WARHAWK or C5R-WHICH DO YOU PREFER?
Teching In
Joined: Nov 2003
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I would definately have to be a lottery winner to afford a set up with one of these blocks. I love looking at this stuff and seeing the cutting edge. As a kid I used to read all the car mags just looking at the cool stuff. What I would like to see is one of these 481CI monsters built to the hilt in an Ultima GTR. Can you say come on powerball.
TECH Addict
Joined: Aug 2004
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Originally Posted by dynamowhum
I would definately have to be a lottery winner to afford a set up with one of these blocks. I love looking at this stuff and seeing the cutting edge. As a kid I used to read all the car mags just looking at the cool stuff. What I would like to see is one of these 481CI monsters built to the hilt in an Ultima GTR. Can you say come on powerball.
http://www.pistonheads.co.uk/gassing...70856&f=20&h=0
this is jeff schwartz creation. LS7 with forged bottom end and turbo turbos.
and have a look at nelson racing for their twin turbo GTR. they made 1600bhp on race and over 1100bhp on pump (91)!
thanks Chris.
I think it looks like an incredibly well engineered product...and as a result, I have a question for all the people concerned with the quality of the part leaving the foundry...if you were a well known company with a well established name, and you were designing an aftermarket block intended to take a TON of power and abuse and just keep asking for more...wouldn't you be concerned about that so much that you'd feel insulted to find your customers don't think it's an issue for you?
Can the Warhawk be finished at 4.030 or are the sleeves already larger than that when you buy it? I'm building a relatively small displacement (370 cubic inch) high boost engine and I'm having a lot of trouble deciding which block to go with...LSx can (or at least the older ads for it said it can) finish at 4.030 but it's heavier (it's going in a relatively heavy car and I'd like to save weight anywhere I can)...I don't think it's a direct competitor for the Warhawk as they both seem to have their own list of advantages, but the Dart billet block and C5R blocks are a little expensive for me...and I'm nervous running a production LQ4 block.
Can the Warhawk be finished at 4.030 or are the sleeves already larger than that when you buy it? I'm building a relatively small displacement (370 cubic inch) high boost engine and I'm having a lot of trouble deciding which block to go with...LSx can (or at least the older ads for it said it can) finish at 4.030 but it's heavier (it's going in a relatively heavy car and I'd like to save weight anywhere I can)...I don't think it's a direct competitor for the Warhawk as they both seem to have their own list of advantages, but the Dart billet block and C5R blocks are a little expensive for me...and I'm nervous running a production LQ4 block.
Teching In
Joined: May 2007
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Originally Posted by MerlinPro
gun,
The pattern, tooling, casting, machining and marketing of this stuff is hugely complex and there are probably a ton of books on the subject.
The pattern, tooling, casting, machining and marketing of this stuff is hugely complex and there are probably a ton of books on the subject.
LS1TECH Sponsor
Joined: Nov 2005
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Lead Time AlThrotle,
Lead time right now is about 4 weeks as we have many on back order but will begin shipping Tuesday , May 21st. It will be a few weeks to clear back orders which puts you, if you ordered one on Monday, about 4 weeks out.
PM me if you are interseted and I will get you on the list
Tom
Lead time right now is about 4 weeks as we have many on back order but will begin shipping Tuesday , May 21st. It will be a few weeks to clear back orders which puts you, if you ordered one on Monday, about 4 weeks out.
PM me if you are interseted and I will get you on the list
Tom
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TECH Senior Member
Joined: Mar 2004
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From: BFE
Regarding the "Niche Market" for LSX block and Warhawk, in our Super Street division, we are allowed unlimited cubes BUT only on GM factory blocks, so a Warhawk will not fit the bill and the LSX will.
I dunno if this fits any divisions in the US.
That Warhawk is a beauty.
I dunno if this fits any divisions in the US.
That Warhawk is a beauty.
Originally Posted by gun5l1ng3r
Where is your foundry located?
Is the Warhawk built here in the USA, with TIGHT quality control standards?
Is there a write-up somewhere showing how an Al block is made?
EDIT: I don't mean to sound like a jerk, I am just curious how products like this are made and brought to market...
Is the Warhawk built here in the USA, with TIGHT quality control standards?
Is there a write-up somewhere showing how an Al block is made?
EDIT: I don't mean to sound like a jerk, I am just curious how products like this are made and brought to market...
Originally Posted by MerlinPro
Richard and Chris,I also found out it takes one full day to cut 1.1 off a block and sleeves on a Rottler. 
Thread Starter
Collections Removal
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 263
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From: Long Island, NY
cj,
Only World Products makes the Warhawk. Sorry to be ignorant-who is " linamar "?
Sharpe,
Thank you for your generous anatomical offer-we prefer that you remain intact however.
We have not "destroyed" a Warhawk-rather, converted it to the useful purpose of informing folks about the serious effort we made to provide a desirable improvement.
Only World Products makes the Warhawk. Sorry to be ignorant-who is " linamar "?
Sharpe,
Thank you for your generous anatomical offer-we prefer that you remain intact however.
We have not "destroyed" a Warhawk-rather, converted it to the useful purpose of informing folks about the serious effort we made to provide a desirable improvement.
Staging Lane
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 53
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Clearly milling 1.1" off the Warhawk's deck is only useful for educational comparisons, but here's a question for you Merlin: How much can you mill off the Warhawk's 0.6" deck thickness and still have a safe and structurally sound block? Of course, you'll give us the usual "World is leaving it up to customer experimentation to find the limits of the block," but is there some more modest amount that World is willing to stand behind as safe and acceptable?
Originally Posted by MerlinPro
We have not "destroyed" a Warhawk-rather, converted it to the useful purpose of informing folks about the serious effort we made to provide a desirable improvement.
...maybe.
Next time, just send me one and I'll inform folks about your "serious effort to provide a desirable improvement" with huge clouds of noxtious smoke from my rear fender wells. Of course, I'll also need a transmission and rear end that can support that public service activity.
wow ... kind of surprised me reading over this thread .... are people in the LSx world really not too familiar with World? I mean good lord they've been a sponsor for who knows how long, and have been making aluminum big blocks for at least 10 years (I say 10 years because it was about that long ago when I first started reading about their products)
Once the block hits a marketable range as far as units, I'm sure they'll sell fairly well... not being made of money myself, they are, unfortunately, something only attainable when saved for quite some time... but I've wanted an aluminum block from these guys since I started out in 3rd gen camaro's, then pick up trucks... all I can say is, they've taken a huge risk in developing a high cubic inch aluminum LSx style block, and I really do hope it pays off for them.
my dream engine from them in lsx form would be the warhawk in 427ci ... not too much to get me in too much trouble but just enough to at least try.
Once the block hits a marketable range as far as units, I'm sure they'll sell fairly well... not being made of money myself, they are, unfortunately, something only attainable when saved for quite some time... but I've wanted an aluminum block from these guys since I started out in 3rd gen camaro's, then pick up trucks... all I can say is, they've taken a huge risk in developing a high cubic inch aluminum LSx style block, and I really do hope it pays off for them.
my dream engine from them in lsx form would be the warhawk in 427ci ... not too much to get me in too much trouble but just enough to at least try.
Thread Starter
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 263
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From: Long Island, NY
MrDude,
You can see them here: from our BMP site:
http://www.theengineshop.com/prods_p...2_keyfetrs.htm
Sharpe,
Yer killing me.
Ok-you get a free engine!
errr, "-What Bill?? Waddya mean Fired???"
LILS, (Long Island LS perhaps?)
You as an engine builder will draw preferences from your experience. You as the customer of an engine builder should rely on his advice for deck cuts.
We have only cut the deck once on this design-it's for display. The block came with a very true 9.24 deck.
Not sure why you might ask this other than "clean-up" or to get out of the hole numbers. Surely there are ways to raise compression by parts selection rather than machining.
And to be real square about it-we can't encourage guys to whack decks to a number or limit from the liability standpoint. If the block dies or parts won't fit-it's perceived as our fault. Period. Some folks are not above using forums to then kill us. We built the block-we'll put it out there for folks to build as they see fit.
Our custom options program will alter a deck height only to a customer's spec and he is then responsible for that choice.
"Safe and acceptable" for what?
You can see them here: from our BMP site:
http://www.theengineshop.com/prods_p...2_keyfetrs.htm
Sharpe,
Yer killing me.Ok-you get a free engine!
errr, "-What Bill?? Waddya mean Fired???"
LILS, (Long Island LS perhaps?)
You as an engine builder will draw preferences from your experience. You as the customer of an engine builder should rely on his advice for deck cuts.
We have only cut the deck once on this design-it's for display. The block came with a very true 9.24 deck.
Not sure why you might ask this other than "clean-up" or to get out of the hole numbers. Surely there are ways to raise compression by parts selection rather than machining.
And to be real square about it-we can't encourage guys to whack decks to a number or limit from the liability standpoint. If the block dies or parts won't fit-it's perceived as our fault. Period. Some folks are not above using forums to then kill us. We built the block-we'll put it out there for folks to build as they see fit.
Our custom options program will alter a deck height only to a customer's spec and he is then responsible for that choice.
"Safe and acceptable" for what?
Staging Lane
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 53
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Ok, Merlin, you're correct that what I threw out was a bit odd, but the thinking (or lack thereof) behind the weird idea was that 0.6" seems quite thick, so if for some reason you wanted to use a piston with a bit too little compression height, or a crank with a slightly smaller stroke, or con rods that were slightly too short (e.g., using the LS7 titanium rods where 6.1" or 6.125" rods are really the right fit), then maybe that generous Warhawk deck thickness might offer an option to make the parts all work together by milling the block. It may not make any sense for other reasons (e.g., the cost of milling), but I was just curious whether it even made sense from a strictly dimensional perspective.
Thread Starter
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From: Long Island, NY
LILS,
Thanks for shedding a little more light on your thoughts. If those are the parts you have on hand to use for a build I can see where you're going.
However, dimensions aside for a minute, from a financial standpoint, you may disadvantage yourself.
The niche that Warhawk was built for demands that thick deck and stout cylinder case-design features for big power apps. There are surely less-costly blocks suitable for your purpose-why pay for strength which you might mill away to make a particular combination fit? Of course you may be building big power into this combo-but then you give-up the strength you paid for.
We'd love to sell you one but prefer that you get full value for your money.
Thanks for shedding a little more light on your thoughts. If those are the parts you have on hand to use for a build I can see where you're going.
However, dimensions aside for a minute, from a financial standpoint, you may disadvantage yourself.
The niche that Warhawk was built for demands that thick deck and stout cylinder case-design features for big power apps. There are surely less-costly blocks suitable for your purpose-why pay for strength which you might mill away to make a particular combination fit? Of course you may be building big power into this combo-but then you give-up the strength you paid for.
We'd love to sell you one but prefer that you get full value for your money.