383 Stroker going in my M6 -- need help
383 Stroker going in my M6 -- need help I may be too late into this. I'm sure I shouldn't have spent $800 without consulting you guys...but I did so I'm asking for help now.
I'm soon to be the proud of of Ebay item#360144692870
This includes:
Eagle ESP Cast/Steel 3.750" Stroke Crankshaft (INTERNALY BALANCED!) (1pc seal for LT1)
5.7" 5140 steel SIR bushed rods with ARP bolts (SIR5700BBLW), (these are the new cap screw design!) Eagle has cam clearanced these rods for up to a .600 lift cam! You can run a standard base circle cam! Other Manufactures don't offer this option, small base circle cams can cost as high as $179! with this kit you can use any standard base circle cam you want!
H860CP Speed Pro Hypereutechtic Coated Skirt Pistons 11.3:1 with a 58cc head .030
Total Seal Gapless "Street" series rings
Clevite 77 Main & Rod bearings
This is a INTERNALLY balanced assembly and comes with a the balance card!
__________________________________________________ ____
These parts have already been ordered and should be delivered sometime next week. I'd love some advice on other items though..
This car is to be 100% street driven, M6 with 3.73. I figure I'll stick with those stock gears until I destroy them and that the transmission should be able to handle the sub 500 hp levels I'm shooting for. I'm having the stock heads ported and larger valves installed. The stock intake will also be ported. This is on a California car so I need to be sneaky about mods for good old CARB.
Input please on:
-Cam selection
-Solid rockers
-ARP fasteners
-Optispark -- seems like a good time to replace but with what? stock/aftermarket
-Clutch selection (Centerforce was recommended)
-Headers -- Will long tubes fit under my lowered car? Lowered 1.3"
-Other items I should be replacing while the engine is out of the car
I'm soon to be the proud of of Ebay item#360144692870
This includes:
Eagle ESP Cast/Steel 3.750" Stroke Crankshaft (INTERNALY BALANCED!) (1pc seal for LT1)
5.7" 5140 steel SIR bushed rods with ARP bolts (SIR5700BBLW), (these are the new cap screw design!) Eagle has cam clearanced these rods for up to a .600 lift cam! You can run a standard base circle cam! Other Manufactures don't offer this option, small base circle cams can cost as high as $179! with this kit you can use any standard base circle cam you want!
H860CP Speed Pro Hypereutechtic Coated Skirt Pistons 11.3:1 with a 58cc head .030
Total Seal Gapless "Street" series rings
Clevite 77 Main & Rod bearings
This is a INTERNALLY balanced assembly and comes with a the balance card!
__________________________________________________ ____
These parts have already been ordered and should be delivered sometime next week. I'd love some advice on other items though..
This car is to be 100% street driven, M6 with 3.73. I figure I'll stick with those stock gears until I destroy them and that the transmission should be able to handle the sub 500 hp levels I'm shooting for. I'm having the stock heads ported and larger valves installed. The stock intake will also be ported. This is on a California car so I need to be sneaky about mods for good old CARB.
Input please on:
-Cam selection
-Solid rockers
-ARP fasteners
-Optispark -- seems like a good time to replace but with what? stock/aftermarket
-Clutch selection (Centerforce was recommended)
-Headers -- Will long tubes fit under my lowered car? Lowered 1.3"
-Other items I should be replacing while the engine is out of the car
I may be too late into this. I'm sure I shouldn't have spent $800 without consulting you guys...but I did so I'm asking for help now.
I'm soon to be the proud of of Ebay item#360144692870
This includes:
Eagle ESP Cast/Steel 3.750" Stroke Crankshaft (INTERNALY BALANCED!) (1pc seal for LT1)
5.7" 5140 steel SIR bushed rods with ARP bolts (SIR5700BBLW), (these are the new cap screw design!) Eagle has cam clearanced these rods for up to a .600 lift cam! You can run a standard base circle cam! Other Manufactures don't offer this option, small base circle cams can cost as high as $179! with this kit you can use any standard base circle cam you want!
H860CP Speed Pro Hypereutechtic Coated Skirt Pistons 11.3:1 with a 58cc head .030
Total Seal Gapless "Street" series rings
Clevite 77 Main & Rod bearings
This is a INTERNALLY balanced assembly and comes with a the balance card!
__________________________________________________ ____
These parts have already been ordered and should be delivered sometime next week. I'd love some advice on other items though..
This car is to be 100% street driven, M6 with 3.73. I figure I'll stick with those stock gears until I destroy them and that the transmission should be able to handle the sub 500 hp levels I'm shooting for. I'm having the stock heads ported and larger valves installed. The stock intake will also be ported. This is on a California car so I need to be sneaky about mods for good old CARB.
Input please on:
-Cam selection
-Solid rockers
-ARP fasteners
-Optispark -- seems like a good time to replace but with what? stock/aftermarket
-Clutch selection (Centerforce was recommended)
-Headers -- Will long tubes fit under my lowered car? Lowered 1.3"
-Other items I should be replacing while the engine is out of the car
I'm soon to be the proud of of Ebay item#360144692870
This includes:
Eagle ESP Cast/Steel 3.750" Stroke Crankshaft (INTERNALY BALANCED!) (1pc seal for LT1)
5.7" 5140 steel SIR bushed rods with ARP bolts (SIR5700BBLW), (these are the new cap screw design!) Eagle has cam clearanced these rods for up to a .600 lift cam! You can run a standard base circle cam! Other Manufactures don't offer this option, small base circle cams can cost as high as $179! with this kit you can use any standard base circle cam you want!
H860CP Speed Pro Hypereutechtic Coated Skirt Pistons 11.3:1 with a 58cc head .030
Total Seal Gapless "Street" series rings
Clevite 77 Main & Rod bearings
This is a INTERNALLY balanced assembly and comes with a the balance card!
__________________________________________________ ____
These parts have already been ordered and should be delivered sometime next week. I'd love some advice on other items though..
This car is to be 100% street driven, M6 with 3.73. I figure I'll stick with those stock gears until I destroy them and that the transmission should be able to handle the sub 500 hp levels I'm shooting for. I'm having the stock heads ported and larger valves installed. The stock intake will also be ported. This is on a California car so I need to be sneaky about mods for good old CARB.
Input please on:
-Cam selection
-Solid rockers
-ARP fasteners
-Optispark -- seems like a good time to replace but with what? stock/aftermarket
-Clutch selection (Centerforce was recommended)
-Headers -- Will long tubes fit under my lowered car? Lowered 1.3"
-Other items I should be replacing while the engine is out of the car
Get a new OEM opti from "thepartsladi" on Ebay. Best prices around for genuine GM opti's.
My '97 SS has 1.8" Sportline lowering springs up front, my Pacesetter LT headers tuck up pretty nicely. But ground clearance was an issue I always knew I was going to have to deal with. The headers and y-pipe do scrape on bumps and dips, you have to avoid them constantly. But I'm used to it already.
-Cam selection- I would say either a 306 or GM847, but that depends on how "sneaky" you want to be. If you want to stay emissions legal then a LPE 211/219 cam, although small will still pass a sniffer and can supply close to 400rwhp and 410ft lb of torque in a 383 application given the heads are decent.
-Solid rockers- Either Comp Cams Pro Mags, Hi Techs or Crane Golds are all very reputable. Depends on how much money you want to spend.
-ARP fasteners- Yes.
-Optispark -- seems like a good time to replace but with what- If it ain't broke don't fix it. I'm running a stock optispark now turning over 7000rpm for the last 5000 miles and it's holding up well.
-Clutch selection (Centerforce was recommended)- I would suggest either a Spec Stage III+. If you are still running a 10-bolt this clutch is not overly agressive and will handle the power just fine.
-Headers -- Will long tubes fit under my lowered car? Lowered 1.3"- That may be a challenge especially over speed bumps and dips in the road. I'm not sure how well that will clear. My car is lowered 1" and the lowest part of the header is the collector and it's about 3" off the ground.
-Other items I should be replacing while the engine is out of the car- If you haven't changed out the motor mounts, now would be a perfect time to do so. I would stick with stock.
-Solid rockers- Either Comp Cams Pro Mags, Hi Techs or Crane Golds are all very reputable. Depends on how much money you want to spend.
-ARP fasteners- Yes.
-Optispark -- seems like a good time to replace but with what- If it ain't broke don't fix it. I'm running a stock optispark now turning over 7000rpm for the last 5000 miles and it's holding up well.
-Clutch selection (Centerforce was recommended)- I would suggest either a Spec Stage III+. If you are still running a 10-bolt this clutch is not overly agressive and will handle the power just fine.
-Headers -- Will long tubes fit under my lowered car? Lowered 1.3"- That may be a challenge especially over speed bumps and dips in the road. I'm not sure how well that will clear. My car is lowered 1" and the lowest part of the header is the collector and it's about 3" off the ground.
-Other items I should be replacing while the engine is out of the car- If you haven't changed out the motor mounts, now would be a perfect time to do so. I would stick with stock.
I'm not sure that this is an option due to budget and emissions...in that order. To pass emissions in California headache free I'm going for a stock look. The cam can be plenty lumpy so long as it passes the sniffer. Intake and TB on the other hand...those can be easily seen by popping the hood. While there are aftermarket units, I think the stock ported unit should be fine for what I'm doing. How much do you think is gained with a single plane?
My model is from Golen Engine Service, they build a 383 that makes 480 hp with stock heads and intake. http://www.golenengineservice.com/sp...l/383_480.html
I'm trying to follow a build-up as close as possible while maintaining California emissions compliance. My builder's first suggestion based on this was the LT4 GM hotcam. Any thoughts or are you sticking with your previous statement?
What brand of headers?
Like I said...I should have consulted the forum prior to hitting "buy it now". It seemed like a good idea at the time. I don't plan on running nitrous or any sort of artificial induction so I'm hoping the crank will hold up just fine.
-Cam selection- I would say either a 306 or GM847, but that depends on how "sneaky" you want to be. If you want to stay emissions legal then a LPE 211/219 cam, although small will still pass a sniffer and can supply close to 400rwhp and 410ft lb of torque in a 383 application given the heads are decent.
-Headers -- Will long tubes fit under my lowered car? Lowered 1.3"- That may be a challenge especially over speed bumps and dips in the road. I'm not sure how well that will clear. My car is lowered 1" and the lowest part of the header is the collector and it's about 3" off the ground.
-Headers -- Will long tubes fit under my lowered car? Lowered 1.3"- That may be a challenge especially over speed bumps and dips in the road. I'm not sure how well that will clear. My car is lowered 1" and the lowest part of the header is the collector and it's about 3" off the ground.
I'm trying to follow a build-up as close as possible while maintaining California emissions compliance. My builder's first suggestion based on this was the LT4 GM hotcam. Any thoughts or are you sticking with your previous statement?
What brand of headers?
Like I said...I should have consulted the forum prior to hitting "buy it now". It seemed like a good idea at the time. I don't plan on running nitrous or any sort of artificial induction so I'm hoping the crank will hold up just fine.
Last edited by haacer; Apr 16, 2009 at 06:25 PM.
I'm not sure that this is an option due to budget and emissions...in that order. To pass emissions in California headache free I'm going for a stock look. The cam can be plenty lumpy so long as it passes the sniffer. Intake and TB on the other hand...those can be easily seen by popping the hood. While there are aftermarket units, I think the stock ported unit should be fine for what I'm doing. How much do you think is gained with a single plane?
My model is from Golen Engine Service, they build a 383 that makes 480 hp with stock heads and intake. http://www.golenengineservice.com/sp...l/383_480.html
I'm trying to follow a build-up as close as possible while maintaining California emissions compliance. My builder's first suggestion based on this was the LT4 GM hotcam. Any thoughts or are you sticking with your previous statement?
What brand of headers?
Like I said...I should have consulted the forum prior to hitting "buy it now". It seemed like a good idea at the time. I don't plan on running nitrous or any sort of artificial induction so I'm hoping the crank will hold up just fine.
My model is from Golen Engine Service, they build a 383 that makes 480 hp with stock heads and intake. http://www.golenengineservice.com/sp...l/383_480.html
I'm trying to follow a build-up as close as possible while maintaining California emissions compliance. My builder's first suggestion based on this was the LT4 GM hotcam. Any thoughts or are you sticking with your previous statement?
What brand of headers?
Like I said...I should have consulted the forum prior to hitting "buy it now". It seemed like a good idea at the time. I don't plan on running nitrous or any sort of artificial induction so I'm hoping the crank will hold up just fine.
My model is from Golen Engine Service, they build a 383 that makes 480 hp with stock heads and intake. http://www.golenengineservice.com/sp...l/383_480.html
I'm trying to follow a build-up as close as possible while maintaining California emissions compliance. My builder's first suggestion based on this was the LT4 GM hotcam. Any thoughts or are you sticking with your previous statement?
What brand of headers?
I'm trying to follow a build-up as close as possible while maintaining California emissions compliance. My builder's first suggestion based on this was the LT4 GM hotcam. Any thoughts or are you sticking with your previous statement?
What brand of headers?
For headers it really depends on how stringent the inspection station is. If you want to pass w/out any hassle then you would have to stick with shorty headers which have a Executive Order (EO) number from CARB. I believe Mac, Edelbrock and SLP headers are all legitimate. If you believe you can get away with longtubes then Hooker or Pacesetter w/ the emissions hookups and then run some highflow cats through a custom made y-pipe. Just a word of warning, if you decide on shorties it will choke the **** out of your engine and will not yield the 480flywheel hp you are looking for...
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Golen's dyno is exceptionally optomistic too. A 440hp Golen motor will put down 32x through an automatic. His 520hp puts down something like 370-390.
Point being on his dyno there are heads/cam motors that would make 550.
You bought a pile of, cheap less than stock quality, crap, simple as that. I wish you luck and you NEED it.
Be aware too that Eagle has issues making the crank right for a pilot bushing, you might have to contact them for their bandaid to "solve" the problem.
You are not going to get away with long tube headers either.
Point being on his dyno there are heads/cam motors that would make 550.
You bought a pile of, cheap less than stock quality, crap, simple as that. I wish you luck and you NEED it.
Be aware too that Eagle has issues making the crank right for a pilot bushing, you might have to contact them for their bandaid to "solve" the problem.
You are not going to get away with long tube headers either.
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He's a meanie, but speaks the truth. I have an Eagle crank that has two issues- The pilot hole is too large so Eagle's solution is an oversized bushing or a gnarled bearing. The crank snout is slightly small so the hub doesn't fit as snuggly as stock, but there is no play and it is keyed so I'm not concerned.
I would suggest researching your local machine shops and discuss with them what you want before purchasing a cafeteria style "al la carte" engine.
He's a meanie, but speaks the truth. I have an Eagle crank that has two issues- The pilot hole is too large so Eagle's solution is an oversized bushing or a gnarled bearing. The crank snout is slightly small so the hub doesn't fit as snuggly as stock, but there is no play and it is keyed so I'm not concerned.
I would suggest researching your local machine shops and discuss with them what you want before purchasing a cafeteria style "al la carte" engine.
You bought a pile of, cheap less than stock quality, crap, simple as that. I wish you luck and you NEED it. Be aware too that Eagle has issues making the crank right for a pilot bushing, you might have to contact them for their bandaid to "solve" the problem. You are not going to get away with long tube headers either.
...you said no way for the long tubes. Am I missing something?
My '97 SS has 1.8" Sportline lowering springs up front, my Pacesetter LT headers tuck up pretty nicely. But ground clearance was an issue I always knew I was going to have to deal with. The headers and y-pipe do scrape on bumps and dips, you have to avoid them constantly. But I'm used to it already.
Last edited by haacer; Apr 16, 2009 at 10:00 PM.
I shouldn't have phrased this as such... I'm trying to build an engine similar to their 480 hp package. By choosing similar elements I hope to achieve similar results. I'm well aware that there will be powertrain, emissions, and other parasitic losses. This car is for the street, not the strip.
Thanks for the input. This is exactly what I was looking for.
Thanks for the input. This is exactly what I was looking for.
Also... I've been seeing lots of posts deriding the quality of Eagle's cast cranks. By quality what do you mean? Are they out of tolerance, out of balance, poor machining, what's the problem?
Last edited by haacer; Apr 16, 2009 at 10:24 PM.
I live in CA, if you want to pass emissions headache free, you have to have stock manifolds, stock cats, AIR, EGR, and you certainly can't have a cam as lumpy as you want. You would be better off building the car the way you want it and buying your smog like I do.
Long tubes are illegal in CA, all longtubes, shorties are the only CARB approved alternative.
Eagle has lots of issues, balance, dimensional tolerance, and sometimes even just snapped cranks at under 1000miles.
Golen has done nothing too me.
Just has a long, well documented history of 25%+ drivetrain losses once guys get his engines on a chassis dyno.
Eagle has lots of issues, balance, dimensional tolerance, and sometimes even just snapped cranks at under 1000miles.
Golen has done nothing too me.
Just has a long, well documented history of 25%+ drivetrain losses once guys get his engines on a chassis dyno.
Also, any other recommendations on the clutch?
For a 383, no. LT's are the only thing I would ever bolt to a stroker motor with any decent size cam. There is no real point in trying to build a stroker AND keep it CARB legal, it won't perform like you'll want it too. I would build it right and keep paying to have it passed.
I'm using a Spec stage 3 and Spec Billet flywheel for my 383 build.
Sell the Eagle crank, you'll be out a lot more money in the end if you don't.
As for headers, you have no other sensible choice except LT's unless you want to have a poorly setup combo. Anything else is a waste of money and will choke your engine bigtime.
Sell the Eagle crank, you'll be out a lot more money in the end if you don't.
As for headers, you have no other sensible choice except LT's unless you want to have a poorly setup combo. Anything else is a waste of money and will choke your engine bigtime.
