My VA Speed Engine Build
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 8,484
Likes: 0
From: Cecil County Raceway!!!
I have only broke them on one loaded street engine and multiple road race engines. The road race engines all had broken transmissions that drove the rpm down except one where they were short shifting because of second place being one lap down. The cranks were 90% Callies Magnum or Magnum XL with a few cast stock stroke cranks in early engines. In the beginning we ran without the damper between the gears as they deleted that on the original engines in 1996 before the production engines started flowing. The original chain damper was steel with clip on shoes that touched the chain to stop whip, the bean counters deleted it when the engine passed durability without it. Lucky for us the pad was still on the blocks and tapped holes were provided since the blocks were already in production for the C5 to release in 97 with the new engine. Without the damper between the gears the chains life was very short in the low power band. Once we changed the ATI rings the problem was gone no matter what rpm band they used.
Kurt
Kurt
It's weird because I have yet to see a chain break ever even in all the rod racing and open track stuff we've done in 10 years? That's with any dampers as well. Never had one go on a drag race deal either?
Were these on deals with stock stroke cranks or with the 4.000 type aftermarket cranks Kurt?
Were these on deals with stock stroke cranks or with the 4.000 type aftermarket cranks Kurt?
FormerVendor
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 3,065
Likes: 6
From: Houston, Tx.
I have only broke them on one loaded street engine and multiple road race engines. The road race engines all had broken transmissions that drove the rpm down except one where they were short shifting because of second place being one lap down. The cranks were 90% Callies Magnum or Magnum XL with a few cast stock stroke cranks in early engines. In the beginning we ran without the damper between the gears as they deleted that on the original engines in 1996 before the production engines started flowing. The original chain damper was steel with clip on shoes that touched the chain to stop whip, the bean counters deleted it when the engine passed durability without it. Lucky for us the pad was still on the blocks and tapped holes were provided since the blocks were already in production for the C5 to release in 97 with the new engine. Without the damper between the gears the chains life was very short in the low power band. Once we changed the ATI rings the problem was gone no matter what rpm band they used.
Kurt
Kurt
I've seen high speed photography of some crank snouts moving over .100 at 7500-7800 rpm on some cranks and they would throw dry sump belts all the time and it sure couldn't have been good for the timing system either !
I think a track day car is likely to stop if the trans gets hurt, something that was not an option for guys in a three hour race!
You will run across cars with lock up converters that will lock them and drive into the bad zone under power, my truck fits that mold. GM and ATI did help us back then with the problem, the result was the chain damper finding it's way back into production cars and ATI making the "44" crank damper for this type of use. The drawback is the "44" damper needs to be rebuilt more often because of the softer durometer rings. I did notice the acc belt would also jump ribs if you kept driving into the zone, this was cured with guides added on the spring loaded pulley.
Ed, the damage I would see was the rollers loose and the links would be stiff in sections before the failure.
Kurt
You will run across cars with lock up converters that will lock them and drive into the bad zone under power, my truck fits that mold. GM and ATI did help us back then with the problem, the result was the chain damper finding it's way back into production cars and ATI making the "44" crank damper for this type of use. The drawback is the "44" damper needs to be rebuilt more often because of the softer durometer rings. I did notice the acc belt would also jump ribs if you kept driving into the zone, this was cured with guides added on the spring loaded pulley.
Ed, the damage I would see was the rollers loose and the links would be stiff in sections before the failure.
Kurt
Thanks Kurt because I do some engines like this and that info is very good to have. It could just be the customers we have are not lugging the engines the same and have a different driving style as compared to the tracks they run. It's such a small cross section that different guys may have the chains in trouble or these same guys at say a different track may then get into that band.
I've seen high speed photography of some crank snouts moving over .100 at 7500-7800 rpm on some cranks and they would throw dry sump belts all the time and it sure couldn't have been good for the timing system either !
I've seen high speed photography of some crank snouts moving over .100 at 7500-7800 rpm on some cranks and they would throw dry sump belts all the time and it sure couldn't have been good for the timing system either !
Got the servo late today,got to finish the one on the dynoup in the morn,should have yours on in the afternoon.we'll get it broken in tomorrow,power pulls on thursday.i'll have some more pics up shortly.
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I thought it was already on the dyno since you said something about it being on the dyno cart last week. Guess what is one more day as long as it arrives at my door by next Friday. Wanting to install it next weekend.
What spark plugs should I use for this motor?
Should be 525-550whp through an auto. Will have a 150-200 shot.
I don't want to have to change plugs to spray it.
Also what weight oil should I use?
Should be 525-550whp through an auto. Will have a 150-200 shot.
I don't want to have to change plugs to spray it.
Also what weight oil should I use?
Last edited by 6.0monsta; Mar 31, 2010 at 08:11 AM.
Teching In
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 13
Likes: 0
Dude-stop being a little bitch.first you whine about guys taking about timing chains then you cry that Shawn isn't posting in your thread and at the same time cry its not getting done fast enough.which do you want-posts or an engine.I'm sure Virginia speed has more customers than just you.
Dude-stop being a little bitch.first you whine about guys taking about timing chains then you cry that Shawn isn't posting in your thread and at the same time cry its not getting done fast enough.which do you want-posts or an engine.I'm sure Virginia speed has more customers than just you.
In any event I'm not whining. If anyone is whining it's you whining about people whining. I made comments about Shawn not posting in my thread because I've asked questions that weren't answered trying to get his attention. He has posted countless times in Kevin's thread so believe me I know I'm not the only customer.
Don't make this into a bashing thread. I'm just anxious, nothing more, nothing less.
Dude-stop being a little bitch.first you whine about guys taking about timing chains then you cry that Shawn isn't posting in your thread and at the same time cry its not getting done fast enough.which do you want-posts or an engine.I'm sure Virginia speed has more customers than just you.
Did you just sign up to post that Mr. 4 posts? The thread was for Shawn to provide updates about THIS build, not timing chain 101. Make a new thread for that. I'm anxious to get my car going again. Don't see how that's whining.
In any event I'm not whining. If anyone is whining it's you whining about people whining. I made comments about Shawn not posting in my thread because I've asked questions that weren't answered trying to get his attention. He has posted countless times in Kevin's thread so believe me I know I'm not the only customer.
Don't make this into a bashing thread. I'm just anxious, nothing more, nothing less.
In any event I'm not whining. If anyone is whining it's you whining about people whining. I made comments about Shawn not posting in my thread because I've asked questions that weren't answered trying to get his attention. He has posted countless times in Kevin's thread so believe me I know I'm not the only customer.
Don't make this into a bashing thread. I'm just anxious, nothing more, nothing less.
Any guesses on HP?
Kevin's motor did 656/614 with L92 worked over heads and a smaller cam and larger intake. This will have off the shelf TFS235 heads with a little bit larger cam and smaller intake.
Kevin's motor did 656/614 with L92 worked over heads and a smaller cam and larger intake. This will have off the shelf TFS235 heads with a little bit larger cam and smaller intake.
we opened up the chambers to the 4.125 bore to unshroud the valves some,we also did some exhaust work.Should help on the big motor.
Last edited by Shawn @ VA Speed; Apr 1, 2010 at 10:47 AM.
