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Old 03-03-2009, 06:32 PM   #1
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Default My Budget LS Engine Swap Guide <$1500

I made this writeup for another site after some guys were asking me questions and I figured it might do some new swappers some good on here:



Alright, I had a handful of guys wanting more info on how to swap in an LS-series of engine on a limited budget. I do these conversions for a living and will try and help shed some light on installing one of these in about anything on the lowest budget possible. Dependability, great power output, mileage and the cool factor all can come at a very reasonable price if you are willing to work a little for it.

First off a little about the engines I will be referring to. In my world I refer to either the 4.8, 5.3, 5.7 or 6.0 engines as LS1 as they share the same platform and most parts with the actual 5.7 aluminum RPO LS1 engines. I rarely do ACTUAL LS1 swaps and here is why. The two main advantages a Camaro/ Firebird/ Corvette LS1 have over a truck 5.3 for example are that the aluminum block weighs 65lbs less and they usually make around 10 horsepower more. These two factors do not warrant the big difference in price to me. There have been dyno tests were 5.3s were swapped in place of 5.7s and with all parts the same (intake, etc) they usually made 9-10 horsepower less. This is obviously NOT a large difference. I'm not bashing a true LS1 by any means, but the 5.3s can usually be bought for 1/3 to 1/4 of the price, so I tend to use them.

That said.....

With some digging around, you can usually pickup a complete 5.3 for anywhere between $450-$750. The way I usually get them is top to bottom, with truck intake/ rails/ injectors/ coils. They usually do NOT have starters, alternators, power steering, etc. This is just the way I get them. I have bought 18 of them this way.

The next biggest expense is usually the harness, which you have different options. Either harness can be made to work, be it from a truck or a LS-car harness (Camaro, Firebird) The biggest differences are that the trucks use a different injector plug type than the cars and the truck harnesses lay out differently. I try to avoid the truck harnesses as much as possible due to the odd layout, they are harder to make look nice and they are wired a little more complexly than the car ones (more keyed power sources) Here is where you have to decide what direction you are going to go, plan on leaving the less attractive truck intake (still make good power) or switch to the car style intake/ rails/ injectors to make it look more like an actual LS1. A stock harness usually will run around $150-200 dollars and you will then have to spend 3-4 hours cutting it apart/ figuring out the wires that won't be needed for your application and removing them and finding the wires you will need to connect to make your swap run. This is not a very difficult task, but it does require some patience and a good source of info, such as:

http://www.ls1tech.com/forums/conver...swap-faqs.html

This would be the cheaper route to go if you are somewhat confident in wiring, the other route would be to buy an aftermarket or already converted harness. I have previously reconfigured all factory harnesses for my swaps but now we sell our own, all new harnesses for less than a stock harness and the labor required to modify one. These start around $500. These are made with the correct length wires to place the ECM better and layout more pleasing to the eyes. It would take a lot of work to modify every wire on an older harness to make it layout as nicely as one of the custom built from scratch harnesses.

The next item to consider is what transmission you plan on running. The LS engines will work with any older GM trans with some considerations. TH350s/ 700R4s/ TH400s work by using a GM part as a flexplate spacer and bolts to place the flexplate at the proper spacing, and this part provides a place for the converter snout to engage, using the original converter. The thing to consider is the downshift/ TV cables associated need to be addressed. Companies like Bowtie overdrives, etc have pieces to make them work. Obviously the 6-speeds/ 4l60Es designed to be behind the LS-engines work easily with the proper harnesses if your budget allows.

Next would be the fuel system. The easiest way to do this would be to use an inline Walbro pump sold all over the net, usually around $120 and the corvette filter-regulator combo. There are many options here depending on yor vehicle as far as getting the fuel to the pump. You can pull your factory sending unit and find a way to mount the pump to the sender and install in tank, or maybe even an aftermarket vendor makes a sending unit for your application to do just that. Other options including welding a sump to the bottom of the tank and feeding from there. Next would be installing a fuel cell or even an aftermarket tank designed for EFI use in your application. Some even just mount the pump and pull fuel through the factory pickup. This is usually okay for lower horsepower (stock swaps) and certain pumps, as some don't like pulling fuel very much and might not last forever. After the pump, you feed the corvette filter/ regulator which then has an output that you run to the fuel rail and it also has an output for return fuel back to the tank which just needs plumbed into the top of the tank. The truck intake and fuel rails includes a regulator so you can just run a line up to it and a line back from it returning unused fuel to the tank.

The only other variable here is what accessories you need to run on your engine. Of course there are vendors out there like March, Kwik Performance etc that sell complete accessories setups that are nice, but pricey, which doesn't fit into this budget writeup. I usually am doing hotrod style swaps that often only include an alternator. These are fairly simple, I usually use GM CS-style alternators, found in TBI/ TPI style 4.3-5.0-5.7 engines. These are pretty affordable, work well and are easily replaceable in case of failure. Making mounts out of simple metal (3/16s bar stock-3/8ths round stock) doesn't take too much skill. Just mount the alternator out of everythings way in your swap and most times you can even route the belt to use the factory tensioner. I have done many this way and even some with power steering and used the factory tensioner with perfect results. None ever took more than two hours to figure out. For the non creative types the easiest way to do this is to hold a straightedge across the balancer and hold the alternator up to it in a good spot and find a way to tack a bracket in place to hold it temporarily and then build some easy brackets (I love using the round bar) to mount it, it doesnt even need to adjust if you use the factory tensioner. Of course using factory LS1 brackets/ accessories is always a possibility if they fit your application and are available for use. The thing to keep in mind is that the truck/F-body/Corvette all use different accessory spacing in regards to the distance from the pulley to the block, the trucks stick out the furthest, the F-body is in about 5/8 from that and the vette is in a little more. The total difference between all three is around an inch I believe, but it is enough to make obvious bracket issues if trying to mix and match parts.



Well if you are still with me I am going to make a few lists with pricing for a few different situations.


First would be low budget, this would include a 5.3 engine swap, leaving the truck intake and using for this example a TH400 trans that was already in the vehicle.

5.3 Engine $450
Stock truck harness $150
Add on fuse panel for harness $40
ECM $40
Conversion mounts $50
Gm Trans adapter/ bolts $50
New starter $80
GM CS alternator-junkyard $25
walbro fuel pump $120
Maf sensor - used -ebay $40
New O2 sensors $120
radiator hoses $20
Fuel lines/ fittings $100
Computer reflash $150
Exhaust work/ O2 bungs $100

Total $1535

This would be the bare minimum swap into a vehicle. For example I just did a swap like this into a 69 Chevy truck. This has no hood clearance issues for the taller intake, standard truck manifolds that came with the engine fit the chassis in this application. The trucks stock radiator worked excellent as the LS-engines run pretty cool anyhow. The truck had existing electric fans like many vehicles out there already may have.

This swap would have been for the more do-it-yourself kinda guy as it used a stock harness requiring the modifications to make it work.



Now, take that same swap and add the car intake/ rails/ injectors and use an aftermarket harness which is already done, wires in with only a few connections and looks much nicer.

Previous price $1435
LS1 intake $80
LS1 rails $50
LS1 injectors $40
aftermarket harness (ebay) $500
credit back -truck harness -$150
credit back - fuse panel -$40

Total $2015
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Old 03-03-2009, 06:34 PM   #2
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From there just add whatever YOU might need for your swap. Things to keep in mind are:

Do any of the stock LS style manifolds fit your chassis? There are many choices, including those from the trucks, F-body, vette C5, vette C6, GTO, even the front wheel drive style ones. If none of these fit you may be left going to an aftermarket vendor that makes swap headers, or having a set made. Obviously the cost can vary greatly here.

The other thing to keep in mind is the oil pan. The LS engines came with many differents pans. The truck pans mimick old school SBC style but hang kinda low. The F-body pans are lower profile but extend further forward. Research will have to be done for your application.

The best part about the internet is that almost any combination you can think of for any swap has been done or tried, so a little research can go a long way towards planning your swap.

I tried to use accurate pricing for this writeup. Obviously some parts can be found cheaper or more expensive, these are just my findings. If you have trouble locating a part in the same price range, feel free to contact me for help.

Good luck guys and don't get discouraged, these swaps are not that hard and they are great when finished.


Feel free to contact me via PM, in this thread or via email

Randy@YatesEFI.com


Some pics of a few of my swaps and misc:



Click the image to open in full size.

Click the image to open in full size.

Click the image to open in full size.



This is how I buy the engines...right from the junkyard

Click the image to open in full size.


after cleanup and some paint....

Click the image to open in full size.
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Old 03-03-2009, 07:16 PM   #3
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what kind/color paint is that? its pretty sharp looking
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Old 03-03-2009, 07:26 PM   #4
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I definitely appreciate you taking the time to write all of this up, I'm sure that it'll help to answer a number of questions that n00bs will have.

With that said, I'm thinking that it would be a REALLY good idea to re-size the one large truck picture - having it in there has extended the text off the edges of my screen - and I'm running at 1152x864! (I just copied & pasted the text into a text reader that I have, which then wrapped it correctly for my screen.)

I'm absolutely not taking anything away from your work - I just think that it would be considerably more readable (& helpful) if you made that one small change.
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Old 03-03-2009, 07:31 PM   #5
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I didn't even realize that pic was that huge...removed it

Thank you
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Old 03-03-2009, 07:32 PM   #6
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you are the person i need to talk to. i am in the process of doing this to my 62 chevy II right now! Im currently looking for a 4.8, 5.3, 5.7, or a 6.0 engine, tranny, and pcm/harness. i cant wait to start on mine. my goal is just a nice street car thats fuel injected and has overdrive. how much more do you think it will cost for the overdrive?
great post btw
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Old 03-03-2009, 07:38 PM   #7
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I have seen combo's with the 5.3 engine and 4l60E in the $1000-1200 range. Then you don't need the trans adapter and bolts so take $50 away from the swap. Buy one of those, pick up an LS1 intake off of here and a decent harness and you will have a great running vehicle. Small cam and converter and a light 62 Chevy II would probably go low 12's or better
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Old 03-03-2009, 07:41 PM   #8
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as soon as i find one at that price i will buy it cash! will the truck intake fit under a small cowl hood? if so i will just use it.
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Old 03-03-2009, 07:50 PM   #9
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Great write up. I prefer the lost cost look over the (street and performance catalog) crowd.
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Old 03-03-2009, 08:33 PM   #10
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fantastic thread! thanks!
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Old 03-03-2009, 08:47 PM   #11
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That was a GREAT write up...I 'm using the truck pan, but the more I look, the more I lean toward scalping 2-3" off the bottom. I also agree on the wiring harness...I have an F car harness, but I'm convinced that the aftrmarket harness will look tons better, for far less hassle.Thanks again.....
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Old 03-03-2009, 08:59 PM   #12
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Nice write up! Now I see where that intake went to that I sold ya! I also agree with you on the fact that the LS1 5.7 engines are so overpriced. You can easily get a 5.3 or 6.0 iron or aluminum to perform at the same levels for so much cheaper!
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Old 03-03-2009, 09:31 PM   #13
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You Are The Man

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Old 03-03-2009, 09:36 PM   #14
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Great write-up MeanYellowZ! Now I know how you put that orange swb together so quick. According to this post, the TBSS stock manifolds fit great in the 67-72's: http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...68#post3178668

Any chance you could post some pics of your fab'd alternator brackets?
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Old 03-03-2009, 10:54 PM   #15
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Saved for when I do this in a few years.
Awesome.
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Old 03-03-2009, 11:46 PM   #16
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Quote:
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Great write-up MeanYellowZ! Now I know how you put that orange swb together so quick. According to this post, the TBSS stock manifolds fit great in the 67-72's: http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...68#post3178668

Any chance you could post some pics of your fab'd alternator brackets?

Great info on another set of manifolds...never even thought of these...thanks!

I am doing a 72 conversion for a guy right now and I'm going to duplicate the power steering and alt mounts I did on my last 69 C-10 conversion. I will try and take more pics this time.....
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Old 03-03-2009, 11:58 PM   #17
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what kind/color paint is that? its pretty sharp looking

i painted a few engines with that graphite wheel paint...held up well and looked pretty neat
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Old 03-03-2009, 11:58 PM   #18
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Awesome thread. I am doing this in my 89 camaro (6.0, cammed, and S400 turbo). I am also going to do this in a 67-87 chevy pickup when I find one I like.
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Old 03-04-2009, 12:03 AM   #19
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Quote:
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Nice write up! Now I see where that intake went to that I sold ya! I also agree with you on the fact that the LS1 5.7 engines are so overpriced. You can easily get a 5.3 or 6.0 iron or aluminum to perform at the same levels for so much cheaper!


yeah, thanks again for the intake, I have QUITE a collection of truck intakes laying around!
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Old 03-04-2009, 01:19 AM   #20
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Excellent info! Thanks for posting this. I am about to attempt my first swap soon [probably fall of this year] and this info should help immensely!!
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Old 03-04-2009, 01:19 AM
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