LSx or stay with the LT1
well, if he already began to mode his car maybe he wants to finish that you know? i know i took the harder road as well by having an lt1 car..
but, hey look into a budget build for your motor.. save the money you would have from a conversion..
but, hey look into a budget build for your motor.. save the money you would have from a conversion..
my buddy is building a clean *** 95 Z28...383 stroker, all forged, AFR heads, ect ect. He made 529hp at the crank on an engine dyno, and the motor is ready for nitrous if he wants it. 700hp is completely attainable with his setup...his setup was just above $10,000 for a 100% new, professionally assembled motor.
That's pretty damned good bang for the buck, no matter what car ya own.
LT1 FTW
That's pretty damned good bang for the buck, no matter what car ya own.
LT1 FTW
I performed the swap back in 2008, it is cheaper to build a your current platform then swap to a new one, BUT If you do alot or all the work yourself and shop the for sale section then you might find deals that make it more manageable in the end.
It's really all in what you want to do, I did the swap because I bent #5 connecting rod on the stock bottom end into a S shape NA and I felt it was time to try something new. I didn't buy a ls car to start because I had a decent amount of money in the chassis and suspension that I didn't want to do over. For my model year all that really needed to be converted over was the wiring harness & Fuel system everything else swapped right in.
The Options are almost endless with the LS stuff and you can have any cubic inch you desire and afford. But as said the ultimate decision is up to you have how much you want to spend. Just like with building a engine the little things will nickle and dime you! And in the end it will all add up to more then you expected.
It's really all in what you want to do, I did the swap because I bent #5 connecting rod on the stock bottom end into a S shape NA and I felt it was time to try something new. I didn't buy a ls car to start because I had a decent amount of money in the chassis and suspension that I didn't want to do over. For my model year all that really needed to be converted over was the wiring harness & Fuel system everything else swapped right in.
The Options are almost endless with the LS stuff and you can have any cubic inch you desire and afford. But as said the ultimate decision is up to you have how much you want to spend. Just like with building a engine the little things will nickle and dime you! And in the end it will all add up to more then you expected.
I performed the swap back in 2008, it is cheaper to build a your current platform then swap to a new one, BUT If you do alot or all the work yourself and shop the for sale section then you might find deals that make it more manageable in the end.
It's really all in what you want to do, I did the swap because I bent #5 connecting rod on the stock bottom end into a S shape NA and I felt it was time to try something new. I didn't buy a ls car to start because I had a decent amount of money in the chassis and suspension that I didn't want to do over. For my model year all that really needed to be converted over was the wiring harness & Fuel system everything else swapped right in.
The Options are almost endless with the LS stuff and you can have any cubic inch you desire and afford. But as said the ultimate decision is up to you have how much you want to spend. Just like with building a engine the little things will nickle and dime you! And in the end it will all add up to more then you expected.
It's really all in what you want to do, I did the swap because I bent #5 connecting rod on the stock bottom end into a S shape NA and I felt it was time to try something new. I didn't buy a ls car to start because I had a decent amount of money in the chassis and suspension that I didn't want to do over. For my model year all that really needed to be converted over was the wiring harness & Fuel system everything else swapped right in.
The Options are almost endless with the LS stuff and you can have any cubic inch you desire and afford. But as said the ultimate decision is up to you have how much you want to spend. Just like with building a engine the little things will nickle and dime you! And in the end it will all add up to more then you expected.
great advice.
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Lets see, Lt1 = no aftermarket support, if you change your injectors and need a retune its 190 each time you send it to pcmforless (noone local tunes obd1 junk) **** poor circa 1954 chevy small block head design, opti, junk intake design and junk factory hypereucraptec pistons. Yeah Im gonna stick with the Lt1
Thread Starter
Staging Lane
iTrader: (15)
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 86
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From: Columbia, Missouri
Theres plenty of aftermarket stuff for the LT1...i mean **** the lower end is all SBC stuff. Theres more aftermarket than the common person will ever need.
Im going to stick with the LT1 after a little furthur research and calling a few shops. Goin witha forged eagle crank and h-beam rods along with some forged mahle flat tops. Lower end components will cost me just shy of $1500. Short block labor is $1325 (clearence, file fit rings, deck, assemble, degree cam, and splayed including the caps...anything that needs to be done to fully assemble a 4 bolt splayed shortblock) and $975 to fully port and polish my Trickflow 195cc heads, mill them and port match an intake.
$$ total so far:
Fully ported Trickflow 195cc heads w/ labor and port matched intake - $1775
Custom cam - $300
Assembled short block w/ labor: $2825
Double roller timing chain - $50
Gaskets - $150?
Total: $5100 not too bad for an LT1 longblock easily capable of 500 rwhp
Im going to stick with the LT1 after a little furthur research and calling a few shops. Goin witha forged eagle crank and h-beam rods along with some forged mahle flat tops. Lower end components will cost me just shy of $1500. Short block labor is $1325 (clearence, file fit rings, deck, assemble, degree cam, and splayed including the caps...anything that needs to be done to fully assemble a 4 bolt splayed shortblock) and $975 to fully port and polish my Trickflow 195cc heads, mill them and port match an intake.
$$ total so far:
Fully ported Trickflow 195cc heads w/ labor and port matched intake - $1775
Custom cam - $300
Assembled short block w/ labor: $2825
Double roller timing chain - $50
Gaskets - $150?
Total: $5100 not too bad for an LT1 longblock easily capable of 500 rwhp
Do a 6.0 iron block with l92 heads/ls3 intake. Ls motors only need rodbolt upgrade and they can handle up to 600whp and spin 7000krpm no prob on the stock shortblock. You could prolly even rebuild the bottom end with forged rods and pistons and still be at that price above... Step up to the new technology man, I did and don;t regret it one bit. I love the lt1 and enjoyed beating some ls car with it, but all bs aside ls is the way to go. Im not sure how guys can claim building a lt1 is cheaper than a ls, Gm is mass producing stock stuff that flows aswell as older gen aftermarket ported stuff. Since it's mass produced its far cheaper. Hell you can pick up a set of l92 heads from scoggin dickey for like 800.00 bucks with manley valves and I think they flow in the 350 range at .600. Im not bashing the lt1 at all either, so lets not turn this into a pissin match... just a matter of opinion here lol.
Thread Starter
Staging Lane
iTrader: (15)
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 86
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From: Columbia, Missouri
I dont know if it would necisarily be cheaper to go LSx. Theres no way in hell that im putting a used engine in my car w/o tearing it down and rebuilding it. I'm wanting a reliable car that I can drive anywhere I want and not worry if ***** gonna go wrong.
I thought about it too. I was on the fence too but I found a deal on a forged 383 with dish pistons so it could be a PERFECT FI engine. I see no reason why this couldn't be a 600 rwhp setup. Not that I'm doing it. But I am thinking Turbo. What would suck is it could put down more than my 408. Bottom line I'm going to build a 10cr engine so I can go FI later. I could still put down 420+. There is nothing wrong with LT1s. Thing is production run was very low. There have been 13yrs on LS1 platform.
Thread Starter
Staging Lane
iTrader: (15)
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 86
Likes: 0
From: Columbia, Missouri
I kinda see it like this...i could convert to a 6.0L with everything needed and it would prolly cost the same as my LT1 build...but then it would just be another LSx build...nothing new
Theres plenty of aftermarket stuff for the LT1...i mean **** the lower end is all SBC stuff. Theres more aftermarket than the common person will ever need.
Im going to stick with the LT1 after a little furthur research and calling a few shops. Goin witha forged eagle crank and h-beam rods along with some forged mahle flat tops. Lower end components will cost me just shy of $1500. Short block labor is $1325 (clearence, file fit rings, deck, assemble, degree cam, and splayed including the caps...anything that needs to be done to fully assemble a 4 bolt splayed shortblock) and $975 to fully port and polish my Trickflow 195cc heads, mill them and port match an intake.
$$ total so far:
Fully ported Trickflow 195cc heads w/ labor and port matched intake - $1775
Custom cam - $300
Assembled short block w/ labor: $2825
Double roller timing chain - $50
Gaskets - $150?
Total: $5100 not too bad for an LT1 longblock easily capable of 500 rwhp
Im going to stick with the LT1 after a little furthur research and calling a few shops. Goin witha forged eagle crank and h-beam rods along with some forged mahle flat tops. Lower end components will cost me just shy of $1500. Short block labor is $1325 (clearence, file fit rings, deck, assemble, degree cam, and splayed including the caps...anything that needs to be done to fully assemble a 4 bolt splayed shortblock) and $975 to fully port and polish my Trickflow 195cc heads, mill them and port match an intake.
$$ total so far:
Fully ported Trickflow 195cc heads w/ labor and port matched intake - $1775
Custom cam - $300
Assembled short block w/ labor: $2825
Double roller timing chain - $50
Gaskets - $150?
Total: $5100 not too bad for an LT1 longblock easily capable of 500 rwhp
and $50 for an LT1 timing set? please, hook me up on that. no seriously.
oh if you go to summit you can get a re-ring kit complete with bearings, gaskets and (of course) rings for $330.
and another thing, 8 rods, 8pistons and a crank is all the LT1 shares with the traditional chevy small block, and even then it is 1 peice main stuff.
again, not being a dick here, but i will travel from bristol to, where ever, for that kind of price on machine work.
The problem with LS motors is anyone who can chew gum and walk can build a big HP motor. ****, with an Ls3 and you need is a cam, headers, cai, tune and your knocking on the 500rwhp door.
Im not saying that people shouldnt build high HP engines but with an LT1 you need careful planning, TLC, and know what to look for. LSx is just HP in a box, open it up and there it is.
Im not saying that people shouldnt build high HP engines but with an LT1 you need careful planning, TLC, and know what to look for. LSx is just HP in a box, open it up and there it is.
Thread Starter
Staging Lane
iTrader: (15)
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 86
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From: Columbia, Missouri
dude, not being a dick here, but who is your machinist? he is going to drill, tap, line bore your mains and block for splayed caps. set clearance, deck block, file ring AND assemble AND degree you cam for $1325!!!??? on top of that only charge $975 for a FULL port and polish? dude, is your dad the machinist?
The shop is Burlington Performance
9600 East 59th Street, Raytown, MO - (816) 353-8417
and $50 for an LT1 timing set? please, hook me up on that. no seriously.
Summit brand $37.95 http://www.summitracing.com/parts/SUM-G6601/ Any SBC roller cam double timing set will work if you're using an EWP
oh if you go to summit you can get a re-ring kit complete with bearings, gaskets and (of course) rings for $330.
Whats your point?
and another thing, 8 rods, 8pistons and a crank is all the LT1 shares with the traditional chevy small block, and even then it is 1 peice main stuff.
You can use any hydraulic roller cam, timing sets, and oil pans as well
again, not being a dick here, but i will travel from bristol to, where ever, for that kind of price on machine work.
The shop is Burlington Performance
9600 East 59th Street, Raytown, MO - (816) 353-8417
and $50 for an LT1 timing set? please, hook me up on that. no seriously.
Summit brand $37.95 http://www.summitracing.com/parts/SUM-G6601/ Any SBC roller cam double timing set will work if you're using an EWP
oh if you go to summit you can get a re-ring kit complete with bearings, gaskets and (of course) rings for $330.
Whats your point?
and another thing, 8 rods, 8pistons and a crank is all the LT1 shares with the traditional chevy small block, and even then it is 1 peice main stuff.
You can use any hydraulic roller cam, timing sets, and oil pans as well
again, not being a dick here, but i will travel from bristol to, where ever, for that kind of price on machine work.
Last edited by 97RAMAIRTA; Jun 5, 2010 at 12:11 AM.
on the timing set, can't use regular small block stuff or you will have no way to drive the water pump drive ( i guess you can buy the set and just use the new chain). ----caught your electric water pump edit, good point.----
on cams, i may be wrong, but you can't use early stuff on the LT1 unless you go without the opti (you need a way to drive the opti).you can use LT1 cams in earlier blocks though.
oil pan? gotta use one piece and go without the oil level sender if you use the early stuff.
valve train? got me there. i heard you can also use LS7 roller lifters. arn't they factory replacement for LT1?
the point about summit was just to let you all know its a pretty good kit.
and to slowmarao, you've got a point. but i guess you could use a rotary dial phone to call grandma on sunday instead of your trusty iphone but would you? i've spent 10 years building pontiac motors to keep up with big block chevys and i am tired of working so hard to make horsepower. i want my horsepower to be like my women, easy AND cheap.
on cams, i may be wrong, but you can't use early stuff on the LT1 unless you go without the opti (you need a way to drive the opti).you can use LT1 cams in earlier blocks though.
oil pan? gotta use one piece and go without the oil level sender if you use the early stuff.
valve train? got me there. i heard you can also use LS7 roller lifters. arn't they factory replacement for LT1?
the point about summit was just to let you all know its a pretty good kit.
and to slowmarao, you've got a point. but i guess you could use a rotary dial phone to call grandma on sunday instead of your trusty iphone but would you? i've spent 10 years building pontiac motors to keep up with big block chevys and i am tired of working so hard to make horsepower. i want my horsepower to be like my women, easy AND cheap.
Thread Starter
Staging Lane
iTrader: (15)
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 86
Likes: 0
From: Columbia, Missouri
on the timing set, can't use regular small block stuff or you will have no way to drive the water pump drive ( i guess you can buy the set and just use the new chain). ----caught your electric water pump edit, good point.----
on cams, i may be wrong, but you can't use early stuff on the LT1 unless you go without the opti (you need a way to drive the opti).you can use LT1 cams in earlier blocks though.
Change the pin in the end of the cam
oil pan? gotta use one piece and go without the oil level sender if you use the early stuff.
That is very correct, but it still works...Anything 1pc rear main works on LT1
valve train? got me there. i heard you can also use LS7 roller lifters. arn't they factory replacement for LT1?
The LS7 lifters work great they are about $130 nowadays but the Caddy lifters are the best and I think they are in the $200+ range
on cams, i may be wrong, but you can't use early stuff on the LT1 unless you go without the opti (you need a way to drive the opti).you can use LT1 cams in earlier blocks though.
Change the pin in the end of the cam
oil pan? gotta use one piece and go without the oil level sender if you use the early stuff.
That is very correct, but it still works...Anything 1pc rear main works on LT1
valve train? got me there. i heard you can also use LS7 roller lifters. arn't they factory replacement for LT1?
The LS7 lifters work great they are about $130 nowadays but the Caddy lifters are the best and I think they are in the $200+ range
The problem with LS motors is anyone who can chew gum and walk can build a big HP motor. ****, with an Ls3 and you need is a cam, headers, cai, tune and your knocking on the 500rwhp door.
Im not saying that people shouldnt build high HP engines but with an LT1 you need careful planning, TLC, and know what to look for. LSx is just HP in a box, open it up and there it is.
Im not saying that people shouldnt build high HP engines but with an LT1 you need careful planning, TLC, and know what to look for. LSx is just HP in a box, open it up and there it is.
The other was a friends ls2 with prc 215 heads, ms4, etc that only did 417 through an m6.
It's not as easy as you think to just slap a 500 RWHP ls combo together as most would lead you to believe.