PRC Heads and MS4 Are In *Pics and Vid*
I see no way that it could fit with proper clearance without flycutting. I only base that upon the fact that the MS4 is a lot bigger in duration with a lower LSA than the G5X3, and the G5X3 on a 112 just meets the minimal recommended clearance.
I don't know if sinking the valves helps much, after I remembered this excerpt from a post:
Do you think that means that sinking the valves hurts performance?
I don't know if sinking the valves helps much, after I remembered this excerpt from a post:
Originally Posted by Jason 98 TA
Termin8tr's heads have the valves sunk about .012" more than the typical Terminator heads. If anything this only hurts the cylinder heads performance.
Nope no flycutting. The LS6 heads do not reaquire it. Thats why I only went with the Stg 1 and no other head from TSP. All the other heads would require. TSP had also stated that on many of their threads that this particular package does not require fly cutting. The total cost of the heads and cam was about $1600. I had a few bells and whistles added to that. Ill get it to the track but it will be on street tires, 19s at that.
Right, but how does it not require flycutting?
Let me clarify: how does it not require flycutting when milled for proper compression and maintaining the best flow by not sinking the valves (since that post indicates that sinking valves hurts performance)?
And what is your PTV clearance when installed with proper timing advance?
Let me clarify: how does it not require flycutting when milled for proper compression and maintaining the best flow by not sinking the valves (since that post indicates that sinking valves hurts performance)?
And what is your PTV clearance when installed with proper timing advance?
Last edited by N4cer; Dec 13, 2006 at 09:18 PM.
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Verdad Gallardo Well for one the heads are not milled. The Stg 1 PRC heads only get a port job and thats it. Now if I were to mill it would require flycutting. I dont know anything about sinking valves because my heads do not have that. I dont know what theactual clearance is by TSP made that cam to fit under unmilled GM heads and thats what I liked and thats one of the reasons I got it.
You left stock compression? So what's your DCR? Surely you planned for proper SCR and therefore, DCR, right?
You didn't get the measurements from them? That info is important, man! If your clearance is lower than recommended, you gotta set your rev limiter low. Surely lower than the MS4 needs to get you the best HP and best shift points.
You don't know how much advance is on the cam either?
This is kinda important info when building a motor if you want the best performance. You don't just stick a cam and heads together and BAM there ya go. You gotta plan for proper compression ratios and RPMs, and make it all work together.
Get that info so you'll know how your car should be setup bro. Also you could really help the community if you had the all-important measurements. It just doesn't make sense to not mill the heads, or that the MS4 clears with proper clearance since it's bigger with less LSA than a cam that just meets the suggested clearances by like .003".
You didn't get the measurements from them? That info is important, man! If your clearance is lower than recommended, you gotta set your rev limiter low. Surely lower than the MS4 needs to get you the best HP and best shift points.
You don't know how much advance is on the cam either?
This is kinda important info when building a motor if you want the best performance. You don't just stick a cam and heads together and BAM there ya go. You gotta plan for proper compression ratios and RPMs, and make it all work together.
Get that info so you'll know how your car should be setup bro. Also you could really help the community if you had the all-important measurements. It just doesn't make sense to not mill the heads, or that the MS4 clears with proper clearance since it's bigger with less LSA than a cam that just meets the suggested clearances by like .003".
I mean, you could theoretically make the cam fit with suggested clearances, but you'd have to install it in retard (as opposed to advance, not Corky style) and lose a significant amount of low end and it would rev to the moon before peaking. Could that be the problem?
That's what I'm saying. So your cam is installed with 4 degrees of mechanical retard? That gives up power in the usable powerband. Unless you're revving it out to about 7500rpm.
Its installed 111LSA straight up. This buildup that I did was not supposed to be the ultimate setup. This was a budget setup. I did not mill the heads for extra compression because I did not want to flycut. I know that leaves power on the table but unless you build a max effort engine, your always leaving power on the table. There are many people running the LS6/MS4 or MS3 or any of the other TSP cams and I dont understand why Im getting drilled. I did all the research and all the calculations. If I was planning for a particular SCR and DCR then I would have done a custom grind. I did not want to do that. I heard a lot of info from the MS4 and it sounded like a great cam and guess what, it is a great off the shelf grind cam. The specs for my setup are not top secret and are easily gotten. Many people are running these heads. Also the compression is stock for LS6 heads. The compression is dropped by goingt o those heads from LS1 heads. I dont know how many times I have to say that this cam fits under LS1/6 heads WITHOUT FLYCUTTING. There are many poeple running this cam and they will all tell you the same thing. I wish one of them would step in here. Hell TSP will tell you that.
Oh4GTO is right you don't have to FLYCUT with this cam if you would read the info from them N4cer you would know this. I ordered the cam from them and am just waiting to get money for the stage 1 heads also so that I can put them in my 99 camaro. By the way Oh4GTO I love the way your car sounds I can't wait to get mine done but it will be at least 3 weeks
Originally Posted by Oh4GTO
Its installed 111LSA straight up. This buildup that I did was not supposed to be the ultimate setup. This was a budget setup. I did not mill the heads for extra compression because I did not want to flycut. I know that leaves power on the table but unless you build a max effort engine, your always leaving power on the table. There are many people running the LS6/MS4 or MS3 or any of the other TSP cams and I dont understand why Im getting drilled. I did all the research and all the calculations. If I was planning for a particular SCR and DCR then I would have done a custom grind. I did not want to do that. I heard a lot of info from the MS4 and it sounded like a great cam and guess what, it is a great off the shelf grind cam. The specs for my setup are not top secret and are easily gotten. Many people are running these heads. Also the compression is stock for LS6 heads. The compression is dropped by goingt o those heads from LS1 heads. I dont know how many times I have to say that this cam fits under LS1/6 heads WITHOUT FLYCUTTING. There are many poeple running this cam and they will all tell you the same thing. I wish one of them would step in here. Hell TSP will tell you that.
I think you should save up until you want to go faster again, if you haven't already, and go for a N2O shot fly cut the pistons (it's not that hard to do, but I can't the write up) and get the heads milled as much as you can without effecting intake manifold fitment.
I'm not trying to down on your set-up, sounds bad *** and you're happy. Now go get some track times
AJ