This is my first post, so I'll admit i know next to nothing about OHV engines, and even less about GM cars. I was looking for a new car to buy and decided to go with a Firebird. My reasoning being the only two cars i ever lost to were a 98 Z28 and a 69 Camaro (ss maybe), and because i personally prefer the Firebird's body style to the Camaro's. My previous car was a 1992 3000gt VR4 so I'm hoping I can get this Firebird to run as fast. 12.3@122 was my best time. I don't know much about american made cars so that's why im here.

So anyway about the car i bought.

1995 Firebird Formula - Automatic (my first one)
58,000 miles
$2,200

It has some mods which the previous owner claims 400hp but i am skeptical of it being that much.

Throttle body air foil
Chrome intake of some sort
3" cat-back exhaust
Jet Stage 2 chip
Under drive pulleys
Holley fuel pump

And he says his previous owner did a few other things before he bought it.

I've read the couple stickys at the top of this forum and saw i have most of the basic upgrades. I was thinking of the following modifications but i want to be absolutely sure they are best since i don't know anything about them.

Long tube headers
Custom aluminum header-back 3" exhaust (which is better, x or H pipe?)
Zr1 wheels - 17x11 17x9.5
Port Throttle body
Port Intake Manifold
Custom intake (run a Y pipe off of the MAFS into two K&N filters - one in front of each ram air vent)
Granatelli Air meter

And that's all i can think of for now. Heads of course, but later when i get a feel for working on the car. Also maybe injectors, but would i need a SAFC?

Thanks for all the help guys,

Shawn

 

Glad to see you've converted over! Welcome to the board. Stick around and we'll help you with whatever you need to know.

It's a safe bet to say you're not at 400 horsepower, brake or rear wheel.

The mods that he's got done are so minor that you're probably still around stock power level. He's flat out lying about the Jet chip, because 94+ F-Bodies don't use a removable computer chip.

As for other things, you'll definitely need to go with a catback. However, our cars don't have true dual exhausts, we only use a Y-pipe and one muffler. I highly recommend the GMMG catback to all users, but they can get quite pricey and are only available from GMMG's website. Magnaflow represents the best all around catback, stainless steel, great flow, and great sound.

As for headers, definitely go with longtubes. Jet Hots are the best longtubes available, but if you want to go the extra mile you can have Kooks make a custom stainless steel set for you. Jet Hot coated longtubes are great, though, that's what I'd suggest. Don't worry about porting anything yet, concentrate on bolt-ons since you're still new to the domestic game.

Intake doesn't really matter, you don't need a custom setup, it probably won't help much at all. Just go with a plain jane intake like a Moroso or K&N FIPK.

If you are really into to the custom ideas though, and want to give your car it's own unique flavor, I'd suggest going with a custom true dual setup. You can get a custom X-Pipe made by any exhaust shop and go witha couple of resonators on the end. Mufflers will create some ground clearance issues, but there are enough cheap resonators for sale that will give you what you're looking for.

Good choice on wheels, too

Hope this helps, let me know if you have any other questions.

 

So where should i look for this so called chip? I've seen other chip available for cars of my year, so do you think it may be one of them?

The guy i bought it from doesnt seem to know much about it. He had hit a deer, not like i've ever seen, to where all it did was break the headlight, crack the corner of the hood, and the fender and that's it. The bumper isn't really damaged anywhere except where it meets the fender. He bought it from a friend so maybe he just got confused on some of the mods or maybe he doesnt know what in the hell he's talking about . I'll check it out when i get it here. I pick it up Tuesday. I already have the title and everything and the title is clear and goes to a 1995 firebird formula.

Here is the Ebay auction for it. Maybe you can tell me if he's lying about anything else.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...tem=2483533960

The custom stuff i like to have just to be different. I had straight 14 gauge aluminum pipes, one directly from each turbo back into 3" magnaflow hi-flow cats and no mufflers. That had to be the highest flowing exhaust i have ever had. I had an HKS drager system which is already like a top 3 system for the vr4 and i still noticed huge gains with that set up so i'm defintely going to get those guys to make my next exhaust system. I live way out in the country so sound isnt really a problem but i will need cats because it's a $1,200 fine for not having them. Would you suggest from headers back into an X-pipe? Also should i go with stainless steel or stick with aluminum? Would you reccomend me putting in a muffler or just leaving it straight?

That custom air intake setup would probably be made of PVC and if i notice any gains i'd have the same exhaust shop make me one out of metal. I like to experiment.

Thanks again,
Shawn

 

There flat at is no such thing as a "chip" for a 94-97 LT1 engine. The only removable piece of the entire PCM is the knock module. What he could have been referring to was a power programmer, which is a worthless piece of crap and basically a 400 dollar fan switch. Our computers are edited for performance by reprogramming the entire PCM (powertrain control module). The 92-93 LT1s use an ECM (engine control module) which does take chips.

Honestly, my suggestionw ould be to steer clear of that car. I don't know if bodywork is cheaper down south or something, but that is absolutely NOT 800 dollars worth of bodywork. Try around $2500-3000. IMO, it's way too damaged to try and mess with. There's a good chance that with that much body damage, the frame could also be damaged.

I would always stick with stainless steel with exhaust unless you live somewhere where it never dips under 50 degrees. Stainless steel just plain holds up better than aluminized metal. Free flowing exhaust is good, but remember that there can be a such thing as an exhaust that flows too much and kills low-end power. As for the true-duals, it depends on what you really want. It won't cost much more, but ground clearance will make it impossible to lower the car, and you have to find a credible shop in your area to do the work.

Let me one more time stress how against buying the car I am... the thing is pretty much wrecked. It's going to cost a lot of money to repair- you're better off buying a good stock car for a bit more than biting on that one. The fact that he's bullshitting with the whole "400hp" thing just sets off all kinds of alarms in my head. His insurance company may have totalled it and given him the money, and he could have bought it back and may be attempting to sell it over Ebay. I wouldn't go for it.

 

Well i already bought it . I have the title in my hand right now. I do the work myself. I've done alot of work on alot of cars, just not any indepth on camaros or mustangs or anything like that. I know you and anyone else who will look at this will hate it, but here is my VR4. About 60% or the exterior was rebuilt by me. And for the record that spoiler never went on. They mailed the wrong one and i took pics while i had it set up there to decided whether or not to use it. It's not dirty, it was all sanded for painting.

http://home.earthlink.net/~xmx/id4.html

That car was going to be painted the day i wrecked it so i $400 of silver/blue paint just lying around and i figured i'd paint the firebird with it when i get done fixing it.

I found a white fender for $80, i'll be making a sort of custom 350z projector headlight setup, and i found a bumper for $100 so i figure it will be less than $500 for me to fix it. He assured me there was no frame damage and that mechanically it can be driven home if i remove the fender and plstic wheel well. Of course it has one headlight and tail light so he said he didnt reccomend it but i'm picking it up between 8am and 4pm so it won't be a problem.

When i get it here if you let me know what and where i shoudl check for bolt ons i'll tell you what i see. I know where headers and a cat-back system would be, the intake you can see, would there be a sticker for a re-program? Any other things i should check for? I'm always looking for projects so things like this keep me busy. I went a trade school, 3 years as an auto mechanic, passed several ASE vertifications as "pop quizzes" but never officially took the tests so i'd say i am competent enough to work on all kinds of cars, i just never have work on this kind - internally.

So with the cam i can just take out the old one and stick the new one in? Use 5/16 rod to hold the pushrods out of the way and slide the new cam in? How do i time it? They don't teach performance so it's just remvoe and replace. Stock cams have markings, will the new one too?

Also one quick question. What is that a picture of in the next to last last picture that he has listed? The white thing. i cant really tell.

Shawn

 

Wow...that car is f*ed up...but I guess since you already bought it...gotta do it eh? Okay for body parts check out brazelton. Not sure on the website but they sell GM parts for a lot cheaper than a dealership. Secondly. the front suspension will most definitely need some work...steering knuckle, a arm, tie rod end....etc....furthermore.....the locks probably need to be replaced if someone broke into it...???? I dont know....also for the cam install you will need to pull the pushrods and lifters out after the intake, elbow, and air filter w/ "custom chrome intake" are off. Also the valve covers will come off too along with the front of the motor. Then the cam can come out...watch that oil pan seal too...should probably loosen the front few bolts on the oil pan for that....these aren't in depth instructions at all...just letting you know. And for the sake of everyone on here.....don't rice this thing out...please!!!!

 

Hehe it won't be riced out i promise. I'm only 17, and i think i grew out of the stage when that car went through 4 trees (under normal driving too!) The headlights i was just going to experiment with. Do you think a Firebird would look good with 350z projector lights?

So you say the suspension will be messed up? I hate suspension. He didnt say that there was any frame or suspension damage, i asked him. If it is damaged i will definately be upgrading the suspension if i have to go through will all that work anyway.

The locks weren't damaged. He left the car unlocked or windows down most likely. Or after he hit the deer he just ripped out the system in anger since he does have an extra system he's willing to install in it.

To be honest, the only straight car i bought was the 95 mustang i had. Even it needed work. My problem is i love working on cars and learning about them. 1995 mustang - v6 - 5spd, 1992 3000gt vr4 - twin turbo v6 - 5spd, 1984 porsche 944 - 2.5l I-4 - 5spd. And now this firebird. None of them are similar in anyway asside from the transmissions, so i get alot of experience. My parents are atleast supportive, for the most part, of my endeavors since they keep me out of trouble. Point is i like broken cars

This cam thing sounds like a lot of work I think i'll wait to do heads and cam alot with ported intake and throttle body. I definately don't have the money do that right now.

I was also wondering about headers. How hard are they to put on this engine? It doesn't look like there is too much room. I don't have the car so i have absolutely no idea how much room there is but i just wanted to get a general idea.

So do you think i am atleast making 300hp? maybe at the wheels? supposing everything minus the chip is legit.

Shawn

 

Headers are no biggie...actually the main problem is getting the old system off and keeping the aluminum heads in good shape. Definitely from the bottom though. The cam swap isnt that bad really....just kind of scary going in blind...but it's just time consuming. As far as 300hp? I doubt it...lets see a good catback...I'm giving you the benefit of the doubt, plus a cold air intake, through an automatic....hmmm....maybe pushing 280ish...who knows? With a good heads and cam package it would thump and run real good. As far as the 350Z lights are concerned....I think a setup like that would look cool....however not sure on the fitment. I hate the flip up style headlights on Firebirds, not to mention the gears strip out a lot, but if you can get them to fit more power to ya. Another option would be RKSPORT's Corvette "euro" light...same idea just for the vette...might be more correcet size-wise.

 

Looks like Jordan covered it while i was out, but yeah, I doubt you're around 300rwhp. Probably closer to 250. Don't worry though, that number will jump up fast as hell as you start modding

 

I was just thinking, the 1st gen VR4 has very similar pop up headlights so maybe i will use the 2nd gen VR4 headlights. Here is a pic.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...category=33710

As for the corvette i couldnt find the headlights you mentioned. Fitment wouldn't be a huge deal. I'd just cut and add where i needed I have a couple friends with MIG welders at their house so i coudl get them to make me a frame or bracket if i needed.

So do you think i am atleast in the 13 second 1/4 miles? My 1/4 miles are usually faster than most since i am below sea level, but i'm just curious if i am atleast in the 13's.

So as far as weiht reduction are there anythings i shoudl remove? Crash bars maybe? I removed them on my last car and saved almost 100lbs, but also totalled it so i'm not too sure if i should remove those.

The plans i have as soon as i get the car minus fixing the exterior would be

push button start
ABS bi-pass switch
non pop-up headlight conversion
long tube headers
custom 3" true dual/X-pipe/ twin 3" cats no mufflers exhaust system
Definately a system of some sort since there isn't one at all.

As far as heads go, would it be worth it to save up and get port and polished stage 2 heads or something along with the cam or should i just replace the springs and pushrods with the cam?

Thanks for your help guys,
Shawn

 

Ok, what is this a picture of?

http://i3.ebayimg.com/02/i/02/06/67/67_1.JPG

from the same ebay auction

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...tem=2483533960

 

Also about the Zr1 wheels. I am planning on just getting the 17x11 for now and 315, maybe 335 tires. Now will an 11 wide rim take 335's? I was also wondering if i am going to need wheel spacers for the wider tires, and will i need to cut away any of the body panels?

Thanks,
Shawn

 

You've got lots of questions; I like your enthusiasm!
Yes, I would suggest ported heads and a cam to match it - that's where you'll get your biggest power increase. I've heard good things about Lloyd Elliot, and several of the sponsors --------->> can set you up with ported LT1 heads & a cam.

Oh yeah, after you get the heads & cam installed plan on getting the PCM retuned. You can get it dyno tuned, or use LT1edit (if you enjoy learning new things) or contact pcmforless.

 

Just out of curiosity how much to heads and a cam cost? I know for my other car it would be around $3,000 for 2 stage 3 heads and 4 cams so i'm hoping these will be less. I also found a set of corvette wheels on Ebay right now. They have 295's in the front and 345's in the rear. Will these fit a 1995 Formula? Will i need spacers? I know next to nothing about tires too I don't know what will fit so i'm gonna just go with whatever you guys say. I am going to make tires and wheels my first mod because when you are below sea level and it rains, water doesnt drain too good on highways and traction can be a problem.... like in that stupid mustang i had

 

I'm really not sure about any tires bigger than 315, can't say i've seen many, I'm not sure if they'll fit in the well... I'd say stick with 315 DRs on 11" wide ZR-1s.

A cam swap will generally run you around $500 with new springs and rockers. Heads will run anywhere from $1000-$2500. depending on base price and how much you want to work them.

 

Are those prices installed or just for parts? I'd do the work myself unless you think it would be too difficult. I would also wait to install the headers until i did the heads since there wouldnt be much of a point. Can't the heads be removed with the stock manifolds still attached? I'm lazy

If you are interested in the wheels here they are. They saide they were new corvette rims, and new tires and they are at $499 with no bids, a 7 day listing, and 1 1/2 days left. The caught my attention because of being 345's, vipers being only 335's

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...e=STRK:MEWA:IT

 

Those would be parts prices; installation is extra. You should be able to get a decent 'stage 1' set of ported heads and a cam for something around $2000 not including core charge. By the way, in case you haven't explored the rest of this site there's also a Wheels & Tires area
https://ls1tech.com/forums/wheels-tires-17/
With info specific to your tire size and offset questions. In fact, there are specific areas for just about anything you might possibly try doing with your car, including PCM tuning if you want to go the LT1edit route. Personally, I'd suggest getting a mail order computer tune from pcmforless after you swap heads & cam.

 

Awsome. Just checked out the tire forum and looked at some posts. The 315's will fit for sure. Does anyone know if it is leagal to drive around without fenders or quarter panels or maybe bumpers? just wondering. How much do the computer tunes run? Like around $300?

As far as stages go for heads, What is required at each stage? Stage 1, exahust intake, stage 2 upgraded oil pump, injectors, anything like that? Rods, pistons?

Also i have heard of a TSB for the driveshaft. Can i get the one i have replaced for free if it hasn't already been done?

Thanks,
Shawn

 

Mail order computer tune from PCMforless will cost you $100

We don't really speak in stages in the domestic world, as far as I know that's pretty much an import thing. A lot of us like to configure our own setups, I'm not really in the know with all of the stage thingies...

 

Yeah I would second that - there is no standard to define what 'stage1' or 2 heads will have done to them from one company to the next. It's just a generic term to suggest how much the head has been ported, and to some extent the intended use of the heads. Stage1 heads are pretty much for the street, and stage2/3 are for your more serious enthusiasts, with racing applications in mind.

The stock LT1 bottom end will put up with a lot, so you shouldn't need pistons, forged crank or rods just to handle ported heads. You'd be looking at a set of lifters, valve springs, gaskets, possibly pushrods and/or rocker arms, and maybe at some point upgraded fuel injectors to go along with your heads/cam upgrade. I don't know what a driveshaft TSB is; sorry.