Nitrous experts inside please, need ideas..
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Re: Nitrous experts inside please, need ideas.. Not that good of news for me, I was hoping it was a few valves or maybe even a bad seat too. Then I could get his #241 heads, have them reoworked while he bought some nice heads, but NO...Someone has to be cheap azz n wanna just replace a bad valve! Whatta friend.
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Re: Nitrous experts inside please, need ideas.. At what RPM's do you turn on the N20 Drew? Also, what kind of angle are you spraying past the TB? You got a 3K stall so I'd imagine you coming on there or a little higher. Wonder if you got a little too much angle on your nozzle and changing the airflow a little to much to make your D side run lean like that. I keep running the rail ideal through my head and can't quite get it to seem rite. I figure the P side would run low first since it has no feed to it to help keep it up. Sounds weird but I got some pluber and city water buddies I asked about dual lines and leaks(nossles).
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Re: Nitrous experts inside please, need ideas.. BMN...think of it like this.. the fuel enters in the crossover tube so both sides are being fed together...now take away required fuel from the D side to give to the N2O wet kit! Now that does take available fuel away from the D side. It may not be THE cause of problems, but when there are other things going on, and yo uadd that extra spark...BANG something gives and this is one of those things.
Much like the factory pushrods are not that weak...if you have an M6 and miss a shift or better yet, throw it down a couple when you meant to go up your bending them right. Well, if ya dont fugg it up you wont bend them. And, if you do and replace them with hardened..I bet if you did the same thing, hit third instead of fifth and see if it dont happen again..maybe maybe not.
Much like the factory pushrods are not that weak...if you have an M6 and miss a shift or better yet, throw it down a couple when you meant to go up your bending them right. Well, if ya dont fugg it up you wont bend them. And, if you do and replace them with hardened..I bet if you did the same thing, hit third instead of fifth and see if it dont happen again..maybe maybe not.
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Re: Nitrous experts inside please, need ideas.. Yeah, true. The biggest leak will get the most fluid out of it. The leak being the nossle could starve that side of the rails. I was just noticing that the reg is so close to the driver side that it would probly help it out a little. Not tryin to shoot down your case bro, just throwin ideals out to help find exactly what could have happened.
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Re: Nitrous experts inside please, need ideas.. Well what happened in this case IS:
Too much timing, he didnt lower in the rush to 10's....oops.
Too little fuel, new program and was in aforementioned rush forgot to fatten up the top a little...bigger ooops
Add to that the fuel being pulled out from that side and the short gap and theres a recipe for disaster, had he used race gas, more fuel or less fuel I think he could have survived this one and made his 10's...but as luck will have it....
Too much timing, he didnt lower in the rush to 10's....oops.
Too little fuel, new program and was in aforementioned rush forgot to fatten up the top a little...bigger ooops
Add to that the fuel being pulled out from that side and the short gap and theres a recipe for disaster, had he used race gas, more fuel or less fuel I think he could have survived this one and made his 10's...but as luck will have it....
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Re: Nitrous experts inside please, need ideas.. To also agree with what 383LQ4SS said. the issues was timing, and lack of fuel. the plug gap has nothing to do with the problem. the cyl pressure was too high and melted the plugs. the spark plug pieces are the likely culprit of chewing up the valve that was already red hot from the lean condition.
As too the fuel rail theory your not making enough horsepower to see that limitation. i would ask when was the last time the fuel filter was changed? and PUT A FUEL GAUGE WHERE YOU CAN SEE IT!!! when your pressure is dropping get out of it. with no safety precautions this will be a consistent potential for disaster. i am very surprised this didn't melt a piston, colapse a ring land, or blow a head gasket as well.
I am running 600 rwhp with a single Racetronix intank 340 setup and using the fuel rail test port for my fuel feed. Stock bottom end and lots of bottles. i am also running 18 deg of timing for my 150rwhp shot.. I have NEVER seen any knock on data logs.
I would spend a few more dollars and put in a timing computer that will take out your timing so NA performance is not hurt and there is no switching of programs and no forgetting which one is in... and a little 100 octane never hurts as well.
Good Luck!!
Wes
As too the fuel rail theory your not making enough horsepower to see that limitation. i would ask when was the last time the fuel filter was changed? and PUT A FUEL GAUGE WHERE YOU CAN SEE IT!!! when your pressure is dropping get out of it. with no safety precautions this will be a consistent potential for disaster. i am very surprised this didn't melt a piston, colapse a ring land, or blow a head gasket as well.
I am running 600 rwhp with a single Racetronix intank 340 setup and using the fuel rail test port for my fuel feed. Stock bottom end and lots of bottles. i am also running 18 deg of timing for my 150rwhp shot.. I have NEVER seen any knock on data logs.
I would spend a few more dollars and put in a timing computer that will take out your timing so NA performance is not hurt and there is no switching of programs and no forgetting which one is in... and a little 100 octane never hurts as well.
Good Luck!!
Wes
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Re: Nitrous experts inside please, need ideas.. Wes, I hear ya. And I have agreed so several times. Obviously theres a need to work on the wording cause you covered everything I or others already have.
Think...Why is it the Drivers side thats seems to burn up first?
Thats the question, not why did this happen, hell i already stated that a few times, Timing-too much, fuel-not enough, Bad juju. And of course it was the flipping piece of the plug that tore thru the valve,nothing more "likely" about that! And yep, they were brittle as hell being that the damn things were white hot....btw Cyl 1&3 exhaust valves are powedery white ashy..still. Good thing it was as lean as it was or it might have went thru the piston instead of chunking a valve!
All I am saying is, when the wrong cards are at play and your headed for disaster, if you still got the stock rails you are bound to tear up the Drivers side first becasue the way the wet kit sucks off the drivers side.
Anyone want to prove this wrong, I will help lean your car out and add a lot of timing and we'll see if the Pass side ***** first when spraying a decent size shot alright!
Think...Why is it the Drivers side thats seems to burn up first?
Thats the question, not why did this happen, hell i already stated that a few times, Timing-too much, fuel-not enough, Bad juju. And of course it was the flipping piece of the plug that tore thru the valve,nothing more "likely" about that! And yep, they were brittle as hell being that the damn things were white hot....btw Cyl 1&3 exhaust valves are powedery white ashy..still. Good thing it was as lean as it was or it might have went thru the piston instead of chunking a valve!
All I am saying is, when the wrong cards are at play and your headed for disaster, if you still got the stock rails you are bound to tear up the Drivers side first becasue the way the wet kit sucks off the drivers side.
Anyone want to prove this wrong, I will help lean your car out and add a lot of timing and we'll see if the Pass side ***** first when spraying a decent size shot alright!
Re: Nitrous experts inside please, need ideas.. ChicagoZo6, I agree with Cat3 that what you said was all ready stated, and you give credit to someone who was the second one to say timing. I still like fuel rail/other combo theory.
Re: Nitrous experts inside please, need ideas.. Of course we all agree the timing was probably a huge factor..as well as lack of fuel.
But I am going to disagree with the fule rail theory
. For one simple fact...it is fed from the same side as the fuel port for the wet kit. I would agree only if the fuel port that feeds the wet kit was on the opposite side from where the rails are fed.
The way it is...being fed from the same side would lead me to think that if the fuel pressure drops on the side fuel is being fed too...it should drop on both sides.
But I am going to disagree with the fule rail theory
. For one simple fact...it is fed from the same side as the fuel port for the wet kit. I would agree only if the fuel port that feeds the wet kit was on the opposite side from where the rails are fed. The way it is...being fed from the same side would lead me to think that if the fuel pressure drops on the side fuel is being fed too...it should drop on both sides.
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Re: Nitrous experts inside please, need ideas.. Ok Al, interesting take on this. BUT... our main fuel line runs into the FPR and then to one or the other side. From this, i see that one side, the drivers gets taxed more heavily than the pass side, when using the wet kit. instead of having 4 injectors the drivers side has 5, or what ever the fuel flow for the wet kit would be equivalent too, but either way its more than the pass side.
Heres a easy way to look at it:
1) How many people have had problems with leaning out the pass side, NOT the drivers using a wet kit? to include blowing plugs to hell etc....
2) take your garden hose and hook up four sprinkler heads, and another with 5. when you turn the water on you will see the flow difference is substantial when that 5th head is flowing...much like it would be on a rail feeding 4 injectors and one wet kit!
I hate to think I am wrong on this cause I feel so right, but until someone proves to me that the pass side can do the same damage without hurting the drivers side from similar circumstances, I will remain correct in this theory....thats why its a theory not fact...
Charlie.
Heres a easy way to look at it:
1) How many people have had problems with leaning out the pass side, NOT the drivers using a wet kit? to include blowing plugs to hell etc....
2) take your garden hose and hook up four sprinkler heads, and another with 5. when you turn the water on you will see the flow difference is substantial when that 5th head is flowing...much like it would be on a rail feeding 4 injectors and one wet kit!
I hate to think I am wrong on this cause I feel so right, but until someone proves to me that the pass side can do the same damage without hurting the drivers side from similar circumstances, I will remain correct in this theory....thats why its a theory not fact...
Charlie.
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Re: Nitrous experts inside please, need ideas.. I got an ideal. I'm gonna make a mock up fuel rail with PVC pipe. 4 1/4" holes in the bottom of each leg, and a 3/8" hole in the end of what will be the driver side. I will hook it up to my hose and I will run it with and without the the 3/8" hole pluged. I might have to work with the hole sizes. If you take 430/8 you get 53.75 hp per injector so actually I should use a hole 3/4 of an inch. Maybe 1/8' in holes and a 3/24" would work better. Cool test, should go back to HS and do this for the science fair.
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Re: Nitrous experts inside please, need ideas.. High School, whats that???
For real, this is the only explanation I can come up with why it is that so many people fry the drivers side. Not saying this theory is responsible for the frying, just the end result.
For real, this is the only explanation I can come up with why it is that so many people fry the drivers side. Not saying this theory is responsible for the frying, just the end result.
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Re: Nitrous experts inside please, need ideas.. LOL, I hear ya, HS is the biggst waste of 4 years in any ones life, BUT that aside, I don't think anyones trying to say your blaming the rail pressure drop alone for the prob. I think we are just trying to figure out just how big of a role it's playing over all.
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Re: Nitrous experts inside please, need ideas.. Guys I just went and took a look at the fuel rail on MY car(hoping that no1 else's is different). The fuel supply line does NOT enter on the driver side. It goes under the driveside fuel rail and enters to the left of it at what seems to be a regulator(which I have never really had any experience with) forming a T . So I beleive that the fuel is being distributed EVENLY to each rail and like said above the wet kit acts like a 5th injector on the driverside. I will also agree that this is not going to be a leading factor in this case but I think it has played a small roll in some cases.... just maybe not this particular one. Further more I am not trying to convince everyone else to go out and buy a fuel rail but I do beleive that it would be worth the investment escecially if you plan on making more power in the future.
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Re: Nitrous experts inside please, need ideas.. It came to me in my sleep this afternoon, love siestas.
The Engineers for all they are gave us several little "riddles" if you will.
1) Stock Push rods weak enough to fold a mere missed shift....but they also act as the weakest link in case of a missed shift for those using the stockers for that intended purpose.
2) this fuel rail issue, if they did plumb it so that it was any other way, when the **** hit the fan then you would more than likely have to mess with the pass side and its lovely clearance around #6 & 8 cylinders. So, in essence, they did us a favor of sorts.
Right????
The Engineers for all they are gave us several little "riddles" if you will.
1) Stock Push rods weak enough to fold a mere missed shift....but they also act as the weakest link in case of a missed shift for those using the stockers for that intended purpose.
2) this fuel rail issue, if they did plumb it so that it was any other way, when the **** hit the fan then you would more than likely have to mess with the pass side and its lovely clearance around #6 & 8 cylinders. So, in essence, they did us a favor of sorts.
Right????