coils you are using on you 1000-1200ho combos
12-09-2015, 09:40 PM
#1
TECH Enthusiast
Thread Starter
coils you are using on you 1000-1200ho combos It is mostly street and will have a holley dominator to control the ignition but what coils for reliability and HP. let the arguments begin. LOL
I know people are going to smart coils but are they proven to be reliable.
I know people are going to smart coils but are they proven to be reliable.
12-10-2015, 12:01 AM
#3
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You are going to get a lot of search responses. Its pretty much been talked about a million times but stock ones work fine. If you want to get "fancy" get a $100 set of used truck coils with the heat sinks and call it a day. Move on to something way more important.
12-10-2015, 01:25 PM
#5
Unless you're talking alcohol or a ton of water injection, the OEM D-585 coils put out more spark that you would ever need at those levels.
Square LS1 units put out 40 milliamps of peak secondary current with 5 milliseconds of dwell time. D585 is 120 milliamps at 4 milliseconds of dwell time ( all @ 14v. )
Square LS1 units put out 40 milliamps of peak secondary current with 5 milliseconds of dwell time. D585 is 120 milliamps at 4 milliseconds of dwell time ( all @ 14v. )
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12-11-2015, 09:36 AM
#9
I'll say that going from the square coils to the D-585 allowed me to open my gap up to .025 from .019 and made a noticeable idle difference. Also when injecting 18gph or so of 50/50 water/meth I lost almost 3 mph with the square coils. Gained it all back with the D-585.
12-13-2015, 04:51 AM
#14
9 Second Club
I've seen no real evidence to suggest 585's are any better than say 514, 510 etc etc.
Plus the 585 is the only one to prematurely fire if you dwell them too much. That's just dangerous.
The very old square LS1's with the cream epoxy are about the least powerful, but even they can do 1k+
Some do say that any spark issues with OEM coils and the Holley are down to the Holley itself though, as others have successfully used stock coils to 2000hp
No idea what Holley could be getting wrong though, as the charging/firing process is incredibly simple. Whether that's an old or current issue though, dont know.
it isnt to say some builds may not benefit from more powerful coils....still havent seen anyone do back to back tests to prove it. I think it was either ZBrown or ForceFed were actually going to test this recently, although other problems prevented it ?
It would definitely be an interesting test.
Plus the 585 is the only one to prematurely fire if you dwell them too much. That's just dangerous.
The very old square LS1's with the cream epoxy are about the least powerful, but even they can do 1k+
Some do say that any spark issues with OEM coils and the Holley are down to the Holley itself though, as others have successfully used stock coils to 2000hp
No idea what Holley could be getting wrong though, as the charging/firing process is incredibly simple. Whether that's an old or current issue though, dont know.
it isnt to say some builds may not benefit from more powerful coils....still havent seen anyone do back to back tests to prove it. I think it was either ZBrown or ForceFed were actually going to test this recently, although other problems prevented it ?
It would definitely be an interesting test.
12-13-2015, 10:38 AM
#15
Indeed. Thankfully all evidence points to the facts that EVERY LS coil is awesome, and capable. None are "bad"
As for dwell time? It wont make any more or less power, but with increased boost and alc based fuels it gets increasingly challenging to light everything off so more spark intensity is required hence the desire to step up dwell and voltage in extreme builds.
Some guys claim to get better manners when running huge injectors to increase plug gap and dwell.
As for dwell time? It wont make any more or less power, but with increased boost and alc based fuels it gets increasingly challenging to light everything off so more spark intensity is required hence the desire to step up dwell and voltage in extreme builds.
Some guys claim to get better manners when running huge injectors to increase plug gap and dwell.
12-13-2015, 12:23 PM
#16
I've seen no real evidence to suggest 585's are any better than say 514, 510 etc etc.
Plus the 585 is the only one to prematurely fire if you dwell them too much. That's just dangerous.
The very old square LS1's with the cream epoxy are about the least powerful, but even they can do 1k+
Some do say that any spark issues with OEM coils and the Holley are down to the Holley itself though, as others have successfully used stock coils to 2000hp
No idea what Holley could be getting wrong though, as the charging/firing process is incredibly simple. Whether that's an old or current issue though, dont know.
it isnt to say some builds may not benefit from more powerful coils....still havent seen anyone do back to back tests to prove it. I think it was either ZBrown or ForceFed were actually going to test this recently, although other problems prevented it ?
It would definitely be an interesting test.
Plus the 585 is the only one to prematurely fire if you dwell them too much. That's just dangerous.
The very old square LS1's with the cream epoxy are about the least powerful, but even they can do 1k+
Some do say that any spark issues with OEM coils and the Holley are down to the Holley itself though, as others have successfully used stock coils to 2000hp
No idea what Holley could be getting wrong though, as the charging/firing process is incredibly simple. Whether that's an old or current issue though, dont know.
it isnt to say some builds may not benefit from more powerful coils....still havent seen anyone do back to back tests to prove it. I think it was either ZBrown or ForceFed were actually going to test this recently, although other problems prevented it ?
It would definitely be an interesting test.
D-585 output peaks right around 5ms. And doesn't produce much more spark energy after 4.5ms or so. When guys were running 5+ms of dwell these coils would fire prematurely. As long as you have the dwell setup properly the coils should not fire prematurely. I run mine at 4.5 at idle and cruise RPM and 4 under any kind of load to be safe.
I can say that I was spraying enough 50/50 water/meth mix to drown out the spark with the square coils. If I shut off my meth inj, I picked up almost 3mph. Since installing the D585 I can run the meth inj without any performance loss and run a wider plug gap which helps my idle.
Most don't run enough boost to have ignition issues and can gap the plug small enough to get by. Stock48 had issues with power dropping off above 24lbs or so on his setup. He thought the combo was maxed out. When he installed the D-585 firecore coils he was able to make 30+lbs with out the power dropping off. Same with Zbrowns setup. He switched to these as well after seeing evidence of spark blow out. They are a little hotter than the OEM 585, but are a drop in style coil.
You can see all the talk about this here...
http://www.yellowbullet.com/forum/sh....php?t=1447722
Last edited by Forcefed86; 12-13-2015 at 12:28 PM.
12-13-2015, 12:41 PM
#17
9 Second Club
That video must be nearly a decade old now, odd he's listing a 580 as what looks like the "round" coil, I use the 514a's which seem the same externally....although I also recently bought 4 more for something else and they were listed as D514c or more notable C1512 which is actually marked on them. Genuine AC Delco boxes this time, and a lot more expensive than the 514a plain box ones on my own car.
I now that my 514's draw more current for any given dwell than 585's from the few I have tested. Whether that means they output more or not I dont know, but it is only a small difference.
The very old original LS1 coils draw only half the amount of current for same dwell. They all seemed to saturate around 4500us anyway
I've heard people say the 585's can fire prematurely as low as 4700us, so I'd say it's risky to even push them to 5ms.
Did Stock48 not go to the IGN-1A coils ?
So far with my cheap ebay plain box although claim to be genuine 514's I've had no noticeable problems even up to 28psi boost on 1km runs
I usually gap around 22-23thou
I now that my 514's draw more current for any given dwell than 585's from the few I have tested. Whether that means they output more or not I dont know, but it is only a small difference.
The very old original LS1 coils draw only half the amount of current for same dwell. They all seemed to saturate around 4500us anyway
I've heard people say the 585's can fire prematurely as low as 4700us, so I'd say it's risky to even push them to 5ms.
Did Stock48 not go to the IGN-1A coils ?
So far with my cheap ebay plain box although claim to be genuine 514's I've had no noticeable problems even up to 28psi boost on 1km runs
I usually gap around 22-23thou
12-13-2015, 06:31 PM
#19
I don't think that statement makes sense. Because U made "X" HP on a coil doesn't mean a better coil couldn't improve performance. The larger plug gap you can run, the more complete the burn will be. The more complete the burn, the more power you'll make. Not to mention better idle and more efficient cruise. The the 585 blows the doors off the stock LS1 coil. If you have a 1300hp setup you could see some serious HP improvement with improved spark. The 585 would drop right in, no reason not to run the best OEM coil you can on a big power setup like that IMO.