LQ4 towing build questions
Thread Starter
Teching In
Joined: Aug 2024
Posts: 8
Likes: 3
LQ4 towing build questions Recently picked up a 06 Silverado 2500 with the 6.0 / 4l80. Just did Efans and a custom tune. Since I can’t leave anything alone I’m wanting more power. I had some options that I wanted some input on , mainly looking for more HP/TQ from idle to 4500ish rpm. This is mainly a DD / tow rig , I tow a lot in the mountains and would like to stay 87 octane or I can go 91.
option 1
SBE / LS3 heads / cam motion cam
210/216-553/553 -116+5 / tbss intake
(Any guesses on HP/TQ) ?
option 2
408 / same cam as above / ls3 heads /
tbss intake
(any guesses on HP/TQ)?
option 3
SBE / LSA
option 1
SBE / LS3 heads / cam motion cam
210/216-553/553 -116+5 / tbss intake
(Any guesses on HP/TQ) ?
option 2
408 / same cam as above / ls3 heads /
tbss intake
(any guesses on HP/TQ)?
option 3
SBE / LSA
On The Tree
Joined: Feb 2022
Posts: 196
Likes: 72
From: Grand Rapids, MI
I would avoid the LS3/rectangular heads. Cathedral heads are known to increase low speed torque.
TBSS intake would be a nice upgrade. They are known to increase power nearly everywhere.
Personally, I would not open the motor if it runs good. I would just regear and tune. You will get the most benefits from that.
If youre set on opening it up:
It currently should have 317 heads. 243 heads or 862/706 heads will help you out.
A small cam (around 210* intake duration) with at most .550 lift so you can run LS6 style single valve springs.
With 243 heads you should be alright on 87 octane, with the smaller 862/706 heads it might need some more octane.
TBSS intake would be a nice upgrade. They are known to increase power nearly everywhere.
Personally, I would not open the motor if it runs good. I would just regear and tune. You will get the most benefits from that.
If youre set on opening it up:
It currently should have 317 heads. 243 heads or 862/706 heads will help you out.
A small cam (around 210* intake duration) with at most .550 lift so you can run LS6 style single valve springs.
With 243 heads you should be alright on 87 octane, with the smaller 862/706 heads it might need some more octane.
Thread Starter
Teching In
Joined: Aug 2024
Posts: 8
Likes: 3
I would avoid the LS3/rectangular heads. Cathedral heads are known to increase low speed torque.
TBSS intake would be a nice upgrade. They are known to increase power nearly everywhere.
Personally, I would not open the motor if it runs good. I would just regear and tune. You will get the most benefits from that.
If youre set on opening it up:
It currently should have 317 heads. 243 heads or 862/706 heads will help you out.
A small cam (around 210* intake duration) with at most .550 lift so you can run LS6 style single valve springs.
With 243 heads you should be alright on 87 octane, with the smaller 862/706 heads it might need some more octane.
TBSS intake would be a nice upgrade. They are known to increase power nearly everywhere.
Personally, I would not open the motor if it runs good. I would just regear and tune. You will get the most benefits from that.
If youre set on opening it up:
It currently should have 317 heads. 243 heads or 862/706 heads will help you out.
A small cam (around 210* intake duration) with at most .550 lift so you can run LS6 style single valve springs.
With 243 heads you should be alright on 87 octane, with the smaller 862/706 heads it might need some more octane.
so if I stay SBE and do ported 243’s with the 210/216-553/553 -116+5 cam and tbss intake, what would a rough guess be for hp ? Just weight cost vs power options haha
On The Tree
Joined: Feb 2022
Posts: 196
Likes: 72
From: Grand Rapids, MI
Probably around 450 at the crankshaft. 330 wheel through heavy truck drivetrain
I would not port the heads either. Not going to need it for the type of power you're wanting. Look up Richard holdener LS cylinder head test 706 vs 243.
If you already have them or can find a set used, then go for it. Ported heads will not be worth much power at the rpm range you are targeting.
Before you touch the engine, I would switch from the stock 3.73 to 4.XX gears first.
My dad had a chevy 2500 tow rig a couple years back and all he did was tune and 4.10 gears, and it made a massive difference in acceleration and towing. Still 87 octane so cheap fuel too.
I would not port the heads either. Not going to need it for the type of power you're wanting. Look up Richard holdener LS cylinder head test 706 vs 243.
If you already have them or can find a set used, then go for it. Ported heads will not be worth much power at the rpm range you are targeting.
Before you touch the engine, I would switch from the stock 3.73 to 4.XX gears first.
My dad had a chevy 2500 tow rig a couple years back and all he did was tune and 4.10 gears, and it made a massive difference in acceleration and towing. Still 87 octane so cheap fuel too.
I did a budget truck build with the Truck Norris cam after a ton of research and back and forth in my own mind. I'm happy with it overall. It drives like stock and makes stock power/tq until 2500 RPM then really starts to take off, especially above 3k RPM. Richard Holdener made this point and I would agree. I'm not super sure why guys that want tow cams are so obsessed with tq low in the rpm range? My stock 2500 with factory 4.10s turns 2500 rpm on the highway at 70 mph. So I definitely don't need tq below that. Then with tow/haul engaged it purposefully won't shift and holds the rpm higher as that is how an engine makes power (rpm). Going up massive hills when you need the most, you're going to be at 3-4-5k rpm, not 1800. RPM is your friend when towing IMO.
Anyway sorry I got way off track. If you want to save money obviously your first scenario is the best. The 408 would be cool but that same cam shaft will be extremely tiny for it. I believe BTR just came out with a stroker torque/tow cam, I would look into that. My personal choice if you have the money would be option 3. As others mentioned I would stick with a cathedral head over LS3. It's been proven the cathedral makes more tq almost everywhere. Unless there is an issue with your current LQ motor I would do a cam, whipple/LSA, and longtubes.
Anyway sorry I got way off track. If you want to save money obviously your first scenario is the best. The 408 would be cool but that same cam shaft will be extremely tiny for it. I believe BTR just came out with a stroker torque/tow cam, I would look into that. My personal choice if you have the money would be option 3. As others mentioned I would stick with a cathedral head over LS3. It's been proven the cathedral makes more tq almost everywhere. Unless there is an issue with your current LQ motor I would do a cam, whipple/LSA, and longtubes.
TECH Resident
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 936
Likes: 472
Hands down, adding a blower to what you already have is probably the easiest way to achieve what you want. Definitely would want to run the setup on 91 octane, especially since you'll be towing up mountains.
Next best is the 408. Both 317s and 243s will flow relatively close after CNC porting. So depends on what particular stroker kit results in your compression ratio with either head.
Hopefully you're running a decent rearend gear with the 4L80E, since the gear ratios are not very low and close together. For example, if the tires are 33", you'd want at least 4.30s to 4.56s.
Next best is the 408. Both 317s and 243s will flow relatively close after CNC porting. So depends on what particular stroker kit results in your compression ratio with either head.
Hopefully you're running a decent rearend gear with the 4L80E, since the gear ratios are not very low and close together. For example, if the tires are 33", you'd want at least 4.30s to 4.56s.
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Thread Starter
Teching In
Joined: Aug 2024
Posts: 8
Likes: 3
Hands down, adding a blower to what you already have is probably the easiest way to achieve what you want. Definitely would want to run the setup on 91 octane, especially since you'll be towing up mountains.
Next best is the 408. Both 317s and 243s will flow relatively close after CNC porting. So depends on what particular stroker kit results in your compression ratio with either head.
Hopefully you're running a decent rearend gear with the 4L80E, since the gear ratios are not very low and close together. For example, if the tires are 33", you'd want at least 4.30s to 4.56s.
Next best is the 408. Both 317s and 243s will flow relatively close after CNC porting. So depends on what particular stroker kit results in your compression ratio with either head.
Hopefully you're running a decent rearend gear with the 4L80E, since the gear ratios are not very low and close together. For example, if the tires are 33", you'd want at least 4.30s to 4.56s.
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Brett Foote A turbo set up would be sweet too. When I was scouring youtube during my truck cam search I came across a video of a killer set up on a RCLB truck with a forged 408 and very nice turbo setup. I think it was on 10-12 PSI and the dude was hauling *** with a trailer with skid loader on it. It spooled crazy fast with all that load.
EDIT: I went and found it. This is such a badass set up:
EDIT: I went and found it. This is such a badass set up:
Depends on your budget I guess. Lots of bs being thrown around here and very little knowledge. I think erryone knows boost can make enough power to blow the thing completely apart. That doesn't really seem a logical go to for a tow rig imo. You also have to reject the heat from the more power being created.
I have the same truck. 03 6.0 2500hd excsb 4.10 gear.
A cam isn't really gonna help it tow. Ported heads isn't gonna help it tow.....atleast neither will help below 4k rpm.
What will help it is gear and using a oe size tire. A tune will help it get into pe mode because they have a huge delay there and there are other places on concern. Headers help low end too. Porting my intake seemed to help low end oddly enough.
If you want to make some engine changes and stay na then get compression in it. 706s or mill the hell out if some 243s, use a thinner head gasket and get the compression up to about 11:1. Cylinder pressure makes tq especially at low engine speeds.
One of the best things I've seen for low and midrange power is a cross ram style intake. Longer runners will make better low/mid tq.
I have the same truck. 03 6.0 2500hd excsb 4.10 gear.
A cam isn't really gonna help it tow. Ported heads isn't gonna help it tow.....atleast neither will help below 4k rpm.
What will help it is gear and using a oe size tire. A tune will help it get into pe mode because they have a huge delay there and there are other places on concern. Headers help low end too. Porting my intake seemed to help low end oddly enough.
If you want to make some engine changes and stay na then get compression in it. 706s or mill the hell out if some 243s, use a thinner head gasket and get the compression up to about 11:1. Cylinder pressure makes tq especially at low engine speeds.
One of the best things I've seen for low and midrange power is a cross ram style intake. Longer runners will make better low/mid tq.
But to the OP I would look at getting the tightest LSA cam you can find to bring the power in sooner.
Every dyno I have ever seen shows the tighter LSA with same duration making power sooner.
That's because you did the right thing and added compression with the 799 heads. Which will help low engine speed tq more than the cam.....but atleast you didn't hurt low engine speeds with just the cam.
Have you ever dragged the truck?
Have you ever dragged the truck?
I haven't taken it to the track but I did some runs with my draggy, it is almost 2 seconds faster than stock in 1/4 mile. Also towing is night and day difference.
I dunno, my 2500 6.0 4.10 truck pulls fantastic in the 2500-3500 range with the "truck norris" cam, I also added 799 heads to add a little compression, and longtube headers at the same time.
But to the OP I would look at getting the tightest LSA cam you can find to bring the power in sooner.
Every dyno I have ever seen shows the tighter LSA with same duration making power sooner.
But to the OP I would look at getting the tightest LSA cam you can find to bring the power in sooner.
Every dyno I have ever seen shows the tighter LSA with same duration making power sooner.
I had mine on 93 but decided to yank some timing at run 87.... even on 87 I only had to pull 3 degrees , I actually only had knock running 87 while at high load around 2000rpm so with the converter locked, I pulled a couple more degrees there. My compression should be about 10.3 or 10.4-1
Thread Starter
Teching In
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I had mine on 93 but decided to yank some timing at run 87.... even on 87 I only had to pull 3 degrees , I actually only had knock running 87 while at high load around 2000rpm so with the converter locked, I pulled a couple more degrees there. My compression should be about 10.3 or 10.4-1
TBSS manifold, 706 heads, Headers, SPDC LS6 power max cam. My 4wd Yukon made 322/313 with this setup on a 5.3. baselined 239/269.
It would idle dead smooth on a 6.0. you could probably do a 212/218 on a 112 if you want a little bit of lope, but it might lose some low end without that 107-108lsa that the Norris, Choppa, Low buck truck cams have to bring the power in earlier. I think it would still be solid with the 2500 stall and more compression.
706 heads make more low speed torque than any other cathedral in stock form. Holdner tested them. 799 made a little more hp up top, 706 made more under 5k rpm.
Not sure if you will be able to get away with 87 with a compression bump. If you can find that 88 E15 blend it would for sure.
It would idle dead smooth on a 6.0. you could probably do a 212/218 on a 112 if you want a little bit of lope, but it might lose some low end without that 107-108lsa that the Norris, Choppa, Low buck truck cams have to bring the power in earlier. I think it would still be solid with the 2500 stall and more compression.
706 heads make more low speed torque than any other cathedral in stock form. Holdner tested them. 799 made a little more hp up top, 706 made more under 5k rpm.
Not sure if you will be able to get away with 87 with a compression bump. If you can find that 88 E15 blend it would for sure.
Thread Starter
Teching In
Joined: Aug 2024
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TBSS manifold, 706 heads, Headers, SPDC LS6 power max cam. My 4wd Yukon made 322/313 with this setup on a 5.3. baselined 239/269.
It would idle dead smooth on a 6.0. you could probably do a 212/218 on a 112 if you want a little bit of lope, but it might lose some low end without that 107-108lsa that the Norris, Choppa, Low buck truck cams have to bring the power in earlier. I think it would still be solid with the 2500 stall and more compression.
706 heads make more low speed torque than any other cathedral in stock form. Holdner tested them. 799 made a little more hp up top, 706 made more under 5k rpm.
Not sure if you will be able to get away with 87 with a compression bump. If you can find that 88 E15 blend it would for sure.
It would idle dead smooth on a 6.0. you could probably do a 212/218 on a 112 if you want a little bit of lope, but it might lose some low end without that 107-108lsa that the Norris, Choppa, Low buck truck cams have to bring the power in earlier. I think it would still be solid with the 2500 stall and more compression.
706 heads make more low speed torque than any other cathedral in stock form. Holdner tested them. 799 made a little more hp up top, 706 made more under 5k rpm.
Not sure if you will be able to get away with 87 with a compression bump. If you can find that 88 E15 blend it would for sure.
High-Lift" Version:
Grind # XA210/325-XA216/325-16+5
Duration at.050 - 210/216
Lift with 1.7 - .553/.553
Lobe separation 116
Intake center line 111
some numbers would have been nice. That's about the only way for a comparison. My 2500hd ran 15.2@93 with some bolt ons. Headers, udp, cai, efans, ported tb and intake. That was on 87 octane and 285/70 17 hummer wheels which are heavy af. That's no "power" tuning. Just some of the tm/pe delay out of it.
it to tows and runs night and day better than stock. When it was bonestock it ran 16.1@86 but that was at the dragstrip. Although a draggy is dead on. Hard numbers tell the tale.