why no gain??
10-17-2008, 11:12 PM
#1
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why no gain?? Ok I just got done doing my 1.7 scorpion roller rockers swap, I put new hardened push rods, crane double springs, and guide plates, I had the 1.6 gm bowtie roller rockers, but heard that this swap would give me some gain, went back to the track after the swap, and ran the exact same times. And I do mean EXACT. Shouldn't I have gain somehting for this swap at all?? Or is there something else that I need to do??
10-17-2008, 11:48 PM
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From LE himself: "92-96 LT1 heads flow about 210/150 cfm. The 97 model (561 castings) flow 215/160 cfm."
Which would be in the .500 lift area. And if you go by the 5th results here (avg of the above 4), that's pretty close to it.
http://74.125.95.104/search?q=cache:...lnk&cd=1&gl=us
So going from 1.6 (.525) to 1.7 (.558) won't help much :\ I've heard 1.6Int and 1.7Exh isn't a bad way to go though. Since you have both, could always try it.
10-18-2008, 12:11 AM
#6
You can ignore the first 4 posts, frankly they are all bad info. Your lack of gains has nothing to do with the flow of the heads. They are miles from maxed out just because of 1.7 rockers. Head flow does not come in to play here.
You say you ran the same times. What about MPH? Did it go any faster? You should be first looking at the MPH it trapped over the ET it ran. MPH tells whether you lost or gained power. You could have had a worse 60' (spinning) with the new parts or just because of cooler track temps and lack of traction.
You say you ran the same times. What about MPH? Did it go any faster? You should be first looking at the MPH it trapped over the ET it ran. MPH tells whether you lost or gained power. You could have had a worse 60' (spinning) with the new parts or just because of cooler track temps and lack of traction.
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10-18-2008, 12:43 AM
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I had the same E.T same m/p/h and i went back to the track twice and all my time slips from before and after are an exact match. I had no traction issues and temperatures were about the same. I wouldve been happy with at-least 1/10th for the 500 dollars i spent.
10-18-2008, 01:00 AM
#10
I had the same E.T same m/p/h and i went back to the track twice and all my time slips from before and after are an exact match. I had no traction issues and temperatures were about the same. I wouldve been happy with at-least 1/10th for the 500 dollars i spent.
-Valve springs are going to provide little to no gain on a stock cam, unless the stock ones were bad.
-Pushrods at a stockish rpm level are going to have no effect on power.
-Guide plates are just for the pushrods (you already know this)
So yeah it sucks that you spent $500 and gained next to nothing, but it makes sense for the parts added. Hopefully you did your homework and got some springs that would be good for a future cam swap. All your other parts should be, including the pushrods provided you don't surface the heads or deck the block between now and then. It's not wasted money, it was just spent more on supporting mods than power adding ones.
10-18-2008, 01:03 AM
#11
go pp your heads and then look at your times....garuntee they are better!!
fergy you get everyone in here raging because you act like a hardass and you really make yourself look like a dick!!!!!
10-18-2008, 01:13 AM
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Last edited by Cross; 10-18-2008 at 01:27 AM.
10-18-2008, 01:15 AM
#14
Alright man if you want to think I'm a hardass and a dick you can go ahead and keep on thinking that. I'm not going to waste anymore of my time argueing or trying to get you to grasp the point that IF YOU DO NOT KNOW, YOU SHOULD NOT GIVE ADVICE. Bad info is far worse than no info.
You told him he gained nothing by switching to 1.7 rockers because his heads don't flow enough
You told him he gained nothing by switching to 1.7 rockers because his heads don't flow enough
10-18-2008, 01:20 AM
#15
Alright man if you want to think I'm a hardass and a dick you can go ahead and keep on thinking that. I'm not going to waste anymore of my time argueing or trying to get you to grasp the point that IF YOU DO NOT KNOW, YOU SHOULD NOT GIVE ADVICE. Bad info is far worse than no info.
You told him he gained nothing by switching to 1.7 rockers because his heads don't flow enough
You told him he gained nothing by switching to 1.7 rockers because his heads don't flow enough
10-18-2008, 01:37 AM
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for one you dont do mods like this with stock cam!! and when he upgrades his cam he will want to do heads along with that!!! that is not false info!! his heads and cam setup is all wrong right now!! he needs to pp his heads and get a new cam and make sure his numbers all match up!! thats what im saying!! how is that false? you taking it the wrong way or what?
But Fergy, you can't fairly say that if you have maxed out the flow capabilities of heads and throw in more lift (to add more flow and the slightest duration), you will gain something substantial. Only way to achieve that is by higher density of that which you are trying to flow, in this case air. In which you'd need forced induction. As for the valve springs, you really think that? I wouldn't run 1.6s on stock springs! Pretty much everyone here knows that the stock springs are only good for stock 1.5s and stock cam, any upgrade and you put in new springs! Who's giving out bad info?
10-18-2008, 01:40 AM
#18
-1.7 rockers aren't going to gain much over 1.6s. Maybe in the ballpark of 5hp.
-Valve springs are going to provide little to no gain on a stock cam, unless the stock ones were bad.
-Pushrods at a stockish rpm level are going to have no effect on power.
-Guide plates are just for the pushrods (you already know this)
So yeah it sucks that you spent $500 and gained next to nothing, but it makes sense for the parts added. Hopefully you did your homework and got some springs that would be good for a future cam swap. All your other parts should be, including the pushrods provided you don't surface the heads or deck the block between now and then. It's not wasted money, it was just spent more on supporting mods than power adding ones.
-Valve springs are going to provide little to no gain on a stock cam, unless the stock ones were bad.
-Pushrods at a stockish rpm level are going to have no effect on power.
-Guide plates are just for the pushrods (you already know this)
So yeah it sucks that you spent $500 and gained next to nothing, but it makes sense for the parts added. Hopefully you did your homework and got some springs that would be good for a future cam swap. All your other parts should be, including the pushrods provided you don't surface the heads or deck the block between now and then. It's not wasted money, it was just spent more on supporting mods than power adding ones.
those first 4 posts arent bad info!!! just because you upgrade to 1.7s doesnt mean ****!! without good flow it wont matter!!
go pp your heads and then look at your times....garuntee they are better!!
fergy you get everyone in here raging because you act like a hardass and you really make yourself look like a dick!!!!!
go pp your heads and then look at your times....garuntee they are better!!
fergy you get everyone in here raging because you act like a hardass and you really make yourself look like a dick!!!!!
10-18-2008, 01:02 PM
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Ok I just got done doing my 1.7 scorpion roller rockers swap, I put new hardened push rods, crane double springs, and guide plates, I had the 1.6 gm bowtie roller rockers, but heard that this swap would give me some gain, went back to the track after the swap, and ran the exact same times. And I do mean EXACT. Shouldn't I have gain somehting for this swap at all?? Or is there something else that I need to do??