bigdsz

iTrader: (1)

I'm finishing up an Erik 408 short block, and I think I may have some valve train geometry issues. That being the case, without getting into all the issues, I decided to call some of our sponsors and non sponsors relating to rocker arm shims to correct my potential valve train geometry problem.

My contacts were interesting to say the least. First I called Crane, nice guy, but tried to sell me adjustable rockers,no help. Next I called Comp Cams, the guy was an idiot, a young kid, that did not understand what my problem was.

Then I called Thunder Racing, who I would have called earlier but they weren't open yet. David did not understand the geometry issue at all but suggested I call Katech. Paul who I have bought many parts from over the years is no longer there, he was great.

I called Katech, and the guy I talked to was oblivious to using spacers, said their engines never would require them since they were built right in the first place and perhaps the cams they use were smaller than the one I was using. I'm obviously paraphrasing, however IMHO this is the premier LSX builder.

TSP was next, I got Jason on the phone, immediately no waiting, and he was the only one to explain the total shim situation. He said that it was necessary to use the Mustang 5.0 shims and would correct my geometry problem. He didn't carry them but said they get them from Jegs.

Well, Jegs only wanted $12 but shipping and handling was an additional $14,**** them.

I called Vinci since the shims were a Crane product, as usual when I have tried to contact them over the past few years they would not take phone calls. Total ******** I will NEVER try to place an order with them again. These are the same people when I was looking into a Crane cam, would NOT give me the specs.

Anyway, I called Crane back and told the guy I needed Mustang shims for a LS1, he didn't understand the application but is sending the order. Hopefully they will work.

I spent over 2 1/2 hours on the phone today trying to find out where I need to be with my valve train geomtery and Jason at TSP was the only to offer a solution. Thanks again Jason!!!

The1N_only

iTrader: (7)

LOL, sounds like a big nut roll to me. Glad you got what you needed

brad8266

iTrader: (23)

This does not belong in this forum.

mrr23

iTrader: (3)

do you have a pushrod length checker? why shim, when you can get the correct length pushrods? unless you are having a wipe pattern issue with the stock rockers, which shimming won't completely solve. look up vettenuts and review some of his posts about the wipe patterns of stock rockers.


if you don't have one, vinci sells it.

http://vincihighperformance.com/TOOL...NT%20PAGE.HTML

i have one.

just guessing at what the issues is, as you didn't want to get into the details in your initial post.


so, everytime you call, they wouldn't take calls, yet you talked to them about a cam?

with them having multiple webpages with listings of the cams they have, i don't see why they wouldn't tell you the specs of a cam. i know of a few other cam people out there, that won't tell you the specs at all, or only after you send them $500.00.

as far as the phone call situation, i'm sure when you called, you heard the message machine and what they are doing with crane cams and when they would return calls.

another note, why are you shimming the rockers up, instead of just getting shorter pushrods?

maybe i missed it, but did you call Erik? after all, he built your shortblock.

bigdsz

iTrader: (1)

Yes, I have a pushrod length checker.Pushrod length has absolutely NOTHING to do with valve train geometry. All it does is change the pre load.

This is the reason I posted up, because some of the most respected sponsors/non sponsors think that pushrods determine the geometry. Not true.

Concerning Vinci, and I'm only bringing them up again because you did, some years ago I went to their shop and met Roger, nice guy. Joe, is another matter, I will reserve further comment.

I knew they were a Crane dealer, and in the late '60's I used to sell cutting oil to Harvey Crane. Great products. Vinci refused to give me any cam specs, They claimed they knew what I needed for my application. Bull ****. I'm a big boy and I'd like to make my own cam decisions. Never returned my calls.

I called about a month ago about their rear steam tube application , only to find that all it is, is a front steam tube connected with tubing and a tee, big deal. No return call.

I ordered the Mustang shims directly from Crane, no middlemen, at noon yesterday and they were delivered this morning. Great service.

FWIW, Erik built my short block and had nothing to do with the valve train.

mrr23

iTrader: (3)

put too short of a pushrod in a non-adjustable valvetrain and tell me they still have nothing to do with geometry. they play an integral part in geometry. especially in adjustable rocker valvetrain.

which bring s me to another point. why make the thread to talk about your valvetrain geometry issue, but not want to give out details of what you are trying to fix? doesn't really help anyone. my guess is wipe pattern issue.

so, you are refering to a conversation from 30+ years ago. ok, got that cleared up.

ok.

good deal. glad they got you all worked out on the shims.

didn't say he did. seeing he built your shortblock, just wondered why not call him as well as all the other vendors you called.

bigdsz

iTrader: (1)

Robert, the issue is not my valve train details, the issue for the last time is the responses I have received to my questions about rocker shims and geometry from supposedly knowledgeable vendors.

I believe my rockers have an intake bias, however I can't be sure because the Caddy lifters I put in aren't pumped up yet. I'm trying to anticipate any shortcomings when I crank it up this weekend. If the swipe needs correcting, better to fix it now by shiming, rather than later.

PM me and I'll give you my phone # if you want to continue the discussion. I'm tired of typing.

mrr23

iTrader: (3)

ok, it's a sponsor review. guess i missed that part of it when you were stating why you called them.

you just made it a point to really dig into vinci over a phone call and bring up something from 30 years ago. yet, you didn't do the same for katech for being completely oblivious to spacers.

i know you have a dislike for vinci. we have butted heads in other threads, when it comes to them.

don't blame you here. better to be prepared, than get caught with your pants down.


don't really want to get into a pissing match over it. but, i'm all for meeting people and getting to know them personally. the internet makes it hard to understand people. i'll PM you my number. hell, if you aren't too far, maybe i can swing by and give you a hand. i'm vain and like to show off my 408 motor.

GrahamHill

iTrader: (6)

Did you get them convinced you knew what your talking about? lol