nitrous and timing questions???
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TECH Fanatic
Joined: Oct 2003
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From: Long Island, NY
nitrous and timing questions??? well i started the install of my 5177 kit today. it got me thinking...
when i got my car tuned, the tuner told me he wasn't going to mess with the timing too much because the '98 cars have an aggressive timing curve stock (28 degrees i believe it was). anyway, i was discussing the preparations for the nitrous with a buddy today and he recommended i tune the car down to 24 degrees. the problem i have is i dont want to take an EXTREMELY low 12 second car with 11 second potential and turn it into a MID-12 second car on motor. i was told 24 degrees would cost me 10-12 rwhp and as you can see i dont have much power to spare.....
im a firm believer in being better safe than sorry but the guy who i bought the nitrous kit off of has a '98 too (untuned, stock 28 degrees of timing). he sprayed the ever loving crap (as in NO JETS) out of his 100,000 mile motor on that amount of timing and never had a problem. on top of that, i have another friend who had a stock '98 with a 5177 kit and also sprayed it jetless on a 90,000 mile motor.
so on to the point...realistically, do i really have to pull the timing out and more or less tune the car specifically for a measly 100 shot or can i run the spray on the motor tune???? input from people with experience on this would be appreciated. thanx
-Mike
when i got my car tuned, the tuner told me he wasn't going to mess with the timing too much because the '98 cars have an aggressive timing curve stock (28 degrees i believe it was). anyway, i was discussing the preparations for the nitrous with a buddy today and he recommended i tune the car down to 24 degrees. the problem i have is i dont want to take an EXTREMELY low 12 second car with 11 second potential and turn it into a MID-12 second car on motor. i was told 24 degrees would cost me 10-12 rwhp and as you can see i dont have much power to spare.....
im a firm believer in being better safe than sorry but the guy who i bought the nitrous kit off of has a '98 too (untuned, stock 28 degrees of timing). he sprayed the ever loving crap (as in NO JETS) out of his 100,000 mile motor on that amount of timing and never had a problem. on top of that, i have another friend who had a stock '98 with a 5177 kit and also sprayed it jetless on a 90,000 mile motor.
so on to the point...realistically, do i really have to pull the timing out and more or less tune the car specifically for a measly 100 shot or can i run the spray on the motor tune???? input from people with experience on this would be appreciated. thanx
-Mike
I personally didn't spray on a engine tune-up. I got an MAFT, went to a dyno, found out what setting on MAFT that would richen up the car to the point of pulling timing. With the MAFT I had 1 setting for the motor only, and another for nitrous. It kept the engine running. The a totally stock engine (internally, heads, cam) ran a best of 11.38 in the 1/4 on a 100 shot; 12.51 on the engine. See signature for the new set up.
IMO, get an MAFT - go to a dyno, fine out the settings that "please" the car. Better to be safe than sorry.
Or just buy the LS1Edit or HP Tuner - build 2 programs - 1 for engine, 1 for nitrous. That is what I have today. Not 2 bad of runs - see signature.
2 degrees per 50 shot is a rule of thumb.
David
IMO, get an MAFT - go to a dyno, fine out the settings that "please" the car. Better to be safe than sorry.
Or just buy the LS1Edit or HP Tuner - build 2 programs - 1 for engine, 1 for nitrous. That is what I have today. Not 2 bad of runs - see signature.
2 degrees per 50 shot is a rule of thumb.
David
My 98 didn't like to run a 150 dry with the stock tune. I HAD to run 100 octane and max out my MAFT to keep the KR away. All cars are different though, there is only one way to find out. Good luck!
Do a search on 'timing tuner.' It is EXACTLY what you are looking for. It keeps the timing the same until the very instant that the solenoid(s) open. It then pulls however much you tell it to. It does A TON of other stuff too.
With my 5177 I was spraying a 125 shot and I could get away with 26-27* of timming no problem when using Sunoco 94. However, this part you probrably don't want to hear. After about 6 months of using the 5177 I practicly gave it away and went with a wet kit. I was having to add so much fuel to the car just to get the A/F ratio to run 12.5:1 it was killing my N/A performance. Not sure if this is an issue with most 5177 cars.
