list over the last 2 years.
My 10 bolt lasted a long time with 5 3/4rwhp. Just didn’t drag race it.
Street tires brake loose before the rear brakes. (Nothing better then smoking an unsuspecting mustang as you light the tires for 1000 yards from a 70mph roll)

Add 16 on your list, Fat *** tires and rims. (best part of any car)(I think)


As for turbos, they are best hands down, cruzing at no boost I get like 25mpg. As for their durability, I have seen tractor-trailers, sabbs, grand nationals, porches, wrx's ect go over 100,000mi. before a rebuild was necessary, Its all in the packaging. What do they have in common, cast iron manifolds, not steel header pipe. That’s why I recommend Incon kits, cant get them anymore except used but anyone who has one will tell you, if they had to do it again and Incon kits were 10 grand, they would buy it without a second thought. I have 15,000 mi on mine so far. Just change the oil now and then and let it cool down for a few minutes if I have been beating on it.
My week link is the stock shortblock and the pesky #7, but I run my rig with a fat tune and easy on the timing.

Force induction / low budget approach does not go together.

But like I said, you could had got that 7500 dollar Incon kit, (sold now) went all stock, ran 5 lbs, done 450rwhp and gone 100,000 mi. without nothing but oil changes and a tune up here and there. The problem is simple, someone made boost controllers, you can’t help turning up the boost, I don’t care how much willpower you have, Boost is crack for cars.

For someone like me there is no problem going broke over boost.
It’s all I ever thought about all my life, girls and twin turbos…

At some point you have to make your dreams come true in life before you realize you’re to old to enjoy them.
.

 

From what I have in my basic turbo kit is less than 4000. This is what I have brand new STS for 2800, used LS6 intake 350, used 42 lbs injectors 240, new walbro fuel pump 75, LS6 coolent lines 50, and a custom tune 400. I haven't started putting my parts on yet. I'm want until July to start. I know I will need at least another 500 to 1000 for misc. stuff but that is what I have for less than 4000.

 

Too late, that Incon twin turbo set-up is mine. ~Joshua

 

Listen to me on this one. If you only have enough money to put FI on your car and not enough money to pay for it if it screws up. DONT DO IT!. I have seen plenty of guys even here locall, blow thier pay check everyweek to be fast. Then go around tell everyone I have 500RWHP. That they can not hardly use cause they still need a better clutch rearend and lots of ther things. then when the engine goes they have to save money for months to fix thier car and bum rides from me.

BOTTOM LINE IF YOU CANT AFFORD TO PAY LATER THEN DONT PAY NOW!