A Strange Metallic Sound?
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From: Rochester, NY
Unfortunetly, I dont have a scanner.
At the time the car was DynoTuned, the Air/Fuel Ratio was around:
12.75 at 5500 rmps
13.00 at 4000
13.25 at 3000
14.00 at 2500
14.75 from 0-2400
I'm told what I'm experiencing is Light Throttle Detonation.
More thougts to note:
Engine is pinging, under 2000 rpms.
When I start applying more throttle it starts pinging.
I guess you'd call this lugging it - huh?
Once you increase throttle enough it seems to go away.
The engine block only has 2,500 miles on it, so I seriously doubt there is carbon build up.
I've lowered the fans some more, to no avail.
Just now, I've removed the 18mm plugs from the rear 02 bungs, and replaced the original rear 02 sensors (the rears are deleted in the PCM). But I did not notice any black marks, so it doesnt seem like they were leaking fumes.
I also just put a bottle of Lucas Injector cleaner into the gas tank, 1/2 tank.
Friend things its the oil going into the manifold.
So, a catch can is on order to eliminate that problem.
hhhmmmm......
Any other thoughts?
At the time the car was DynoTuned, the Air/Fuel Ratio was around:
12.75 at 5500 rmps
13.00 at 4000
13.25 at 3000
14.00 at 2500
14.75 from 0-2400
I'm told what I'm experiencing is Light Throttle Detonation.
More thougts to note:
Engine is pinging, under 2000 rpms.
When I start applying more throttle it starts pinging.
I guess you'd call this lugging it - huh?
Once you increase throttle enough it seems to go away.
The engine block only has 2,500 miles on it, so I seriously doubt there is carbon build up.
I've lowered the fans some more, to no avail.
Just now, I've removed the 18mm plugs from the rear 02 bungs, and replaced the original rear 02 sensors (the rears are deleted in the PCM). But I did not notice any black marks, so it doesnt seem like they were leaking fumes.
I also just put a bottle of Lucas Injector cleaner into the gas tank, 1/2 tank.
Friend things its the oil going into the manifold.
So, a catch can is on order to eliminate that problem.
hhhmmmm......
Any other thoughts?
pull the TB and look in the intake, u would detonate at wot if that were the case i would think. what gear do you normally notice this in and about what % throttle??? i really think its a tuning problem, esp if your plugs and wires are all ok and you arent consuming any oil
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From: Rochester, NY
There is defiently some oil in the manifold and TB, which is why I'll be installing the catch can fix as soon as it arrives. I am using some oil, im told its normal, about 3/4 quart for 2000 miles. Remember the engine only has 2500 miles on it, so the rings could still be breaking in, and the oil going into the tb/manifold also drops it down some.
The ping can happen at any gear, any speed. Its when minimal gas is applied, that will make it ping or knock.
For example:
Sitting there at a dead stop, just as I start to apply gas (and release the clutch) it'll ping, then go away once i give it more juice.
or, I can be driving along at 60mph, with the cruise control on, sixth gear. When the cruise applies some gas to maintain speed, boom, i can hear the ping.
It seems if I keep the rpms above 2000, it wont ping....so, if I'm crusing along at 60 in 5th gear, i dont find it having a problem pinging. From a dead stop, if I gas is harder (more tricky to do), its not likely to ping either.
If its tuning, what do I need to get done?
Drop some timing...but from where?
Also, I'm still dont understand why the pinging is getting more frequent?
Initally, I only heard it from a dead stop, but as the 2 weeks have gone by, its more frequent, like i described above.
Is the computer 'learning' something...and messing up the dynotune?
------------------
pull the TB and look in the intake, u would detonate at wot if that were the case i would think. what gear do you normally notice this in and about what % throttle??? i really think its a tuning problem, esp if your plugs and wires are all ok and you arent consuming any oil
The ping can happen at any gear, any speed. Its when minimal gas is applied, that will make it ping or knock.
For example:
Sitting there at a dead stop, just as I start to apply gas (and release the clutch) it'll ping, then go away once i give it more juice.
or, I can be driving along at 60mph, with the cruise control on, sixth gear. When the cruise applies some gas to maintain speed, boom, i can hear the ping.
It seems if I keep the rpms above 2000, it wont ping....so, if I'm crusing along at 60 in 5th gear, i dont find it having a problem pinging. From a dead stop, if I gas is harder (more tricky to do), its not likely to ping either.
If its tuning, what do I need to get done?
Drop some timing...but from where?
Also, I'm still dont understand why the pinging is getting more frequent?
Initally, I only heard it from a dead stop, but as the 2 weeks have gone by, its more frequent, like i described above.
Is the computer 'learning' something...and messing up the dynotune?
------------------
pull the TB and look in the intake, u would detonate at wot if that were the case i would think. what gear do you normally notice this in and about what % throttle??? i really think its a tuning problem, esp if your plugs and wires are all ok and you arent consuming any oil
if its getting worse i would think that it would have to be something to get worse. could be oil consumption, my gf's car is the same way its a pain in the ***, it burns oil and at light throttle it will knock. u could have some rings not seating well, her car eats about 3/4 a quart of oil every 1000 miles or so. if u are burning oil at a considerable rate, the oil can cause the cyl to misfire, this could be checked out pretty easy with a logger and test for misfires on cyls.
Last edited by WS6FirebirdTA00; May 18, 2005 at 08:58 PM.
Thread Starter
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From: Rochester, NY
Last night I popped out the rear o2 plugs, hoping there was a leak or something...I didnt see any black marks, but I restored the holes with the original o2 sensors, nice and tight.
I was pretty excited this morning, when driving out to work, for I didnt hear any ping, at slow speeds, nor higher, lugging it or not.
Tho, as I approached work, about 20 min drive, i started to hear 'some' ping, very light, very little.
But at lunch time, the ping seemed to be back to normal!
arg!
I'm guessing engine temp is relating to the problem.
I hear that wet wetter in the coolant will cool things down?
I'm still waiting on the catch can, hopefully by the weekend.
I was pretty excited this morning, when driving out to work, for I didnt hear any ping, at slow speeds, nor higher, lugging it or not.
Tho, as I approached work, about 20 min drive, i started to hear 'some' ping, very light, very little.
But at lunch time, the ping seemed to be back to normal!
arg!
I'm guessing engine temp is relating to the problem.
I hear that wet wetter in the coolant will cool things down?
I'm still waiting on the catch can, hopefully by the weekend.
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From: Rochester, NY
The temp gauge in the cluster is just below the mid point...just below 110, i believe.
It was 68degrees yesterday and 67 today. I dont know what the temp outside was this morning.
cooler plugs? couldnt hurt.
---------------
how high does your temp get to? you may need to run cooler plugs, whats the air temp??
It was 68degrees yesterday and 67 today. I dont know what the temp outside was this morning.
cooler plugs? couldnt hurt.
---------------
how high does your temp get to? you may need to run cooler plugs, whats the air temp??
Thread Starter
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From: Rochester, NY
Ok, the plugs are a good idea.
but 1st, this weekend, i'm doing 2 things:
1. install 160stat,
2. install the AMW catch can, and clean out the oil in my manifold.
we'll see what that does for my setup...whew...
but 1st, this weekend, i'm doing 2 things:
1. install 160stat,
2. install the AMW catch can, and clean out the oil in my manifold.
we'll see what that does for my setup...whew...
Thread Starter
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From: Rochester, NY
Ok, the 160 stat is in, and fans are turned down to match.
I also did the TB coolant by-pass, just to make the air that much cooler going in.
And finally, the catch can is in. Given about a week, I think should be enough time for the oil in the manifold to blow through.
Crossing fingers, we'll see how it goes.
I also did the TB coolant by-pass, just to make the air that much cooler going in.
And finally, the catch can is in. Given about a week, I think should be enough time for the oil in the manifold to blow through.
Crossing fingers, we'll see how it goes.
Staging Lane
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 55
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From: Verdigris, Ok
I have the same problem. But I don't think it is internal. I'm thinking tensioner pully. It only does it if I barely press the gas and have it in gear. Since it only makes that sound when the engine is kinda shaking I have to put my money on the pully.
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From: Rochester, NY
Originally Posted by FearLS1
I have the same problem. But I don't think it is internal. I'm thinking tensioner pully. It only does it if I barely press the gas and have it in gear. Since it only makes that sound when the engine is kinda shaking I have to put my money on the pully.
btw, you've described the condition of the sound perfectly:
> It only does it if I barely press the gas and have it in gear.
That exactly how it happens.
--------
Update: Just ordered a new Adj Tensioner Pulley from TR.
Should have it by the end of the week, and installed on Sat.
Will let you know more then.
Last edited by Michael02hawk; Oct 17, 2005 at 10:43 AM.
