What Headers for California?
04-13-2006, 07:03 PM
#22
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Originally Posted by Bad30th
Midlengths/LT's make a shitload more power, but JBA and Edelbrock shorties have a CARB exemption and are smog legal (but don't make the same big power gains). There are no legal midlength or long tube headers in Cali, because they relocate the cats from the factory location. That's why I went with JBA shorties on my new setup. Going with shorties you'll be leaving 20 rwhp on the table with a stock car, more with mods (I could probably pick up 40rwhp easy with LT's) - but at least you won't have to worry about smog testing or getting pulled over by the Cali gestapo.
"Hvat do vee have heer ? Zis looks like zee modified exhaust mit keine cats ! Out of zee car and get on zee ground !!!".
Cali laws make baby Jesus cry.
Rob (Bad30th)
"Hvat do vee have heer ? Zis looks like zee modified exhaust mit keine cats ! Out of zee car and get on zee ground !!!".
Cali laws make baby Jesus cry.
Rob (Bad30th)
Technically, there is no such thing as legal long tube headers. The law that probibits cats from being moved is a federal law and not a California law.
04-14-2006, 05:03 PM
#23
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Originally Posted by SSDude
Technically, there is no such thing as legal long tube headers. The law that probibits cats from being moved is a federal law and not a California law.
yup, just most states don't enforce it. The law really has very little to do with emisions and more to do with control. If it was just about emissions, they would only use the sniffer and onboard computer.
04-15-2006, 01:51 AM
#24
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For you guys running longtubes in cali, are you using cats with the y pipe? if not how do guys erase the trouble codes. Do you guys take your cars to the dyno to get a tune?
04-15-2006, 08:39 AM
#25
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Some information:
It's not about whether a LT can light off cats, its not about the location, and its not even about tailpipe compliance. While "technically" these are the claims, properly tuned, set-up and run longtubes can provide just as good or at least compliant emissions test results.
It is about money... it is about the state getting its cut. Every time a company tests to satisfy the CARB or any government body, that body makes a sizable chunk of money for creating that EO. Currently, an EO is only good for a particular group of automotive applications as defined by the ARB. Every year they have the right to review and ask for additional testing and certification. This can be Thousands of dollars / applicaton / year. Are you seeing the income?
Most any ULEV motor now utilizes TWC (three way cats) and lacks the AIR and smog pumps of the past (part of two way type cat systems.) EGR's with the much more sophiticated fuel managment systems are becoming less and less necessary. These were all band-aids for passing such tests. Most have no appreciable effect on emissions past cold start...for those with skip shift, this is another band-aid for meeting emissions compliance.
Beware as EPA has been looking to adopt CA standards nationally for some time. There is lots of debate as to when but not IF.
It's not about whether a LT can light off cats, its not about the location, and its not even about tailpipe compliance. While "technically" these are the claims, properly tuned, set-up and run longtubes can provide just as good or at least compliant emissions test results.
It is about money... it is about the state getting its cut. Every time a company tests to satisfy the CARB or any government body, that body makes a sizable chunk of money for creating that EO. Currently, an EO is only good for a particular group of automotive applications as defined by the ARB. Every year they have the right to review and ask for additional testing and certification. This can be Thousands of dollars / applicaton / year. Are you seeing the income?
Most any ULEV motor now utilizes TWC (three way cats) and lacks the AIR and smog pumps of the past (part of two way type cat systems.) EGR's with the much more sophiticated fuel managment systems are becoming less and less necessary. These were all band-aids for passing such tests. Most have no appreciable effect on emissions past cold start...for those with skip shift, this is another band-aid for meeting emissions compliance.
Beware as EPA has been looking to adopt CA standards nationally for some time. There is lots of debate as to when but not IF.
04-15-2006, 04:22 PM
#27
TECH Senior Member
Between CARB and crappy gas (summer/winter emmisions reducing blends.... very ironic since temp. range in So. Cal. is quite narrow (doesn't get cold here), but we pay for it at the pump, $3.05 yesterday...) those gov't bodies are keeping us plebes quite miserable.
04-15-2006, 04:27 PM
#28
[QUOTE=oxidizr]Some information:
It's not about whether a LT can light off cats, its not about the location, and its not even about tailpipe compliance. While "technically" these are the claims, properly tuned, set-up and run longtubes can provide just as good or at least compliant emissions test results.
It is about money... it is about the state getting its cut. Every time a company tests to satisfy the CARB or any government body, that body makes a sizable chunk of money for creating that EO. Currently, an EO is only good for a particular group of automotive applications as defined by the ARB. Every year they have the right to review and ask for additional testing and certification. This can be Thousands of dollars / applicaton / year. Are you seeing the income?
Most any ULEV motor now utilizes TWC (three way cats) and lacks the AIR and smog pumps of the past (part of two way type cat systems.) EGR's with the much more sophiticated fuel managment systems are becoming less and less necessary. These were all band-aids for passing such tests. Most have no appreciable effect on emissions past cold start...for those with skip shift, this is another band-aid for meeting emissions compliance.
Beware as EPA has been looking to adopt CA standards nationally for some time. There is lots of debate as to when but not IF.[/QUOTE]
CA smog for everyone!
Maybe when EVERYONE has to deal with the rediculous CARB crap, there will be an uprising and we can overturn some of this crazy crap! 
It's not about whether a LT can light off cats, its not about the location, and its not even about tailpipe compliance. While "technically" these are the claims, properly tuned, set-up and run longtubes can provide just as good or at least compliant emissions test results.
It is about money... it is about the state getting its cut. Every time a company tests to satisfy the CARB or any government body, that body makes a sizable chunk of money for creating that EO. Currently, an EO is only good for a particular group of automotive applications as defined by the ARB. Every year they have the right to review and ask for additional testing and certification. This can be Thousands of dollars / applicaton / year. Are you seeing the income?
Most any ULEV motor now utilizes TWC (three way cats) and lacks the AIR and smog pumps of the past (part of two way type cat systems.) EGR's with the much more sophiticated fuel managment systems are becoming less and less necessary. These were all band-aids for passing such tests. Most have no appreciable effect on emissions past cold start...for those with skip shift, this is another band-aid for meeting emissions compliance.
Beware as EPA has been looking to adopt CA standards nationally for some time. There is lots of debate as to when but not IF.[/QUOTE]
CA smog for everyone!
Maybe when EVERYONE has to deal with the rediculous CARB crap, there will be an uprising and we can overturn some of this crazy crap! 