sapper_daddy

iTrader: (12)

Okay so I go to crank the car this morning.....
well it starts just fine but then the starter stays engaged and keeps trying to crank the engine. Even if I turn the ignition off it will still continually try to crank the car without stopping, basically it never stops turning the engine over. It is really strange, so I removed the front battery cable and then tried cranking again, same result. On the third try it worked normally. Any ideas? Maybe the relay? If there is something I can describe better or needs clarifying let me know. Thanks for reading.

Grimes

iTrader: (3)

Is it actually trying to actively crank, or is it just not disengaging?

sapper_daddy

iTrader: (12)

I don't know......it is kind weird! Okay I go to start the car and it cranks and then drops in speed and reverts to making the same sounds that the engine makes while cranking. Almost like it stops getting fuel and just keeps turing over. Did I explain that alright?

Grimes

iTrader: (3)

Humm, well im still not exactly sure what you're describing. You could swap the starter relay for another identical relay in the box, see if that helps.

My mom's car had a starter that would not disengage - it would keep riding and making a grinding sound - in that case I had to replace the starter.

sapper_daddy

iTrader: (12)

yeah I will definitely swap the relay, that is all I could think of to do
I don't know how else to describe it, accept that the issue is electrical. The Starter keeps trying to start the car after I disengage it. If I take the key all the way out it is still sending power to the starter trying to start the car (which of course won't because the fuel pump isn't running) the only way to get it to stop is to disconnect the battery.

ls1tork

take a look and see if your starter has a solenoid/plunger attached to it (i'm not sure that an ls1 actually has this). I had fords that did the exact same thing, and i had to pull the starter and replace the solenoid to fix this (the solenoid gets stuck when heavy current flows thru it forcing the starter to keep spinning, if it's worn out). the solenoid engages the starter pinion gear on to the flywheel and its supposed to retract it when the engine fires up. other than this, the starter relay would be the issue, but you already changed that.

if neither of these work, i would either look at your ignition switch or try replacing the starter.

bczee

iTrader: (12)

I would check the Starters Solenoid 1st.. it could be sticking. Take the start out, then remove the solenoid and check to see that the plunger is moving freely.

Autozone/Kragens and other will test the start and solenoid for you if your not sure.

sapper_daddy

iTrader: (12)

Okay as an update, I pulled the fuse and it would not stop turning. Then I had swapped relays and still kept turning motor over. With the relay and the fuse out all together, same thing. Somehow it is getting the full force of the battery, which cannot be good. I'm going to get under it today (wet AND cold) and check the connections, it's just weird that it would decide to do this at once so randomly. Any one got some more ideas? Thanks

sapper_daddy

iTrader: (12)

got the starter out! Seems to be alot of slack in the shaft that the gear sits on (pinion?) for instance when I turn it from back to front, it has so much slack you can feel it moving back and forth. but still what could be causing it to continually draw current and turn the engine over? Dunno, I didn't see any wires that were touching and no scorch markings to indicate a short. What you fellas think?

sapper_daddy

iTrader: (12)

Final update, the starter problem is fixed. Turned out to be the solenoid after all. So if your starter won't stop trying to start......it might be the solenoid! The only thing is I couldn't find a nice American starter and had to settle for a third world country starter that i'll be changing again in a month, 150 w/lifetime warranty and a starter that sounds like a kazoo when it spins......ziiinnnggg!

Grimes

iTrader: (3)

Haha, glad to see you got the issue worked out!

bczee

iTrader: (12)

With the GM type of starters.. your problem had to be the Solenoid sticking and holding the pinon and plunger engaged. If the starter motor is still good, why didn't you just change the Solenoid..?

sapper_daddy

iTrader: (12)

hey thanks for tuning in, I appreciate the help!

you know the motor was good and I didn't really want to purchase a new one either,
just looking at the teeth after grinding and getting stuck just those couple of times wore them quite a bit. It probably would have worked out just fine, hindsight being 20/20. The only other issue was I had made a few phone calls and only one place had a starter and I drove a good ways to get it. Then to top it off it was raining and cold. Since I parked my car on the curve, where I was stuck at was where the road was draining, so I was laying in cold moving water under the car, knowing I wouldn't have a chance to do this again (have to drive 50 mi to school tomorrow) I just pulled the stops. You are definitely right, I should have just changed the solenoid and under almost any other circumstance I would have done that.

I did put the GM starter on the test bench at orielly's and it showed all pass, but it didn't test for the return of the pinion or the wear on the teeth. I guess I should say that none of the teeth were broken and I know they have a taper to them, but i was just being a little over cautious. That being said, what auto parts chains carry AC delco, Delphi, or Denso parts regularly? I could find things like filters, wires, and tools, just not hard parts.

I was wondering though, that return spring for the pinion, that isn't but a few pounds worth of rate correct? just curious....