ls3 timing chain tensioner problem
05-13-2017, 03:05 PM
#1
Staging Lane
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ls3 timing chain tensioner problem 
edit: added a few pictures.
I found the spring from the stock LS3 tensioner in the oil pan today!
now what?? Take it all apart and fix or take my chances? Do I need a tensioner? I don't remember a tensioner on my old LS6...
it's a built LS3 with LS2 chain, 3 bolt cam gear and ATI Damper. Road race car with limiter set at 6 500 rpm.
thanks
Last edited by Z06VENOM; 05-19-2017 at 10:16 AM. Reason: adding pictures
05-13-2017, 07:51 PM
#3
Staging Lane
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Yes, that curved thing. Pretty sure the tensioner is broken completely.
The car runs fine, over 3 seasons now. I took the pan off to add trap doors and noticed it.
Just wondering how come my LS6 ran great for a long time without ant tensioner...
Why do we need this on the LS3 and not the LS6?
The car runs fine, over 3 seasons now. I took the pan off to add trap doors and noticed it.
Just wondering how come my LS6 ran great for a long time without ant tensioner...
Why do we need this on the LS3 and not the LS6?
05-14-2017, 02:59 AM
#4
I would go ahead and take the time to pull the front cover and check the tensioner's remaining pieces. There are 2 bolts holding what is left of the tensioner behind that chain.
Cause if something is bent like that, you may be able to just replace the tensioner and have the chain last a while, but something caused that to happen. Once you get the front cover off, you then have a choice of replace it or remove the busted parts..
Cause if something is bent like that, you may be able to just replace the tensioner and have the chain last a while, but something caused that to happen. Once you get the front cover off, you then have a choice of replace it or remove the busted parts..
05-14-2017, 06:11 AM
#5
I know some early LS blocks didn't have dampeners or even holes drilled for them, GM realized the issue and added a dampener. Using some sort of dampener on a single roller timing chain is a good idea, it prevents chain wrap during deceleration at high RPM.
Last edited by 07NBSChevy; 05-14-2017 at 06:24 AM.
05-14-2017, 10:26 AM
#6
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L-92 Tensioner Spring Hi Z06, YES you must repair/replace the L-92 chain guide.
I HAVE STATED the method here MANY times with no response from any other members.
I modify the unit by spring replacement and pin changes.
My customers race BAJA "desert", LONG races for many hours at speed.
I ask if you fit a "single" TC ?
I sell the SINGLE timing chain with AVON STEEL BILLET gears, BAJA tested tuff.
You will find chain wear.
I can also sell you a new chain, a chain with LARGE THICK link bars and oil feed holes for EACH roller.
You could just fit the LS-2 Chain Guide.
I thank you for this report as MY REPORT of this condition has NOT BEEN observer here by LS-1 tech readers.
Lance
I HAVE STATED the method here MANY times with no response from any other members.
I modify the unit by spring replacement and pin changes.
My customers race BAJA "desert", LONG races for many hours at speed.
I ask if you fit a "single" TC ?
I sell the SINGLE timing chain with AVON STEEL BILLET gears, BAJA tested tuff.
You will find chain wear.
I can also sell you a new chain, a chain with LARGE THICK link bars and oil feed holes for EACH roller.
You could just fit the LS-2 Chain Guide.
I thank you for this report as MY REPORT of this condition has NOT BEEN observer here by LS-1 tech readers.
Lance
05-14-2017, 10:35 AM
#7
TECH Senior Member
Lance, it has always been my inclination to heed the advice of those who have "been there & done that". It would appear you qualify on both counts. I ALSO wonder why there is not more acknowledgement of your contributions here.
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05-17-2017, 09:20 AM
#9
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Ok I ordered a LS2 chain damper and started taking it all apart... ATI balancer is coming off tonight.
thanks for the feedback guys.
a lot of work for a $20 part grrrrrr😢
thanks for the feedback guys.
a lot of work for a $20 part grrrrrr😢
06-03-2017, 11:53 AM
#11
I don't know how I completely missed this email notification....
But anyways... I have my 6.0 built for drag racing and have the same OEM style tensioner as the second picture. I am going to look into a different tensioner myself after seeing this. What I don't get its how it made it into the bottom of the pan considering the minimal clearance available in that area? I have a VVT delete on my 08 LY6 block and it seems almost impossible for that to get into the pan....
But anyways... I have my 6.0 built for drag racing and have the same OEM style tensioner as the second picture. I am going to look into a different tensioner myself after seeing this. What I don't get its how it made it into the bottom of the pan considering the minimal clearance available in that area? I have a VVT delete on my 08 LY6 block and it seems almost impossible for that to get into the pan....
06-04-2017, 03:56 AM
#12
There is more than enough clearance for it to fall into the pan, at least on mine. When I was removing my broken tensioner, with the oil pump out of the way. I dropped the spring and it fell into the oil pan. Luckily the engine was on a stand and I could easily drop the pan to get it out.
06-05-2017, 04:03 AM
#14
You can only use one or the other, not both. The LS2 Dampener is all you need. The Tensioners have had issues with breaking, like mentioned above. If you are into the engine that far, most people switch over to prevent it from failing.
My tensioner in my 2007.5 Gen4 LMG 5.3 did last 118,000 miles before I switched it over to the LS2 style during my cam swap. It broke when I tried to remove it ironicly.
My tensioner in my 2007.5 Gen4 LMG 5.3 did last 118,000 miles before I switched it over to the LS2 style during my cam swap. It broke when I tried to remove it ironicly.
06-05-2017, 05:16 PM
#15
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You can only use one or the other, not both. The LS2 Dampener is all you need. The Tensioners have had issues with breaking, like mentioned above. If you are into the engine that far, most people switch over to prevent it from failing.
My tensioner in my 2007.5 Gen4 LMG 5.3 did last 118,000 miles before I switched it over to the LS2 style during my cam swap. It broke when I tried to remove it ironicly.
My tensioner in my 2007.5 Gen4 LMG 5.3 did last 118,000 miles before I switched it over to the LS2 style during my cam swap. It broke when I tried to remove it ironicly.
I'd say that was perfect timing!
07-07-2022, 09:06 AM
#17
TECH Senior Member
Having said that, there have been no issues with having a bit of slack. The slight amount that is evident seems to have no effect on timing or durability.
You're trying to address a non-issue.
07-07-2022, 09:53 AM
#18
One reason is because of the "growth" that aluminum blocks experience, but that does not account for iron blocks.
Having said that, there have been no issues with having a bit of slack. The slight amount that is evident seems to have no effect on timing or durability.
You're trying to address a non-issue.
Having said that, there have been no issues with having a bit of slack. The slight amount that is evident seems to have no effect on timing or durability.
You're trying to address a non-issue.
07-07-2022, 02:23 PM
#19
I'm going to go against the grain here and say I prefer a tensioner (that does not fall apart) over a damper block. It keeps constant tension on the chain and should really help to keep it from slapping around via harmonics at different resonation points (RPM's). The tensioner likely does not have enough spring pressure on it to drive the cam, so I don't think it can prevent slack from happening on the drive side during a hard decel, but it can still absorb slack in general and a bunch of various and random harmonics. It does look like they had a material problem, the white nylon seems to heat harden (turn brown) and fail, and in way more than just LS engines. But I did notice for Gen V engines, GM changed this material to something that looks more like softer black poly. I bought one of these black plastic Gen V leaf tensioners for my Gen IV build, just don't have it together yet. Seems to have the same bolt pattern and dimensionals.
With the damper block style, sure it works and won't fail, which is what most are looking for, bolt it on and go to the next thing without having to look back. But it is kind of just going back to 350 SBC technology where as the timing chain stretches, it can eventually jump a tooth, as to where the spring loaded leaf tensioner gives the chain a spring loaded wrap around the sprockets. With a damper block, there is nothing supporting or stopping the chain slack as the chain wanders outward from the chain drive path centerline. Very common on older Ford SBF 302/351's to jump timing cam timing during shut down at any mileage over 120k. I made a lot of $ in side jobs fixing such in the day, so this type of occurrence is still strong in my memory (and I'm not even 50 yet).
I guess for anybody not demanding their LS build to exceed 120,000 miles or so, a damper block is probably fine and does not matter. Has anybody else here tried the later style black GM tensioners?
With the damper block style, sure it works and won't fail, which is what most are looking for, bolt it on and go to the next thing without having to look back. But it is kind of just going back to 350 SBC technology where as the timing chain stretches, it can eventually jump a tooth, as to where the spring loaded leaf tensioner gives the chain a spring loaded wrap around the sprockets. With a damper block, there is nothing supporting or stopping the chain slack as the chain wanders outward from the chain drive path centerline. Very common on older Ford SBF 302/351's to jump timing cam timing during shut down at any mileage over 120k. I made a lot of $ in side jobs fixing such in the day, so this type of occurrence is still strong in my memory (and I'm not even 50 yet).
I guess for anybody not demanding their LS build to exceed 120,000 miles or so, a damper block is probably fine and does not matter. Has anybody else here tried the later style black GM tensioners?
07-07-2022, 02:32 PM
#20
I'm going to go against the grain here and say I prefer a tensioner (that does not fall apart) over a damper block. It keeps constant tension on the chain and should really help to keep it from slapping around via harmonics at different resonation points (RPM's). The tensioner likely does not have enough spring pressure on it to drive the cam, so I don't think it can prevent slack from happening on the drive side during a hard decel, but it can still absorb slack in general and a bunch of various and random harmonics. It does look like they had a material problem, the white nylon seems to heat harden (turn brown) and fail, and in way more than just LS engines. But I did notice for Gen V engines, GM changed this material to something that looks more like softer black poly. I bought one of these black plastic Gen V leaf tensioners for my Gen IV build, just don't have it together yet. Seems to have the same bolt pattern and dimensionals.
With the damper block style, sure it works and won't fail, which is what most are looking for, bolt it on and go to the next thing without having to look back. But it is kind of just going back to 350 SBC technology where as the timing chain stretches, it can eventually jump a tooth, as to where the spring loaded leaf tensioner gives the chain a spring loaded wrap around the sprockets. With a damper block, there is nothing supporting or stopping the chain slack as the chain wanders outward from the chain drive path centerline. Very common on older Ford SBF 302/351's to jump timing cam timing during shut down at any mileage over 120k. I made a lot of $ in side jobs fixing such in the day, so this type of occurrence is still strong in my memory (and I'm not even 50 yet).
I guess for anybody not demanding their LS build to exceed 120,000 miles or so, a damper block is probably fine and does not matter. Has anybody else here tried the later style black GM tensioners?
With the damper block style, sure it works and won't fail, which is what most are looking for, bolt it on and go to the next thing without having to look back. But it is kind of just going back to 350 SBC technology where as the timing chain stretches, it can eventually jump a tooth, as to where the spring loaded leaf tensioner gives the chain a spring loaded wrap around the sprockets. With a damper block, there is nothing supporting or stopping the chain slack as the chain wanders outward from the chain drive path centerline. Very common on older Ford SBF 302/351's to jump timing cam timing during shut down at any mileage over 120k. I made a lot of $ in side jobs fixing such in the day, so this type of occurrence is still strong in my memory (and I'm not even 50 yet).
I guess for anybody not demanding their LS build to exceed 120,000 miles or so, a damper block is probably fine and does not matter. Has anybody else here tried the later style black GM tensioners?
Interesting. What did you lookup to buy the newer tensioner for?