Stroked LS1 VS 416 LS3
I am in the same situation right now, I have full bolts and its time for mods so I looked at doing a H/C/I and realized it was not as cheap as I thought and I would be maxed out at that point with a 346 and I know for sure I want more power and tq than that. So i came across some 383 info and realized I could keep my current TB, and ls6 intake for now and still make a bit more power with the 383 than a full on 346 and then I could add FAST and bigger TB down the road and with the right cam make 475tq and over 500 rwhp with a great power curve.
After searching I saw alot of info on the 416 setup but I am afraid as much as I would want that much power I would be spreading myself then on money. What have you come up with is the price difference is between doing a 383 and a 416 setup??? and do you know what it will cost if you do the 383 to get it done and on the road?
Thanks Cody
After searching I saw alot of info on the 416 setup but I am afraid as much as I would want that much power I would be spreading myself then on money. What have you come up with is the price difference is between doing a 383 and a 416 setup??? and do you know what it will cost if you do the 383 to get it done and on the road?
Thanks Cody
The bigger bore on the LS3 block allows you to run many different heads with big valves. It doesn't matter if they are rec. or cath. type. The cath type have more intake choices. If you stick with the 383 then you limit yourself and basically your maxed out with that build.
For the oil problems you can run a improved performance pan or just there trap door assy. for a stock pan. You can also add a larger filter and a remote cooler which adds capacity. I've run a remote cooler on several builds.
The LS3 oiling problems are they on the 5th gen cars or retro builds like mine?
I've had zero issues. Ls1 cars also had oiling issues years ago. Hence the Vettes bat wing pan and then the 7 dry sump.
IMOP the added cubes win hands down every time. except in the intial cost of the build.
It just gives you more choices and added flexibility later on for upgrades.
Also how many miles on your block now. You have to look at the wear and tear on the block. I think people are going to see that the alum. blocks wear out more so then the cast iron blocks be them old school or the new type.
For the oil problems you can run a improved performance pan or just there trap door assy. for a stock pan. You can also add a larger filter and a remote cooler which adds capacity. I've run a remote cooler on several builds.
The LS3 oiling problems are they on the 5th gen cars or retro builds like mine?
I've had zero issues. Ls1 cars also had oiling issues years ago. Hence the Vettes bat wing pan and then the 7 dry sump.
IMOP the added cubes win hands down every time. except in the intial cost of the build.
It just gives you more choices and added flexibility later on for upgrades.
Also how many miles on your block now. You have to look at the wear and tear on the block. I think people are going to see that the alum. blocks wear out more so then the cast iron blocks be them old school or the new type.
FYI: Our road race Schwanke 383 LS1, 11 to 1, ported AI 243's, 600 lift cam with a Holley 750 carb made 570 Flywheel HP, 490 ish torque. Not that far off a similar 402-415. (about 30 HP less we believe). Plenty, considering we are using a 10" slick stock car tire.
Yea I have seen the 383 cars make great power and close to what some of the 400ci cars make. I am hoping I can do it for a decent price, the LS3 setups look great and make great power but you definitelty pay for it.
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Joined: Feb 2004
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From: Pinetop, AZ
Well my engine builder decided we'll just mix both. Use the LS3 block with the oil squirters. He has a free cam which I can afford and we will freshen up the already ported 241 heads, and cheapo pace setter headers and probably the existing LS6 intake and existing ported tb and I already am using a remote oil cooler.
I'm going to need a new radiator, so there is another $700 and even if I sell the ls1 parts (I've been trying to sell the complete engine with no success) there would be another $1500-$2000 with what I know and experience tells me another $500-$1000 at least on those I don't.
So...we'll have a tq monster with room to grow and my LS7 clutch and stock trans may get another couple of years use. I do accept donor parts if anyone wants to throw some cnc'd LS3 heads, Intake and matching TB my way though!
I'm going to need a new radiator, so there is another $700 and even if I sell the ls1 parts (I've been trying to sell the complete engine with no success) there would be another $1500-$2000 with what I know and experience tells me another $500-$1000 at least on those I don't.
So...we'll have a tq monster with room to grow and my LS7 clutch and stock trans may get another couple of years use. I do accept donor parts if anyone wants to throw some cnc'd LS3 heads, Intake and matching TB my way though!
My 402ci LS2 motor makes over 660hp to the flywheel on motor!!
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I don't understand why this is even a discussion...The LS3 can make more power and be more reliable than the LS1/383 any day of week. More cubes can makes more power....It really only comes down to your wallet.
I have seen many road race car, autocross, and Strip....MOST of them are running the bigger cubes.
There really isnt any comparison as to which is "better" for making power.
A stock LS3 makes 500hp!
I have seen many road race car, autocross, and Strip....MOST of them are running the bigger cubes.
There really isnt any comparison as to which is "better" for making power.
A stock LS3 makes 500hp!
Thread Starter
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Joined: Feb 2004
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From: Pinetop, AZ
Just an update-
We ended up selling the LS6 intake, cam and heads. Went with LS3 heads on the 416 as well as a as a stock LS3 intake my mech had laying around and a smaller cam then we originally talked about as it may be seeing more dd then originally anticipated.
Tuning not quite done and we are close to 500/490 at the wheels. I hope to redo the exhaust to replace the cheapo pacesetters and single stock style piping. We should end up around 515/505 rw time all is said and done. Drives like stock. Will have it at a rr event come the end of Oct.
With another 150+hp/tq over the well running cammed LS1 we should do just fine in the advanced group. Not as skippy down the straights as the 750hp bb 67 camaro, but overall I think our lap times will be real close, and a much better dd that will be able to pass gas stations without needing to go say hi.
We ended up selling the LS6 intake, cam and heads. Went with LS3 heads on the 416 as well as a as a stock LS3 intake my mech had laying around and a smaller cam then we originally talked about as it may be seeing more dd then originally anticipated.
Tuning not quite done and we are close to 500/490 at the wheels. I hope to redo the exhaust to replace the cheapo pacesetters and single stock style piping. We should end up around 515/505 rw time all is said and done. Drives like stock. Will have it at a rr event come the end of Oct.
With another 150+hp/tq over the well running cammed LS1 we should do just fine in the advanced group. Not as skippy down the straights as the 750hp bb 67 camaro, but overall I think our lap times will be real close, and a much better dd that will be able to pass gas stations without needing to go say hi.
You get tons of torque with a stroker whether its ls1 or a bigger bore LS. That being said you will have more power potential & definetly more head choices going with a 4" or larger bore. Money spent wont be that much different and if you go 383 & keep your current heads cam ect you will really only make more torque thought the low to midrange but not much more HP...but you could part out what you have now & buy ported LS3 heads & stock ported LS3 intake & stock injectors & you could save a lot over just buying new heads for your LS1. Sit down and do the math. Figure everything out for the swap. Don't forget to figure in the adapter harnesses for the injectors etc. Then compare side to side & I guarantee the 413 will be the best bang for the buck.
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Joined: Feb 2004
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From: Pinetop, AZ
One of my pet peeves is not getting info on what results from folks, so 2 years later, here are mine...
I ended up with my shop owner helping me out significantly with an LS3 based 416 build letting him select the cam and using parts he had from other builds including the LS3 block and stock LS3 intake. Eventually the engine went in my 02 camaro and redoing the exhaust to a full 3" and straight through bullet style mufflers it made 520/515 to the wheels on a mustang dyno.
Last year the car caught fire during a road race and burned enough to render it not usable though I was able to reuse the engine in an 04 Z06. Using better ARH 1 7/8" headers with hi flow cats (no cats on former car) and the stock TI axle back exhaust we ended up with 515/510, and I can definitely feel we don't have quite as much umps at the higher rpms. I dynod it with the stock TI 2.5 axle back on, unbolted it and dyno'd again and saw a 12hp gain so I'm going to install some elec cutouts on for the days I do 1/2 mile racing or if we ever get back to running a track with a long straight.
I ended up with my shop owner helping me out significantly with an LS3 based 416 build letting him select the cam and using parts he had from other builds including the LS3 block and stock LS3 intake. Eventually the engine went in my 02 camaro and redoing the exhaust to a full 3" and straight through bullet style mufflers it made 520/515 to the wheels on a mustang dyno.
Last year the car caught fire during a road race and burned enough to render it not usable though I was able to reuse the engine in an 04 Z06. Using better ARH 1 7/8" headers with hi flow cats (no cats on former car) and the stock TI axle back exhaust we ended up with 515/510, and I can definitely feel we don't have quite as much umps at the higher rpms. I dynod it with the stock TI 2.5 axle back on, unbolted it and dyno'd again and saw a 12hp gain so I'm going to install some elec cutouts on for the days I do 1/2 mile racing or if we ever get back to running a track with a long straight.
