What's 'wrong' with patriot heads?
Teching In
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 31
Likes: 0
From: Ontario Canada
I own a set of pp stage 2 5.3 heads. I got gold springs but teflon seals.
When i bought mine from ls1speed took them to a local machine shop and had them milled and new seals installed. I got them back and did a clean up on the intake port floor and side walls. I left the bowls alone and the entire exhaust. The port floors on each intake had a small chunk taken out by the cnc machine. It looked to me like the cnc makes this mark as it enters or exits the port. I filled this with jb weld. I then added a coating to the intake, exhaust and cc chamber.
When i bought mine the next closest head was around 2 grand.I might if spent 1400 total even with all the extra work.
Am i happy with my pp stage 2 heads? YOU BET!!!!
With a mti stealth 2 and a tsp tune it runs sweet!
If i were in the market today the only thing i might of done different is buy the ferrara valves.
I have 3000 miles on them now no problems at all. Just smiles.
I feel bad for anyone who loses a motor and feels its because of off shore parts.
I also feel bad for myself. Why? Well because if i try to sell these their resale sucks. Every time someone post bad about pp heads i might be losing money.
I do not believe everything i read on the internet. Nor do i believe that all the threads about bad pp products were pp parts fault. I think its also bad installs!
When i bought mine from ls1speed took them to a local machine shop and had them milled and new seals installed. I got them back and did a clean up on the intake port floor and side walls. I left the bowls alone and the entire exhaust. The port floors on each intake had a small chunk taken out by the cnc machine. It looked to me like the cnc makes this mark as it enters or exits the port. I filled this with jb weld. I then added a coating to the intake, exhaust and cc chamber.
When i bought mine the next closest head was around 2 grand.I might if spent 1400 total even with all the extra work.
Am i happy with my pp stage 2 heads? YOU BET!!!!
With a mti stealth 2 and a tsp tune it runs sweet!
If i were in the market today the only thing i might of done different is buy the ferrara valves.
I have 3000 miles on them now no problems at all. Just smiles.
I feel bad for anyone who loses a motor and feels its because of off shore parts.
I also feel bad for myself. Why? Well because if i try to sell these their resale sucks. Every time someone post bad about pp heads i might be losing money.
I do not believe everything i read on the internet. Nor do i believe that all the threads about bad pp products were pp parts fault. I think its also bad installs!
On The Tree
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 162
Likes: 0
I have PP LS6 stage III heads on my 430 stroker and love them, Heads are like the differance between a 400.00 or a 1000.00 hooker. The 1000.00 one may look better and say they can do things better than the 400.00 hooker can't. But the end result is pretty much the same, so why pay more.
TECH Senior Member
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 14,620
Likes: 17
From: BFE
Heads are like the differance between a 400.00 or a 1000.00 hooker. The 1000.00 one may look better and say they can do things better than the 400.00 hooker can't. But the end result is pretty much the same, so why pay more.
Staging Lane
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 50
Likes: 0
From: Elkins Park, PA
Think of it this way, with the 1000.00 hooker, you can take her home to mommy and she will think she is the sweetest girl, and with the 400.00 one you can take her to the doc because your dick just fell off....
Or think of it this way, just screw your wife and put the $400.00 to $1000.00 into better heads!!
Or think of it this way, just screw your wife and put the $400.00 to $1000.00 into better heads!!
Think of it this way, with the 1000.00 hooker, you can take her home to mommy and she will think she is the sweetest girl, and with the 400.00 one you can take her to the doc because your dick just fell off....
Or think of it this way, just screw your wife and put the $400.00 to $1000.00 into better heads!!
except i would put the money into something else and keep patriot's head's I wouldn't let patriot port Heads even if it was for my lawnmower, and it was free, and I got a $1000.00 asian hooker out of it!
However, I would like to see what someone could do with their 6.0 Casting with the chambers welded up. I think that is a good idea for people on a "Budget" Too bad really really good hand porting is in the $1500-2000 area
However, I would like to see what someone could do with their 6.0 Casting with the chambers welded up. I think that is a good idea for people on a "Budget" Too bad really really good hand porting is in the $1500-2000 area
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Teching In
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 5
Likes: 0
From: Maysville KY.
Originally Posted by PREDATOR-Z
They have no choice after all the disasters their "quality" caused. How do you think they are able to sell these so cheap?? That is because they use cheap parts and mass produce them. Just tell me how you can achieve quality control on mass production? by hiring quality inspectors, which cost money and would raise the price.
PP heads are like a crap shoot, some are good and some are not.
What is the point in buying cheap heads, have them upgraded, checked by other vendors or mechs, you'll end up paying close to what a good set would cost.
Honestly, would you rely on a $2 valve to hold its own with a $4000 block? I know I wouldn't.
You get what you pay for period.
PP heads are like a crap shoot, some are good and some are not.
What is the point in buying cheap heads, have them upgraded, checked by other vendors or mechs, you'll end up paying close to what a good set would cost.
Honestly, would you rely on a $2 valve to hold its own with a $4000 block? I know I wouldn't.
You get what you pay for period.
Patriot has stood behind their heads 100%, that is true. They will happily replace a set that fails. The problem has been when they drop a valve it screws the block, and they are not helping on that. A little while go they had a ridiculous post offering a 10% discount to anyone who dynos good numbers with their packages, but they are not doing nything to help the guys who don't make those #'s. I am planning H/C soon, I have extensively researched every purchase for my car. I am not planning on buying Patriot, not matter what I hve to pay for the other guys.
Ed
(another Ed from EDC
)
Ed
(another Ed from EDC
) 
I've had Patriot 5.3's on my car for almost a year now. Granted I don't drive it much, but I've been happy with the power they produce. If I were to do itall over I would get the upgraded valves and LS6 style heads. You can't please everyone. That's what happens when u mod your car. If you don't want stuff to break leave it stock.
Originally Posted by MUSTANGEATER
I wouldn't let patriot port Heads even if it was for my lawnmower, and it was free, and I got a $1000.00 asian hooker out of it!
However, I would like to see what someone could do with their 6.0 Casting with the chambers welded up. I think that is a good idea for people on a "Budget" Too bad really really good hand porting is in the $1500-2000 area
However, I would like to see what someone could do with their 6.0 Casting with the chambers welded up. I think that is a good idea for people on a "Budget" Too bad really really good hand porting is in the $1500-2000 area
Launching!
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 272
Likes: 0
From: Cincinnati, Ohio
Mustangeater is getting called out... lol I say take him up on the race, granny shift it, wait for him to drop a valve, and double-honk the horn as you roll past. Don't hit his anti-freeze puddle though, you could hydroplane and crash.
everyone keeps mentioning "dropping a valve"
I have also seen it mentioned that the first generation of springs used weren't up to par, but the new ones are much better. Why does this keep being brought up then? Are they inferior locks or retainers then? If the springs are good, there's no other reason to drop a valve unless the locks are bad. And in that case, what does it have to do with the heads performance?
I have also seen it mentioned that the first generation of springs used weren't up to par, but the new ones are much better. Why does this keep being brought up then? Are they inferior locks or retainers then? If the springs are good, there's no other reason to drop a valve unless the locks are bad. And in that case, what does it have to do with the heads performance?
i have a set of pp stage 2 but terry hand finished them,overall i am pleased with the heads espically since they have stock compression.im happy running 1170s with stock 323 gears and mac headers
TECH Resident
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 848
Likes: 1
From: Working in the shop 24/7
Originally Posted by Timberwolf
everyone keeps mentioning "dropping a valve"
I have also seen it mentioned that the first generation of springs used weren't up to par, but the new ones are much better. Why does this keep being brought up then? Are they inferior locks or retainers then? If the springs are good, there's no other reason to drop a valve unless the locks are bad. And in that case, what does it have to do with the heads performance?
I have also seen it mentioned that the first generation of springs used weren't up to par, but the new ones are much better. Why does this keep being brought up then? Are they inferior locks or retainers then? If the springs are good, there's no other reason to drop a valve unless the locks are bad. And in that case, what does it have to do with the heads performance?
Not bad locks but bad "valves"...
l've seen a "choice" valve lock fracture because the valves were not to print...
That is like blaming the fuse for an electrical problem!
Ed
well that's why I was asking. there's nothing on the head itself that could make it drop a valve, so the heads aren't really at fault, it's the valve train.
Has anything been done to address the valve QC issue?
And it's not really like blaming a fuse for an electrical problem. The valve lock functions really NOTHING like a fuse. It's not there as a weak link to prevent damage like a fuse is in your example. If it fails, it CAUSES the damage. It was a legit question.
Has anything been done to address the valve QC issue?
And it's not really like blaming a fuse for an electrical problem. The valve lock functions really NOTHING like a fuse. It's not there as a weak link to prevent damage like a fuse is in your example. If it fails, it CAUSES the damage. It was a legit question.
We have a set of patriot heads on our 427 C5R. We are working on the car right now but lets just say the first run made within 50 HP of our "street" 346ci turbo car that has a 6 speed. The 427 turbo car has a TH400 and is just running on 13 psi.